Therapy before Retirement

[Kings over Queens]

Anyone second guess their decision before retiring? "Am I doing it for the wrong reason" type of question?

I like to make decisions after considering all angles, and this is the one that still nags at me.

Wondering if anyone else has felt the same way (I assume many have) and if you did, how did you work it out.

 

[ER Eddie]

Oh sure. I'm a worrier, especially about big decisions like retirement. I second guessed myself right and left, and I pretty much drove my boss crazy with my vacillations (I'm retiring, no I'm not retiring, yes I am retiring, no I'm not...).

I didn't struggle with the "Am I doing it for the wrong reason" question. I knew what my reason was: I wanted more free time, I wanted to be able to fully explore other interests. I was tired of the job, and I wanted to be free of the hassles. I don't think I had any questionable motives for retiring.

In fact, the only questionable motive I had was for continuing to work. I delayed because I was frightened of pulling the plug -- being without a paycheck and without the structure, purpose, and social life that work provided. On the one hand, I knew I was up to the challenge, but on the other, there was a cowardly part of me that wanted to hold back, do "one more year" just to avoid the anxiety of making what felt like such a decisive move.

My main worries circulated around three themes:

1) Do I really have enough money? What if this, what if that?

2) Will I have enough to do in retirement? Or will I end up like one of those losers who just sits around watching TV all day?

3) Will I get socially isolated? Most of my social connections are at work. What if I can't establish new connections outside of work? What if I end up all alone and lonely?


All of these issues have sorted themselves out. I'm about 4 years into retirement now.

Re. the first issue ($), I went through the calculations dozens of times. I also got feedback from this forum. That was very helpful, btw. I encourage you to ask for feedback, if you have financial concerns.

The second issue (activities) was not an issue at all. Finding things to fill my time has not been a problem. I've been surprised with how busy I am, some days.

The third issue (social) has been more challenging, in part because I'm a big introvert who has mostly intellectual, solitary interests, so it's tough to connect to others. But things are moving forward. I've got a decent base of friends and family, and I'm making new connections.

 

[Kings over Queens]

The third issue (social) has been more challenging, in part because I'm a big introvert who has mostly intellectual, solitary interests, so it's tough to connect to others. But things are moving forward. I've got a decent base of friends and family, and I'm making new connections.

Great response, thank you.

I took one of those tests for my daughter when she was in college that told me I'm an extrovert with introvert tendencies. I know hundreds of people but only one or two I am "close" with and that includes family. I get it.

I worried for years about money, all my adult life, was always an issue. Hindsight tells me I shouldn't have, but no regrets. I just don't want to bail on what has been a decent career for the wrong reasons.

A buddy of mine said I'm burnt out, which shocked me. If I am, its not from being overworked or stressed, more from lack of fulfillment and appreciation. I just feel "done" and have lost all interest in work.

 

[Dash man]

No, never second guessed myself about retiring. But I was driven towards early retirement by some health issues that made work miserable. I was also tired of the corporate politics. We hit our number and I gave notice. DW chose to work three more years that added padding to our investments, but that just means the boys will get more.

 

[ut2sua]

Great response, thank you.
I worried for years about money, all my adult life, was always an issue. Hindsight tells me I shouldn't have, but no regrets.

If you were not doing the above, you probably won't be able to get to FI and discussing RE today.

 

[ER Eddie]

I just don't want to bail on what has been a decent career for the wrong reasons.

A buddy of mine said I'm burnt out, which shocked me. If I am, its not from being overworked or stressed, more from lack of fulfillment and appreciation. I just feel "done" and have lost all interest in work.

So, when you say you don't want to retire or leave work for "the wrong reasons," what sort of reasons are you thinking of?

Are you thinking you might be able to change your job somehow, to make it more fulfilling (and so retiring would be premature)? Or are you thinking that your feeling of dissatisfaction with work is temporary, and it might change in the future? Something else?

I'm just trying to get a better sense of what "the wrong reasons" might be for you.

 

[freedomatlast]

I didn't second guess retiring at all. I was sure I was done......forever.

But after being retired awhile, I realized I missed the technological aspect of the work. I missed being around others who enjoyed problem solving and creative solutions. I missed the feeling of reaching the end of a fast paced week and looking forward to a relaxing weekend. I missed the big paychecks coming in. When I was approached about a job with all of the above and no management nonsense, I took it and have never been happier. I call this my encore career. When this is no longer fun, I'll retire again.

The takeaway is go ahead and pull the plug. You can always return to work if it's not all you imagined it would be.

 

[Markola]

Seems like one of those “you know when you know” questions. If therapy is being considered, you don’t know.

 

[Dash man]

I’m drinking a glass of my therapy now .

More seriously, I found fulfillment in activities outside my work, whether through my church, philanthropic activities, reading and learning, family, or whatever life leads you to. You sound like you’re ready for a change.

 

[Kings over Queens]

So, when you say you don't want to retire or leave work for "the wrong reasons," what sort of reasons are you thinking of?

Are you thinking you might be able to change your job somehow, to make it more fulfilling (and so retiring would be premature)? Or are you thinking that your feeling of dissatisfaction with work is temporary, and it might change in the future? Something else?

I'm just trying to get a better sense of what "the wrong reasons" might be for you.

Hard to really say. I could redesign my job if I wanted to. Fairly certain to almost positive I'm not interested in a new or different job or responsibility.

At the same time, can't help but wondering if there isn't something deeper that's causing it. I keep thinking of the old Geico commercial where the patient sitting on the shrink couch says "And that's why yellow makes me sad," and Gunny throws a box of tissues at his head.

Could this be temporary? I don't know. It's going on 2 years and not getting better.

 

[Kings over Queens]

Seems like one of those “you know when you know” questions. If therapy is being considered, you don’t know.

I view the therapy question in the same light as running the firecal reports. You know you've got buckets of money, and you think it will work, but you run the report just the same.

It's more of a due diligence thing. I dunno.

 

[SecondAttempt]

Mid-career I got advice from a senior executive that I have lived with: Make a decision then make it the right decision.

He also advised making decisions when you only had 60% of the information.

While this was advice based on risk tolerance in our company, I think the basic advice about making any decision the right decision is good. Whatever you decide to do, don't undermine yourself!

 

[KimmK451]

I second guessed mine for 5 years and only retired when that last straw fell at work.

 

[big-papa]

About to retire in the next 1's of weeks. The only second guessing I've done so far vs my original plan is that I requested to extend my time a few weeks to grab some last, non-life-altering RSU's that will vest. Last ones for this year and I'm so close anyway, so why not?

That aside, this reminds me of my feelings at the other end of my career. Choosing the first job from among several offers in several cities. Wondering if I made the right choice and quickly figuring out that I didn't and I was miserable. Made the change, including a change of cities. Some of my fears were eased at least a little when I realized that I could change jobs. But the "worst case" thoughts were always there - "What if I don't like THIS job?" "What if nobody's hiring if I need to look for another job?" "I'm just starting out, I don't have much savings, how is this all going to work?".

I'm sure that there will be some similar feelings as I end the career and start retirement. I suspect that these feelings are fairly common and normal to have.

I do get a little annoyed by the constant "What are you planning on DOING once you're retired" from colleagues.

 

[wearefinishedworking]

For me, Retirement IS Therapy!

 

[ER Eddie]

At the same time, can't help but wondering if there isn't something deeper that's causing it. I keep thinking of the old Geico commercial where the patient sitting on the shrink couch says "And that's why yellow makes me sad," and Gunny throws a box of tissues at his head.

lol.

Ok, well, as for "something deeper," you did allude to some deeper issues in your intro, I believe. I think you said something about chasing promotion and the corporate jet lifestyle, but then you suddenly recognized that you really didn't care that much about all that, and it kind of dropped away. Your wife was kind of stunned at the turnabout.

That sounded to me -- potentially anyway, I don't want to read too much into it -- like a pretty big shift in values and motivation. That can be a little disorienting, especially if you were chasing the "success" thing for decades. So maybe you're still processing that, trying to figure out what really matters to you now? Or maybe you're wondering about your career in retrospect (what does it matter, am I accomplishing anything, etc.).

I'm not sure what might be bubbling around in your head; I'm just guessing (maybe projecting a little, too). It just seemed like that shift from caring about "success" to not caring is a potentially big one, in terms of your worldview.

Could this be temporary? I don't know. It's going on 2 years and not getting better.

Yeah, it's not a temporary mood, if it's been going on two years.

I could redesign my job if I wanted to.

So then the question might be, Could you redesign your job in such a way that it made it fulfilling enough to want to stay? Fulfilling enough to delay or forgo retirement? Or are we talking about rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic?

 

[pacergal]

Second guess, maybe. I had the usual concerns doubt how finances will work out, but financial advisors and calculators told me we would be fine.
Retired at 60, so not real early, but I did consider how much more I would have if I worked until 65 my entire last year of work! My job was enjoyable, until it wasn't and too much politics got in the way of taking care of patients. I did work on call off and on for a few years, which gave us a bit of $, but also reinforced the reasons why I left!
We know how to live frugally if needed, not going back to work.

If this has been going on for two years and it still bothers you, perhaps a few therapy sessions might help, and certainly wouldn't hurt.

 

[Kings over Queens]

lol.

Ok, well, as for "something deeper," you did allude to some deeper issues in your intro, I believe. I think you said something about chasing promotion and the corporate jet lifestyle, but then you suddenly recognized that you really didn't care that much about all that, and it kind of dropped away. Your wife was kind of stunned at the turnabout.

That sounded to me -- potentially anyway, I don't want to read too much into it -- like a pretty big shift in values and motivation. That can be a little disorienting, especially if you were chasing the "success" thing for decades. So maybe you're still processing that, trying to figure out what really matters to you now? Or maybe you're wondering about your career in retrospect (what does it matter, am I accomplishing anything, etc.).

I'm not sure what might be bubbling around in your head; I'm just guessing (maybe projecting a little, too). It just seemed like that shift from caring about "success" to not caring is a potentially big one, in terms of your worldview.


So then the question might be, Could you redesign your job in such a way that it made it fulfilling enough to want to stay? Fulfilling enough to delay or forgo retirement? Or are we talking about rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic?

Great observations. It helps to put it out there and then read how someone perceives it. You nailed it, I just needed it read back to me with own eyes. Thanks.

A buddy of mine who also FIRE'd (is that a thing) mentioned me the concept of a "Hobby Job." Something you can do, for fun, get paid, and 101% on your own terms. That would be the job redesigned, should I chose to do it.

 

[Koolau]

I still recall "old timers" retiring and saying "You'll know when it's time." I never really understood. Then one day, megacorp finally realized I was enjoying what I was doing (heh, heh, can't have that!) They told me I had to do something I didn't like. I said "No, I don't. I am retiring at the end of the week."

Turns out, the old timers were right. Of course, YMMV.

 

[Kings over Queens]

Coming back to this thread after 2 months, and whatever hesitation I was feeling is long gone. The running joke in the house is like this.

"how was today?"

"today was the last (insert date) I'll be working."

I'm ready.

Don't know if i mentioned this earlier, about a year ago I had cigar's with an old friend who I hadn't seen in a while...might be 2 years now. He's an C-Suite executive with a big company, big job. His words when I explained what was going on were simply "you're burnt out."

Struck me as odd as I'd always associated burn out with mega hours in stressful situations, which is the furthest thing from my current work life in the last few years. He's explanation was that I couldn't process the reduced work load that happened during covid, that we were wired to be running at 100 miles an hour, when that stopped, our brains which are wired to work, be productive, short circuit.

Whatever the case, whether it be burn out, malaise, wanting something new, I'm ready. I read in Die with Zero that some equate retirement to failure. That could have been rattling around my brain too, but no more. What an amazing accomplishment to be 56 and on the brink of financial independence.

Thanks for the thoughts and participation, it's helpful, and appreciated.