Why were so many smart members of FIRE so clueless about their careers?

Thanks, I kind of understood that. But, I was wondering what the IT people might peck out on their computers: I'd like to see a line or two of what they actually do type. And, as long as I'm asking, is it common to be in a cube when you're working? Is a goal to have a cube of your own, or is it a goal to share a cube? How many people can work in a cube? I really know very little about this.

Cubes are common at Megacorp. They're usually solo cubes unless the company is cutting costs, in which case you're paired up (or worse).

Here's an example of what one sub-species of "IT" might peck.

cd ~
ls -alt
less apache_access.1.log


I usually tele-commute (and contract) now so I avoid the cube culture.
 
I do remember one aptitude assesment in Jr. HS that recommended farming. Farming!? Yuk!

Probably the same test told me that a career as a gas pumper was in my future. In the 80s, that wasn't a "career" anymore (except maybe in OR and NJ). I guess they hadn't updated the test results.
 
Wow, gas pumper. That must've been inspiring. I got hotel manager myself. Why hotels rather than restaurants or offices, I don't know. I never had any interest in either hotels or management, so I'm not sure how it came up with that.
 
Wow, gas pumper. That must've been inspiring.

Sheesh. Just tell the kid "The best you're ever gonna be is a ditch-digger." Yup, set your sights high.

Actually, pumping gas in HS was an incentive for me to go to college. There was a guy in his late 50's working alongside me and I sure didn't want to become him.
 
Next week 2 of my kids are being tested at Johnson O'Conner. This is aptitude testing:

Johnson O'Connor Research Foundation

My son is about half way through college and has changed his major several times. He is now on his second go round of some of his potential majors. I am hoping that this testing will help him to find an area to focus on.

My daughter is soon to graduate high school and knows what she doesn't want to do (she doesn't like purely academic work and knows she doesn't want to earn a 4 year degree), but she doesn't know what she does want to do. She wants to take a career focused program at community college but for that she needs to decide which career.
I took Johnson O'Connor aptitude tests when I was 18 (many, many moons ago) and paid for my kids to take it when they were the same age. After reviewing their results the JO people offered to look up mine and go over it with me. That was a lot of fun and also very educational. Well worth the money.
 
Ever since I was in my 20s I had planned on retiring before 60 and fine tuned that to 57 as I got closer - with the economic bust and the great sequestration this got changed to 55. For about the last year I have been testing retirement - taking the time to down size everything and get a feel of it all. I have received a few tempting offers to go back, but so far nothing that makes me want to give up my new found freedom... Only time will tell for sure...
 
Sheesh. Just tell the kid "The best you're ever gonna be is a ditch-digger." Yup, set your sights high.


LOL.... this reminds me of a story my sis told me...


She was a teacher... there was one of her students where some teachers said that the guy was going to grow up to be a ditch digger....


Many years later, he came to school with his kid... he talked to my sis... she asked him what he was doing and he laughed.... he said "I am a ditch digger!!!"..... except that he was an operator of a big drag line or back hoe (do not know what he operated, making a guess here).... paid very well from what I understand...
 
Thanks, I kind of understood that. But, I was wondering what the IT people might peck out on their computers: I'd like to see a line or two of what they actually do type. And, as long as I'm asking, is it common to be in a cube when you're working? Is a goal to have a cube of your own, or is it a goal to share a cube? How many people can work in a cube? I really know very little about this.

As one of the previous posters replied, IT = Information Technology. Basically, what I do is...I'm in charge of several large systems at work that help our Customer Support organization manage support cases our customers have open with us. All the "screens" and processes they use to open cases, change data in cases, add comments to cases, close cases, open up dispatches (sending new parts to customers), etc, I'm responsible for.

Some of these systems talk to other systems, including some with our third-party vendors. For example, when a customer support rep needs to do a dispatch (send a new part) to a customer, they open up a dispatch and fill out all the information needed to send out the new part. When they submit the dispatch, all kinds of automation has to happen behind the scenes to put together the order, and send that order to our third-party vendor that actually stocks and ships the parts out. That integration between our system and theirs is a huge undertaking, and any bug or change can cause the whole thing to break down and need troubleshooting.

So a lot of what I do is gathering all these requirements these various people have for bugs, enhancements, etc. Some of it is done via email (hence being on email pecking away a lot), and some via meetings (hence being in meetings the rest of the day).

Then, once I've banged enough peoples' heads together and get them all to agree on how the systems are going to be changed, I get to sit in my cube some more and peck out all the code needed to fix the bugs, or implement the changes. This can be a job in itself, because imagine trying to get 8 or 10 "stakeholders" from various departments, some of whom are with our partner companies, to agree on how to change a complex system. They all have their ideas on how it should work, and because you can't please everybody, there's always a handful of people who are ticked off that their idea didn't get implemented.

Regarding cubes, I would say they are the de facto workplace environment now, at least for American companies. In fact, at the Silicon Valley startups I've been at, they try to enforce a culture of "sameness" across all the employees, and even the CEO and execs have cubes (no offices).

I've been lucky because I've only had to share a cube with somebody once years ago, when the company was expanding so rapidly they ran out of space and had to double people up. The norm at least for places where I've been is to have your own cube.

I hate cubes. I've only had a real office once in my almost 30 year career, and that was when I was a real estate agent running my own gig. If I'm lucky enough to retire in a couple years, I will never (and I mean NEVER) go back to working in a cube ever again. Even if I run my own company, I will have an office, I don't care how elitist it seems. I've done my time in cube prison, and will never go back if I can escape it.
 
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Cubes are where the people who work for me work. Offices with windows are where people like me work. Corner offices with windows are where my bosses work.

We use offices as incentives. As in, "Hey Mikey, if you can produce 7% more TPS reports this year, we will move you from that cube near the shitter to the cube a little bit less near the shitter".

And then if he meets that goal, we might set another one like "Hey Mikey, if you can reduce errors in your TPS reports by 3% this year, we'll move you from that slightly-less-near-the-shitter cube you got rewarded with last year, to this waaay better (although equidistant from the shitter) cube that gets a faint whiff of natural light from my window laden office".

And then if he meets that goal, we might set another one like "Hey Mikey, if you can properly staple 100% of your TPS reports this year (staples in upper left, oriented no more than 10 degrees off the vertical alignment) we'll move you to a real live office. I mean, let's face it, it is still really close to the shitter, and there are no windows, but on the bright side, we will securely cover the sign on your door reading 'CUSTODIAN CLOSET' with a temporary sign (printed on 8.5x11 paper) with your name on it. You will have your name on an office door."

That's how the office space hierarchy works in some joints. With the caveat that the CEO or some other uppity up can always trump your middle management ways by taking your sweet less-near-the-shitter cubes and putting their own people in them, thereby displacing your own (hard working) people into some ethereal work-place displaced refugee status with not even a stinky cube to call their own.
 
Cubes are where the people who work for me work. Offices with windows are where people like me work. Corner offices with windows are where my bosses work.

We use offices as incentives. As in, "Hey Mikey, if you can produce 7% more TPS reports this year, we will move you from that cube near the shitter to the cube a little bit less near the shitter".

And then if he meets that goal, we might set another one like "Hey Mikey, if you can reduce errors in your TPS reports by 3% this year, we'll move you from that slightly-less-near-the-shitter cube you got rewarded with last year, to this waaay better (although equidistant from the shitter) cube that gets a faint whiff of natural light from my window laden office".

And then if he meets that goal, we might set another one like "Hey Mikey, if you can properly staple 100% of your TPS reports this year (staples in upper left, oriented no more than 10 degrees off the vertical alignment) we'll move you to a real live office. I mean, let's face it, it is still really close to the shitter, and there are no windows, but on the bright side, we will securely cover the sign on your door reading 'CUSTODIAN CLOSET' with a temporary sign (printed on 8.5x11 paper) with your name on it. You will have your name on an office door."

That's how the office space hierarchy works in some joints. With the caveat that the CEO or some other uppity up can always trump your middle management ways by taking your sweet less-near-the-shitter cubes and putting their own people in them, thereby displacing your own (hard working) people into some ethereal work-place displaced refugee status with not even a stinky cube to call their own.

Whew! I feel better already! At least my cube's not IN the shitter! :)
 
I once had an office that was carved out of the lobby of the former personnel building. It was next to the shitter and actually had an attached old phone booth for use as storage.

Man, I miss those days. :LOL:
 
Cubes are where the people who work for me work. Offices with windows are where people like me work. Corner offices with windows are where my bosses work.

We use offices as incentives. As in, "Hey Mikey, if you can produce 7% more TPS reports this year, we will move you from that cube near the shitter to the cube a little bit less near the shitter".

And then if he meets that goal, we might set another one like "Hey Mikey, if you can reduce errors in your TPS reports by 3% this year, we'll move you from that slightly-less-near-the-shitter cube you got rewarded with last year, to this waaay better (although equidistant from the shitter) cube that gets a faint whiff of natural light from my window laden office".

And then if he meets that goal, we might set another one like "Hey Mikey, if you can properly staple 100% of your TPS reports this year (staples in upper left, oriented no more than 10 degrees off the vertical alignment) we'll move you to a real live office. I mean, let's face it, it is still really close to the shitter, and there are no windows, but on the bright side, we will securely cover the sign on your door reading 'CUSTODIAN CLOSET' with a temporary sign (printed on 8.5x11 paper) with your name on it. You will have your name on an office door."

That's how the office space hierarchy works in some joints. With the caveat that the CEO or some other uppity up can always trump your middle management ways by taking your sweet less-near-the-shitter cubes and putting their own people in them, thereby displacing your own (hard working) people into some ethereal work-place displaced refugee status with not even a stinky cube to call their own.

:ROFLMAO::bat:
The beatings will continue till morale improves.....

My last j*b required an office. The best they could come up with was a room with a chair and no other furniture in a building scheduled for demolition. To access it, I had to visit an admin office and ask for the key. The first time I tried to do so, the admin office was locked, as the admins were all out on a team building exercise. Thanks, but no thanks. It's good to be ER!
 
We use offices as incentives. As in, "Hey Mikey, if you can produce 7% more TPS reports this year, we will move you from that cube near the shitter to the cube a little bit less near the shitter".

... and that has a lot to do with why I loathed the idea of working in an office even at the age of 12. It looked a lot like being condemned to a dungeon.

If I hadn't spent 18 years in a police patrol car I would have found something else outside that required moving around a lot. I seriously considered U.S. Border Patrol (they sent a recruiter to the college) but I figured with my luck, since I hate cold weather I'd be assigned to the Canadian border, not Texas or Arizona.

Driving a long-haul truck would have been preferable to the stifling, suffocating, slow death of an office cube no matter what it paid.
 
... and that has a lot to do with why I loathed the idea of working in an office even at the age of 12. It looked a lot like being condemned to a dungeon.

If I hadn't spent 18 years in a police patrol car I would have found something else outside that required moving around a lot. I seriously considered U.S. Border Patrol (they sent a recruiter to the college) but I figured with my luck, since I hate cold weather I'd be assigned to the Canadian border, not Texas or Arizona.

Driving a long-haul truck would have been preferable to the stifling, suffocating, slow death of an office cube no matter what it paid.

I'm pretty sure that long haul truckers make as much or more than most cops.
 
I don't hate my job. I love what I do. It's watching management care more about themselves than the company that has bothered me for a long while now.

I hate the incompentence and/or narcissism that seems to rise to the level of VP and up-- achievers rarely are promoted to this level. It's either a personality contest or a yes-man or a good ole boys club depending on the organization. And I have worked at small and mega corps. Unfortunately these are the people who control the decisions.

I have wanted to consult for several years, but due to several circumstances never made the jump--not yet anyway. Based on what colleagues have told me, it's not perfect either but you don't care as much about the lousy, self-serving decisions that are made.

Thanks for asking. Venting always makes me feel better.:LOL:
 
I don't hate my job. I love what I do. It's watching management care more about themselves than the company that has bothered me for a long while now.

I hate the incompentence and/or narcissism that seems to rise to the level of VP and up-- achievers rarely are promoted to this level. It's either a personality contest or a yes-man or a good ole boys club depending on the organization. And I have worked at small and mega corps. Unfortunately these are the people who control the decisions.

I have wanted to consult for several years, but due to several circumstances never made the jump--not yet anyway. Based on what colleagues have told me, it's not perfect either but you don't care as much about the lousy, self-serving decisions that are made.

Thanks for asking. Venting always makes me feel better.:LOL:


My theory on the promotions you describe is 'idiots hire other idiots'
 
Whew! I feel better already! At least my cube's not IN the shitter! :)

I'm not sure that's the right take on this. It might be better if your cube was in the shitter. Here's why: You would be meeting people you never would have had the chance to meet before. If you worked in the shitter, you could just wheel over on your chair and start up a conversation. Many people feel odd sitting in a restaurant alone, so I imagine that holds true for sitting alone in a megacorp bathroom. So, you would be doing a co-worker a favor. Anyhow, it's a chance for you to socialize, maybe share a donut.

And, it might make you feel more alive. I'm guessing while you are in your cube working, you only use two of your senses: sight and touch ("rage" is not a sense). In the shitter, you'd be using at least two additional senses. Using the third additional sense would simply be a matter of taste.
 
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Sorry if I change anyone's image of cool labs with computers and science projects, but the Pentagon is largely a bunch of rooms with cubicles. My flag level boss gets his own office, albeit with no windows. I'm not a big fan of the work or the environment. Plenty of civilians have been there upwards of 30 years. Nobody seems to "love" their job, but the real problem is that it's pretty good pay for relatively easy work, so folks keep doing what they're doing.
 
I never had a cube next to the shitter but for about 5 years I had a cube with a big beam in the corner, blocking a lot of space and resulting in a shorter desktop and no file drawers like all the other similar cubes had (I had a file cabinet outside the cube but it was awkward to reach). It was also next to a long aisle which had a lot of foot traffic. I eventually got switched to another cube which more of a typical one in size and features. Two years later I ERed so no more cubes for me! :)
 
I'm not sure that's the right take on this. It might be better if your cube was in the shitter. Here's why: You would be meeting people you never would have had the chance to meet before. If you worked in the shitter, you could just wheel over on your chair and start up a conversation. Many people feel odd sitting in a restaurant alone, so I imagine that holds true for sitting alone in a megacorp bathroom. So, you would be doing a co-worker a favor. Anyhow, it's a chance for you to socialize, maybe share a donut.

And, it might make you feel more alive. I'm guessing while you are in your cube working, you only use two of your senses: sight and touch ("rage" is not a sense). In the shitter, you'd be using at least two additional senses. Using the third additional sense would simply be a matter of taste.

"Hey boss, want to split the last urinal mint?"
 
I'm pretty sure that long haul truckers make as much or more than most cops.

It's probably about the same, depending on area and qualifications. Salaries for police work are all over the map from near-poverty to well over six figures, although the latter is unusual.

I pondered going to a truck driving school after I retired, thinking perhaps it would be a neat way to get paid to see the country. But after talking with a few drivers I ditched that idea.
 
It's watching management care more about themselves than the company that has bothered me for a long while now.

Due to incentive stock options, bloated salaries and perks, short-term thinking, etc., management IS the company...
 
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