When to Give Notice

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RobotMom

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My last official day at my job will be July 31, 2021. I will have between 5 and 8 weeks of leave saved - so my "actual" last day will be 5 to 8 weeks earlier. My employer requires two months notice for retirement - meaning the latest I could give notice is June 1, 2021. However, if I have, say 8 weeks saved, that could mean, I'm gone two weeks after I give notice.

Of course, after 37 years I think I owe the company more than that. So, when should I give notice? One month earlier (May 1)? What is the ethical thing to do while also doing the right thing for me?

I do not plan to ever need to come back for consulting. Once I walk out the door, I'm gone for good. So I guess I don't really care about burning bridges.

I haven't even given a hint that I'm thinking about retiring so the first inkling my boss will have is the day I put in my notice and tell her. I know things will change once I anounce my pending retirement and I don't want to live in that world for very long if I can avoid it.

So tell me, how long before you retired did you give notice? And do you feel like it was the right amount of notice? If so or if not, why?
 
After 36 1/2 years, my company notified me I was retiring the next day. (All 55 and older employees were sent home with a very substantial termination package in 2008.) Best thing to happen to us. Had I worked in Home Office, a H/R person and 2 guards would have shown up at my desk and escorted me to the door. It was nothing personal.

People today don't owe the employers any more "time."

But if you gave 2 months' notice, it should be more than sufficient.
 
Bamaman, I was kind of thinking the same thing. If my company thought it was time for me to go, I'd be escorted out that day. If they can do it, I guess I can do the same. I don't owe them anything.
 
A U.S. company cannot "require" two months notice for a resignation or retirement unless you have an actual contract with them, which is rare. I'm guessing the two months is the amount of time it will take them to transition you from the regular benefit plans into their retirement benefit plans, and that's why they ask for that much time.

If you are 100% sure that they will pay out your accrued leave, and you have a good relationship with your manager and know you won't be pushed out earlier than you want to go, then I'd say about 6 weeks before your last actual day of work. If you don't want to cope with a 6-week notice period, then really, 2 weeks is fine and perfectly ethical.
 
Right. The two months is to get a person on the retirement plan. And I am 100% sure I will get paid my accrued leave, fortunately.
 
RobotMom said:
So tell me, how long before you retired did you give notice? And do you feel like it was the right amount of notice? If so or if not, why?
Click to expand...



Same deal I gave a months notice but I had a months vacation coming... it was over the Christmas holidays so I actually finished everything and gave them 2 weeks work and took 2 weeks vacation .

“Of course, after 37 years I think I owe the company more than that.” I watched the company lay-off high earners with 20 plus years with the firm like it was nothing. IMHO you owe the company nothing - your colleagues you don’t want to leave high and dry.

Every time you get your paycheck the relationship starts new. Loyalty is long gone. I last 36 years but many just as good did not.
 
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Depends upon the job, relationship with supervisors (if any), and how much your co-workers will have to scramble to replace/make up for your departure.

DW and I gave far longer notice than is possible for you at this point. But, we were in small professional workplaces and she, in particular, was going to take a long time to replace. Many others have given very little, as they were with mega-corps that treated their employees as widgets....

Sounds like you are in a big organization and a month or two would be sufficient.
 
Thank you for the link. I tried searching but didn't know what terms to use in the search! I was sure that this has been discussed before on here but just couldn't find it!
 
Do you have a specialized job that needs to be turned over to someone, or they need to hire someone with fairly unique talents? Maybe you could do something like work a day each week? That way someone could take over your job and you could come back a day each week to answer any questions.
 
RobotMom said:
Thank you for the link. I tried searching but didn't know what terms to use in the search! I was sure that this has been discussed before on here but just couldn't find it!
Click to expand...

NP, sometimes it's the simplest things. I searched "when to give notice" to find that old link. You'll probably find a lot of similar threads and a lot of different perspective from members.
 
I would definitely take the time to read through the old threads that Aerides linked. In today's environment, even the best-intentioned managers can be "overridden" by higher ups, or by HR, Legal, etc., leaving you holding the proverbial bag.
 
Do not give notice unless you are prepared to be ushered out the same day, or be "cut off" from your work projects immediately. Sometimes people overestimate their value to their company. If you are fine with that, then do it as far in advance as you desire.
 
I agree with jollystomper, if there is any slack in the system where management has to reduce headcount, you may be out immediately. So I would make sure to give two weeks or less notice and make sure you are in the month that you actually intend to retire as the company may decide to save a month's insurance. We had a really good employee talk about retirement coming in the next 2-4 years - who you suppose got let go in the COVID downturn?
 
I've told my story before. I'd been FI for several years but had created my own position which I loved. After 36 years, on a Friday, I was informed they had done away with my position and I would be doing something else - essentially going back to what I'd started out doing all those years ago. Ironically this was the long Labor Day weekend. SO, Tuesday, I informed my boss that Friday, that week, would be my last day. (My accrued vacation would take me through the end of the month - and because I liked my boss, I told him to call me or even ask me back in if needed.)

There was a time I might have felt some loyalty to my company which would have caused me to worry about notice. No more! Company was loyal to company and I had learned to be loyal to myself - and, to an extent, my decent boss. You gotta do what you gotta do, so YMMV.
 
RobotMom said:
... So tell me, how long before you retired did you give notice? And do you feel like it was the right amount of notice? If so or if not, why?
Click to expand...

Does your leave need to be used before your last day or would any unpaid leave just be added to your final paycheck? I'm unsure if an employer can "require" 2 months notice unless you have an employment contract, and even then it might not be worth the paper it is written on.

In any event, you'll be in the driver's seat in you can stay a little longer if you feel generous, or walk out the door if you don't.

Here's my story: I had signaled my intent 6 years before I left when I was 50 and at a firm conference having breakfast with the boss one morning before the morning sessions. We are good friends and had a good working relationship. We were just chit-chatting and he casually asked what I was thinking in terms of retiring. Knowing I was FI at the time but having 55 in mind I responded "Oh, I dunno, somewhere between 0 and 5 years I think". He just about choked on his OJ and we had a good laugh about it. :D

So when we're doing annual performance plans and the standard question of where I saw myself if 5 years would come up I'd just wink at him and ask if he really wanted me to answer that... and then we'd just put down some BS to keep HR happy.

Then the great recession hit and I actually ended up staying a year longer than I planned. In 2011 we moved into our former vacation home and sold our main home and the stars lined up for me to retire... the proceeds from the main home sale in the bank and our expenses were lower because we then only had one home. The house sale closed in early November.

I had about 8 weeks of vacation, and any unused vacation would be paid in my final paycheck, and a very good relationship with my employer and my boss. I talked with my boss soon after the house closing and said that I would be leaving the firm but that I wanted to do it the "right" way where we both ended with good feelings about my leaving... I didn't want to leave them high and dry with any client work that I was doing but at the same time I had no interest in staying longer than they needed me for a smooth transition. At the time I was prepared to walk out that day or stay as much as six months if necessary... but sooner was better than later. He appreciated my position and left it totally up to me to make arrangements with our practice leader and key partners who I worked with regularly, which I did.

I ended up negotiating a March 1, 2012 end date with HR. The magic to March 1 was that I was eligible for employer sponsored health insurance for the whole month of March since I was on payroll on March 1.

My last day of work was the last work day before Christmas in 2011.... I enjoyed the holidays and was on "vacation" from then until March 1, 2012... during that time I still had my laptop and kept up with emails, answered the phone if it rang, participated in occasional calls with clients when asked, etc.... the sort of stuff that I would do if I was on vacation... but i didn't take on any new projects. In late February DW and I flew to NYC and the firm sponsored a very nice, well attended retirement party for me with open bar and appetizers that went well into the night. A few days later I wrote a nice email to my colleagues saying good-bye and thanking a handful of people who helped make my 13 years with the firm truly extraordinary and I turned my laptop into our local office the next day.... and that was that.

I'm not sure how I could have done it any better.
 
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I worried about this issue a great deal. I wanted to be fair to the company and fair to myself. I thought a month seemed too short and 2 months too long so I decided on 6 weeks.
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There were no pensions or anything tied to the timing. What i decided is I wanted to be gone by Memorial Day and I backed up 6 weeks from there. They paid out my leave. I did not consider a leave period as part of the notice. I scheduled a trip right after my final day so they could not easily ask for more time.

I got it about right I think and I think the company agreed. It went quickly. I left on good terms and importantly, I left on my own terms.

Exciting time!
 
I also wanted to give a longer notice and a longer resignation letter. After discussing it with other FIREees, I gave two weeks' notice and my letter of resignation was three or four brief sentences.

I originally wanted to retire at the end of the project I was working on. That would have been an error because the project was continually being delayed and it actually got canceled about a month before I left anyway.

I thought giving them longer notice would give them a chance to more smoothly transition things. I've read many stories here and elsewhere and the common pattern is the employer waits until the week or two before you leave anyway, and frequently asks you to stay on longer because they hadn't found anyone to replace you yet.

Another thing is that once you give notice, if it is a long time then things can get really awkward for you and your coworkers. You're there and they're paying you, but you can be shunned because everyone knows you'll be gone soon, so why bother asking your opinion or involving you in meetings or projects or even inviting you to lunch. You're sort of supposed to work, but everyone knows you don't really have to do anything. Managers may be suspicious about sharing company private information because maybe you'll share it with your new employer (even if you're retiring - everyone thought I was going to a competitor because I retired at age 46 which is too young). You will soon feel like a zombie - you're there but you're not there.

You have valuable insights and information gleaned over your 37 years; organizations will typically let that information walk right out the door and they'll recreate roughly the same thing with other people. This is unwise but the way most large organizations work.

I actually like the way I left: I took a 12 week leave of absence, and then emailed in my 2 week notice after 10 weeks of my LOA and the day after I exercised my last good batch of stock options. It was a trial retirement, and I also kept some employer benefits while on leave. Plus I got to avoid the going away stuff which I dislike anyway. And I got to stealth remove my personal effects from my office and return all my company property without anyone noticing or caring.

...

On the resignation letter, I originally wanted to do a lot of explaining. With the exception of one executive VP, nobody really cared why I was leaving. They just need a piece of paper to put in my HR file (which they probably archived after I left anyway) and a date to calculate the last paycheck and end of benefits.
 
I would just give the 2 weeks. There most likely would not be loyalty on the other side, plus do you intend to stay in touch with work folks after leaving.
 
As others have said, you need to be prepared to be shown the door immediately upon giving notice. Only write a formal letter if you think you have to. I've only ever done that once and it was extremely brief.

Even if your immediate supervisor is on your side, others in the company may not be and, perhaps for the silliest of reasons, may want you out as soon as possible. I can't tell you the number of times, as a manager, I've sat in meetings where we were discussing layoffs and a single, what should be throw-away comment from a manager not really connected to a certain employee, was all it took to put somebody on the list.
 
And I learned the hard way that a verbal conversation with your manager about when you plan to leave is just as iron clad of a resignation as written notice, so don’t have that conversation until you are certain.
 
Like others have said, I’d give 2-4 weeks notice and no more, whether you appreciate your employer or not. Lots of people think they’re irreplaceable, no one is. Even though you may like your boss or some co-workers, everyone will know and some will try to make you miserable while you’re still there. I gave my boss 3 months notice and asked him to keep it to himself until 4 weeks before I left. He waited a few days and announced I was retiring company wide. Most people were happy for me, others were jealous, treated me like a lame duck, some started angling for my job or other jobs before I left - it wasn’t fun...
 
If it takes two months to get on the retiree health plan, then it sounds like that is the standard notice at your office.
I formally notified HR about 2 months out also, but my office knew a year in advance:LOL:
 
RobotMom said:
Bamaman, I was kind of thinking the same thing. If my company thought it was time for me to go, I'd be escorted out that day. If they can do it, I guess I can do the same. I don't owe them anything.
Click to expand...

You seem to be overlooking the fact that Bamaman received a very generous exit package from the company. He was well taken care of.

Does your company offer any sort of exit package to long term employees who are RIF'd (not due to performance issues)? If so, when you say that "you can do the same" are you planning on treating them reciprocally by giving them an exit package when you leave?

I'm always amazed when folks describe their unplanned exit from a company during which they receive a nice package as being "walked out the door that day" and express ill feelings. Back in 2006, the guy from HR came to my desk, asked me to pack up, and walked me to the door. Then I got a check for a year of pay, medical benefits for a year and retiree health benefits for life (some of which have been clawed back). It's really hard for me to wish them ill given the entire departure situation, despite being escorted from the building the same day I was told. Not having these ill feelings hanging over my head in retirement has been a positive to my general enjoyment of my first 16 years of retirement.

Read and understand your company's published retirement policy. Follow it. Don't let small matters, such as being told you'll continue to be paid until your official last day but don't need to actually come into the office, bug you. Or, alternatively, if asked to stick around some reasonable period of time to complete some well defined tasks, try to accommodate. To whatever extent you can minimize reasons to feel bitter and maximize reasons to be proud of your career accomplishments and the company where you chose to work, the more your retirement will be enhanced.
 
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