Water meter on neighbor's property

[Camas Lilly]

We live in a house on the corner, no subdivision, gravel road. Our water meter is on our side of the road in the yard. The people across the street (Neighbor #2) actually own that little sliver of the yard where our water meter is. The road has been there many years and the same for the meter. No easements I don't believe. We are having issue with an old man (Neighbor #3) driving off the side of the road in the mud (trying to change drainage off the edge of the road) which is widening the road in our direction, but now he is up to our meter. Do we have any legal right to try to protect the meter from being driven on? We just placed a couple of boulders on each side of it in the lawn, but the land owner (Neighbor #2) is not happy. We maintain that piece, but it is still his property even though it is on our side of the road. It is also getting harder to mow with all the ruts neighbor #3 is putting in it.

Neighbor #3 has been spoken to, but he is just a drunk old man whom we have decided really doesn't know what he is doing, nor does he really care.

What can we do?

 

[Jerry1]

Doesn’t the city/township own the water meter? If so, why would you care as long as you’re comfortable they will fix it in short order if it gets damaged.

Also, I forget the term, but at some point if you keep using and maintaining the land your meter is on, can’t you claim ownership of it.

Personally, I’d find a way to not care. If the rocks work, just leave them there. If the neighbor cares, I guess they can remove them. At which time, I’d put another one down.

ETA - Adverse Possession

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

We live in a house on the corner, no subdivision, gravel road. Our water meter is on our side of the road in the yard. The people across the street (Neighbor #2) actually own that little sliver of the yard where our water meter is. The road has been there many years and the same for the meter. No easements I don't believe. We are having issue with an old man (Neighbor #3) driving off the side of the road in the mud (trying to change drainage off the edge of the road) which is widening the road in our direction, but now he is up to our meter. Do we have any legal right to try to protect the meter from being driven on? We just placed a couple of boulders on each side of it in the lawn, but the land owner (Neighbor #2) is not happy. We maintain that piece, but it is still his property even though it is on our side of the road. It is also getting harder to mow with all the ruts neighbor #3 is putting in it.

Neighbor #3 has been spoken to, but he is just a drunk old man whom we have decided really doesn't know what he is doing, nor does he really care.

What can we do?

This is quite dependent on where you live and the law. Best bet is to probably call you water company and ask them as they *probably* own the meter and have an easement for it.

 

[Camas Lilly]

We are in the unincorporated county.

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

We are in the unincorporated county.

Nonetheless, there are laws and there is a water company, correct?

 

[calmloki]

Heh. Some years back we had a little rental house with miserable tenants that I was having a real problem moving on down the road. They were, among other things, stealing power by pulling the power meter after getting power shut off and removing the little insulating "condoms" that blocked the power from going through. They also just turned the water back on at the meter when it got shut off. Wasn't getting any help getting them gone. Until, one fine day when I went over and found they had smashed the water meter glass when turning it back on. I reported same, and son of a gun - there were cops there that afternoon and the tenants moved within a few days.. City took damage to their stuff kinda personal. The Drano sprinkled around the trees, the campfire in the middle of the garage, the motorcycle rebuild in the middle of the carpet; stuff like that, that was our problem, but a damaged city owned water meter? Police presence.

 

[bigcmagor]

Pursuing an adverse possession claim would probably be successful, but won't endear you to your neighbor who thinks he needs to defend his sliver. I'm sure the meter can be moved and probably will after it gets smashed by the drunk.

 

[cyber888]

Well, you are paying the water company for water, aren't you? So, maybe you can make a written request to transfer the water meter and state your concerns about it being outside your property.

 

[JRon]

Agree that the water company probably owns the meter and will get involved if damage is done.

Not an attorney, but doesn’t adverse possession require the landowner to be un-accepting of the use of the land? In this situation it sounds like the landowner knows about the meter and is accepting of it being there.

 

[pb4uski]

I'm guessing that the water company has an easement of some sort.... I can't believe that they would just plunk down a water meter on private property. I'd call the water company and express concern and let them handle it.

Otherwise, what about some pre-made concrete curbing along the edge of the road? It might keep neighbor #2 happy that you are trying to avoid damage to his property that your water meter happens to be on... and once the old drunk neighbor #3 runs into the curb with his car a few times maybe he'll learn to stay on the road.... or if he damages his car then perhaps he'll learn to care.

 

[pb4uski]

Agree that the water company probably owns the meter and will get involved if damage is done.

Not an attorney, but doesn’t adverse possession require the landowner to be un-accepting of the use of the land? In this situation it sounds like the landowner knows about the meter and is accepting of it being there.

Yes, adverse possession needs to be adverse... against the wishes of the owner... in this case it seems like neighbor #2 has given permission for the water meter to be there... ergo, the OP/water company's use is not adverse.

 

[pb4uski]

Pursuing an adverse possession claim would probably be successful...

Probably not. See above.

 

[Camas Lilly]

I'm guessing that the water company has an easement of some sort.... I can't believe that they would just plunk down a water meter on private property. I'd call the water company and express concern and let them handle it.

Otherwise, what about some pre-made concrete curbing along the edge of the road? It might keep neighbor #2 happy that you are trying to avoid damage to his property that your water meter happens to be on... and once the old drunk neighbor #3 runs into the curb with his car a few times maybe he'll learn to stay on the road.... or if he damages his car then perhaps he'll learn to care.

LOL, If I had my way, he would probably already had damage to his tires. DH is the only sensible one here.

 

[Camas Lilly]

I think as long as both parties know, and are in agreement, the property does not change hands. We continue to maintain because he really doesn't want to maintain. What doesn't help is he (Neighbor #2) is drinking buddies with Neighbor 3.

This is an old farm that was surveyed and split up 40-50 years ago with a private road accessing all 13 homes. I know I have always heard the surveyor was probably drunk, but DH has reminded me that the road is also not in the correct place. It should also curve down into our yard some, which puts the meter in the roadway.

I think the best thing is just hope the (very large) rocks protect the meter and let the old man do what he has to do. He certainly won't be driving over the meter now. He was flipping the smaller rocks up onto the meter, so we were forced to do something. DH says if Neighbor 3 gets Neighbor 2 to remove the rocks, we'll go ahead and mark our property line, let Neighbor 2 start maintaining his property and call the water company at that point. It is just going to make our place look bad though because it looks like part of our yard. It is about 5'-10' x 150' along the road and it's kind of triangular shaped. Stretches about half the length of our road frontage. We are also hoping to list and move in the next year or so, so it is probably in our best interest to try to keep the peace for now.

 

[Camas Lilly]

LOL. Neighbor #4 just came down to inspect where we put the rocks he dontated. Says we should have done the whole strip. Also said Neighbor #3 is doing the same thing all the way down the road even in front of his house. I have to say my SM said I should call the police and say how concerned we are that the neighbor looks like his having trouble driving.

 

[zinger1457]

Is the gravel road you're on a public road maintained by the county or is it private? My guess is it's probably private since it's gravel. I also live in an unincorporated part of a county and the county has an easement on all land within ~10 ft of the public roads that they maintain, that doesn't apply for private roads. If I want to put up a fence or build anything on my property I have to stay away from that easement. I had an issue years ago where a neighbor, who thought he was being helpful, tried to create a water drainage channel along the side of the road, in the process he buried my water meter and shutoff valve in 2' of dirt. I contacted the county and they sent someone out to get it resolved. If your road is private not sure the county will do much, may have to deal directly with the water company.

 

[folivier]

Only problem I can see is if he causes damage to your water pipe by pushing or moving the meter box some. Then it would be at your expense to get it fixed. I would think the water company owns up to the box and you own the connection to the box back to your house.
I agree to call the sheriff to report the erratic driving and that he is driving while intoxicated. If he is he is a danger to others.

 

[SecondCor521]

Another idea is for you to look into buying that triangle sliver patch of land from neighbor #2 and make it part of your property. Then the water meter would be on your property, and you could do what you like (curbing, fence, rumble strips) to address drunk neighbor #3.

 

[timo2]

This is quite dependent on where you live and the law. Best bet is to probably call you water company and ask them as they *probably* own the meter and have an easement for it.

+1 What does the water company say?

 

[Sunset]

Long time ago, a relative living out in the country in his trailer home, had a problem with the neighbor up the "road" driving past but going up on the grass many time.

It chewed up the front lawn a lot.
So my relative put some metal rebar a foot to 1.5 feet into the ground and left 3 inches sticking up. Then cut it off at an angle.

The driving seemed to improve with the new tires the neighbor had to buy.

 

[rk911]

We are in the unincorporated county.

call whatever agency delivers and bills you for water. let them know their meter is in jeopardy and ask for guidance.

 

[bigcmagor]

Probably not. See above.

Not a lawyer here but dealt with many similar issues over the years. Perhaps the term for this situation is a prescriptive easement (have been involved with both). Basically, once allowed to utilize private property for a period of time, a prescriptive easement is established which allows for continued use, even if the legal owner wishes to discontinue the practice. Either way, once you lawyer up, you won't be exchanging Christmas cookies with the neighbor any longer so I agree with those suggesting the water company handle it. Whatever keeps the relative peace is best.

 

[pb4uski]

I suspect that the water company has an easement of some sort... IME utilities won't do anything on private property unless they have an easement.

I don't think that the water company or the OP would acquire any rights because in this case presumably neighbor #2 has granted permission for the water meter to be there if the water company doesn't have an easement and he has also given the OP permission to cut the grass et al.

If the property owner grants permission, then adverse possession or prescriptive easement can't happen.... if the property owner didn't know then it is a different story.

A prescriptive easement is an easement upon another's real property acquired by continued use without permission of the owner for a legally defined period. State law, which varies by state, defines the time period required to acquire a prescriptive easement.

Rights to use someone else's real estate without the voluntary transfer of the right from the true owner come in two flavors: Adverse Possession and Prescriptive Easements. Although similar, there are distinct differences, and courts approach them much differently.

Adverse possession involves the involuntary transfer of property from the true owner to the adverse possessor provided the adverse possessor can show that for ten consecutive years the true owner's property had been possessed in a manner that was: (1) open and notorious; (2) actual and uninterrupted, (3) exclusive, and (4) hostile. ...

A prescriptive easement, on the other hand, arises when a claimant has used someone elses's property for a specific purpose. These can often be roadways, driveways or walkways.

For a court to find a prescriptive easement, the claimant must show (1) that the claimant used the land in an “open” and “notorious” manner, (2) the use was “continuous” or “uninterrupted,” (3) the use occurred over a “uniform route,” (4) the use was “adverse” to the landowner, and (5) the use occurred “with the knowledge of such owner at a time when he was able in law to assert and enforce his rights.” ...

 

[Camas Lilly]

Is the gravel road you're on a public road maintained by the county or is it private? My guess is it's probably private since it's gravel. I also live in an unincorporated part of a county and the county has an easement on all land within ~10 ft of the public roads that they maintain, that doesn't apply for private roads. If I want to put up a fence or build anything on my property I have to stay away from that easement. I had an issue years ago where a neighbor, who thought he was being helpful, tried to create a water drainage channel along the side of the road, in the process he buried my water meter and shutoff valve in 2' of dirt. I contacted the county and they sent someone out to get it resolved. If your road is private not sure the county will do much, may have to deal directly with the water company.

Yes, it is a private Road.

 

[Camas Lilly]

Only problem I can see is if he causes damage to your water pipe by pushing or moving the meter box some. Then it would be at your expense to get it fixed. I would think the water company owns up to the box and you own the connection to the box back to your house.
I agree to call the sheriff to report the erratic driving and that he is driving while intoxicated. If he is he is a danger to others.

That is what DH is worried about. I have no idea how much something like that might cost to fix. He has experience with utilities and homeowners so is fairly well versed on what we can and cannot do.