Company strongarm tactics re: Diner's Club

[Buckeye]

I had a company-issued AMEX while at megacorp. Was allowed to use it for both business and personal charges. We were able to keep the FF miles/rewards that were generated from all the charges.

The company used an automated expense reporting system which was extremely convenient for the employee and a very powerful data analysis tool for the employer. Expense reports did not get approved (only disapproved later if caught via audit) so the reimbursements were made quickly after the report was entered via phone. That was 10 years ago so they may be using the internet now.

Several folks over the years were invited to pay back reminbursements and/or find another place to work based on issues with expense reports which were detected by the software or audits. There was a story of one sales guy who had a few too many $24.99 charges on his expense report. A receipt was not required for an expense under $25. He was invited to refund several thousand dollars in expenses or leave. He left.

 

[IBWino]

Could you put a hold or a lock on your credit reports such that the Diners Club could not run a credit check on you, thereby denying you the card? Make up some BS to tell the company about you think you may be the victim of identity theft, and you need to have the credit report locks on for a year or so.

I like your idea, but accounting is now telling me that Diner's Club will not run a credit check. They will only verify that I am not a former deadbeat Diner's Club customer.

I'm really having a hard time with this. It just seems unreasonable to me that a company can demand that you take out a personal line of credit with a particular company in order to facilitate one of their accounting processes. When I finally pull the plug (in 5-7 years tops), I will have no use for this card, but it will be a part of my credit history and it will affect my credit rating if I close the account.

I probably wouldn't be so anxious about this if I hadn't just recently dealt with over $2K in fraudulent charges on one of our other credit card accounts. It all worked out fine in the end, but it was a PITA.

Oh well...my boss called me to discuss and I think he understands my concerns. For now, I'll just wait and see. My next business travel isn't for a couple of more weeks, so this will get resolved one way or another by then.

 

[IBWino]

It's also a colossal PITA. I'd avoid taking their card if at all possible. You don't even want to have one, let alone have one and not use it.

Yes, this is my point exactly, but I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to avoid it. Maybe FIRE date will come in a little ahead of schedule.

Thanks for taking time to share your experience.

 

[W2R]

I guess you could ask whether or not it is a condition of employment. For us, it is.

The reason I don't like it is that our Inspector General is very concerned that we might charge personal items to our government credit card, and this kind of thing blow up into a Big Corruption Newsflash once the media gets hold of it. I would have to pay for it anyway, but even if I did I would consider my job to be in danger. I worry that I might accidently grab the government CC instead of my debit card (they used to look very similar) when paying for something personal.

Once, several years ago, I accidently charged a car rental to my own personal debit card while on travel for work, because I grabbed it instead of my government CC. What a PITA that was to get straightened out.

But the way it was presented to us, travel is part of the job. Government travel has to be this way. So, having the CC is a condition of employment. Take it or leave it.

 

[FUEGO]

I'm glad I have the corporate credit card where only the corporation is liable on the debt and not me. And I can submit expense reports weekly or monthly and get paid 9 days after the end of the month (if I don't want to us the corp CC).

But I know a guy at a competing firm where they were told to get a corporate AMEX account in their own names for expenses. The guy just doesn't pay it if he doesn't get reimbursed properly, and charges the late fees to the company if he has any. Stubborn for sure, but the guy just doesn't have the money to front the bill each month. I think he is allowed to use any card he wants to charge on though, not just constrained to Amex (or like in the OP's case, Diners Club).

If it were me being required to get the Diners Club card, I'd just do it. Not worth losing a job or getting $hit on at work over something like this. Although if you are ready to jump into FIRE in any event, go for it!

 

[IBWino]

Well this just keeps getting better. The Diners Club card has an annual fee of $95, payable by the employee. The annual fee is waived if the rewards program is activated. But this has a $75 annual fee, also payable by the employee.

The rewards appear to be redeemable as airline miles, but since 90% of my business travel is by auto, these would be of little value to me. I would generally only be using this card for hotel and meals.

So now I have the privilege of paying at minimum a $75 annual fee for a card that I don't even want, and get to earn “rewards” that are of little value to me.

Edit: Okay, now my company says "it was intended to be clear that this is a company-sponsored card and there is no annual fee for the cardholder". Only the fee for joining the rewards program (which benefits the cardholder) is payable by the employee. However, this is not what is stated in the policy or on the application.

 

[mickeyd]

Seems un-American to me. Padding my expense account and coming away from traveling with excess cash was an excellent way to make some pretty sweet untaxed $ when I was w**rking for the man. No doubt it's also a good way for Diners Club and other CCs to broaden their market.

 

[FUEGO]

Just figure out a way to pad $75 a year into your expenses somehow. How do you expense things like mileage, $2 in a coin operated parking meter, $2 tip at a restaurant, $2 tip to concierge or bellboy or skycap, etc? Can you expense the $75 card fee?

Or if it comes down to it, purloin stuff from work (staplers, post it notes, expensive pens, the boss's keyboard and mouse, etc) and ebay/craigslist those things for $75 a year. When you take the stuff, just make sure you intend to use it at home. Then forget and sell it. Renegade justice.

 

[IBWino]

Seems un-American to me. Padding my expense account and coming away from traveling with excess cash was an excellent way to make some pretty sweet untaxed $ when I was w**rking for the man. No doubt it's also a good way for Diners Club and other CCs to broaden their market.

Yes, I suspect that there may have been a little too much of this going on, hence the new policy.

I will state my case, and if they insist it is a condition of employment, I will bend over, grit my teeth, take it up the wazoo, and keep counting down the days until I declare my freedom.

 

[Rustward]

Or if it comes down to it, purloin stuff from work (staplers, post it notes, expensive pens, the boss's keyboard and mouse, etc) and ebay/craigslist those things for $75 a year. When you take the stuff, just make sure you intend to use it at home. Then forget and sell it. Renegade justice.

I hope this is not serious advice.

Does seem like a poor system if Wino is required to pay the $95 or $75/year but wants nothing to do with the card. Seems as though some Diners Club account manager "got to" somebody at Wino's employer.

 

[IBWino]

Okay, now my company says "it was intended to be clear that this is a company-sponsored card and there is no annual fee for the cardholder". Only the fee for joining the rewards program (which benefits the cardholder) is payable by the employee. This is not what is stated in the policy or on the application.

I asked if the getting the card was a condition of employment and the reply was "it is not a condition of employment, but it is a part of our travel policy that is being mandated by upper management". Not sure how to interpret that.

Oh well...I think this has run its course. Thanks to all of you for the advice and comments.

-Wino

 

[MichaelB]

Seems un-American to me. Padding my expense account and coming away from traveling with excess cash was an excellent way to make some pretty sweet untaxed $ when I was w**rking for the man. No doubt it's also a good way for Diners Club and other CCs to broaden their market.

George Washington's Expense Account: Gen. George Washington and Marvin Kitman, Pfc. (Ret.)

In George Washington's Expense Account -- the best-selling expense account in history -- Kitman shows how Washington brilliantly turned his noble gesture of refusing payment for his services as commander in chief of the Continental Army into an opportunity to indulge his insatiable lust for fine food and drink, extravagant clothing, and lavish accommodations.

Amazon.com: George Washington's Expense Account: Gen. George Washington and Marvin Kitman, Pfc. (Ret.) (9780802137739): Marvin Kitman: Books

Probably the best book ever written about padding expense accounts. Hilarious and quite instructive.

 

[Leonidas]

Amazon.com: George Washington's Expense Account: Gen. George Washington and Marvin Kitman, Pfc. (Ret.) (9780802137739): Marvin Kitman: Books

Probably the best book ever written about padding expense accounts. Hilarious and quite instructive.

I remember reading something about Washington's expenses (not the referenced book). His expense bill was something horrendous (more than we pay generals today) but there was the question of the exchange rate. As the war progressed the US Dollar became darn near worthless, just like the Confederate Dollar did in the War of Northern Aggression. It took hundreds of paper dollars to buy a single dollar coin in the Revolution.

 

[ziggy29]

I asked if the getting the card was a condition of employment and the reply was "it is not a condition of employment, but it is a part of our travel policy that is being mandated by upper management". Not sure how to interpret that.

I have a corporate Amex card which is similar to this. When we travel on business, we are to use this card for as many of our reimbursable business expenses as possible. When the trip is over, we fill out an online expense report which generates a hard copy to attach the receipts to. The company then pays the Amex bill directly. Fortunately we have 30 days to pay it after a bill is generated, which usually gives us at least 45 days to pay so we can get it through the pipeline in time and I don't pay it out of pocket.

 

[clifp]

Ah this thread brings back fond memories of stimulating conversations, with the nice folks at American Express, regarding my corporate Amex Card. I do remember them eventually canceling the card and than not having to get another card for several years. Meanwhile collecting frequent flyer miles on my personal card.

I think I'll polish up my resume, and get a job, just so I can relive the experience.

Ok we need an emoticon for happy I'm retired.