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Old 07-28-2016, 06:23 AM   #201
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Again, let's not confuse wealth with spending.

DW has a friend (not best friend but more of someone who attends regular ‘girls night out’). This friend made really good money but for every $1 earned, spent $2; literally.
Exactly - this is the point I was trying to make. This woman may believe that purchasing the $9,000 handbag indicates her personal wealth, but a financial planner would probably suggest that her purchase instead further drives her into poverty.
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Old 07-28-2016, 06:37 AM   #202
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The diversity of views, some humorous , some serious, on these boards, help keep me sane.

When I sold my dental practice in September, and called it quits for good in March, I still had this nagging idea that I would keep my license. And then it occurred to me that I would only use it if I ran out of money. Even the worst-case scenario would likely take a decade of real fiscal stupidity on my part to manage to do that.
So what? Like, when I'm 73 and haven't looked at a tooth in 10 years I'm going to try to go back and resurrect my career? I think not. So,in 4 days, August 1, I will for the first time in 39 years, not have a dental license.
this "leap" of faith makes me feel seriously wealthy.
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Old 07-28-2016, 06:41 AM   #203
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BTW, I am reminded of a cartoon I saw many years ago. Husband is sitting in his chair reading his paper, when DW walks in, her arms full of bags and boxes from a huge shopping spree. The caption is her saying, "My consumer confidence was at an all-time high today!"
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Old 07-28-2016, 07:09 AM   #204
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I agree with those who say do not equate wealth only with buying things. There are lots of folks who spend like they do have wealth but don't. That was a key theme of the book "Stop Acting Rich: And Start Living Like a Real Millionaire."

I know of folks without wealth who would be insulted if you treated them to a meal at Denny's or Sizzlers or Golden Corral. I have a BIL and SIL who were insulted when they needed a car and we offered to buy them a good value used car - they wanted to "live wealthy" and that required a new car.

The first time I felt wealthy was when DW and I helped a friend who, through no fault of her own, was in a desperate situation and we covered her bills for several months without any impact to our lifestyle. When she got back on her feet she wanted to pay us back, but we didn't need the money - we just told her to use it to help someone else. Getting the money back would not have made an impact on our lifestyle either.

I feel wealthy knowing that there are few things I could not go out and buy tomorrow without impacting our lifestyle - but I do not have the desire to rush out and do 99% of them. Just being able to not agonize over which bills have to be paid each month, or unexpected expenses not impacting our lifestyle (which is LBYM but far from frugal) is wealthy enough for me.
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Old 07-28-2016, 07:24 AM   #205
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Our NW does not compare to some of the folks here (more power to them), but when I can fly on my Angel Flights and not worry about the cost, I guess I am wealthy.
That is an awesome thing (Angel Flight and Pilots for Paws). Just sold my Archer II so that I could focus on ER, and already sort of regretting it.

I'm hoping to be able to do what you are doing in retirement. Congrats!
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Old 07-28-2016, 07:32 AM   #206
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I'm cool with spending but to me wealth is not having to work.
Exactly! As I mentioned in the past, I live on about $12K/yr. I would rather live on $12K/yr and not have to work than live on any other amount if it means I have to work.
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Old 07-28-2016, 08:58 AM   #207
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The diversity of views, some humorous , some serious, on these boards, help keep me sane.

When I sold my dental practice in September, and called it quits for good in March, I still had this nagging idea that I would keep my license. And then it occurred to me that I would only use it if I ran out of money. Even the worst-case scenario would likely take a decade of real fiscal stupidity on my part to manage to do that.
So what? Like, when I'm 73 and haven't looked at a tooth in 10 years I'm going to try to go back and resurrect my career? I think not. So,in 4 days, August 1, I will for the first time in 39 years, not have a dental license.
this "leap" of faith makes me feel seriously wealthy.
I hear ya. I paid to renew my PE license first year gone because I still had enough continuing ed to qualify. Next year they wanted I think $70 to go inactive. It took a while to be OK with not doing that (if I returned I'd likely never have been able to pass the exams again) but it was liberating. After 5 years the idea of ever working again is preposterous. I'm realizing I'm forgetting stuff simply because if you don't have to use that knowledge, it tends to fade.
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Old 07-28-2016, 09:29 AM   #208
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... When I sold my dental practice in September, and called it quits for good in March, I still had this nagging idea that I would keep my license.

... So,in 4 days, August 1, I will for the first time in 39 years, not have a dental license. This "leap" of faith makes me feel seriously wealthy.
Congrats. It is difficult to give up something that you have been doing your entire adult life.

From 2003 till 2012, I had people contacting me to offer consulting work, some of which I accepted if it was fun and did not interfere with my travel and leisure time. It was only when I was faced with a serious health problem (which I overcame), that I ceased all work. I often wondered if I should have kept a foot in the door. I can still call them and they probably have work for me still. Last they contacted me, they said I could work at home and bill them for the hours. But I am so spoiled with goofing around (including on this forum) that it is hard for me to go back (and I have integrity to do honest work for honest money).

It is not easy to give up the money, and the work is often quite fun too.

PS. I don't feel "wealthy" not working. It's because I had plenty of time to putz around while working part-time. And the money allowed me to not dip into my stash, as I have to now.
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Old 07-28-2016, 10:45 AM   #209
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The million dollar house would probably be way too big, say 7,000+ sf. If so, you'd have to wear roller blades just to get from one end to the other. Also you'd have to have so many staff around to care for it, that it would feel like Grand Central Station, or the unemployment office, rather than a Dream Home. Think of the echo; not cozy.

Your Maserati would get scratched or dented in parking lots at stores or restaurants the first week. After getting it repaired a few times, I'd expect that you would end up leaving it in the garage and using another car instead.

Hehe, I actually went through this scenario when I was on my last few weeks at work. One of the guys asked what kind of car I was going to buy (we all had Co. cars) and that got me surfing. I found that I could afford a Maserati and actually planned a visit to a dealer to look. But then I started thinking. If I parked a Maserati in the driveway of my modest tract house the neighbors would not look at me the same and I would need a bigger house in a more "upscale" neighborhood. And that would be expensive.

See, my "frugal genes" protected me from irrational exuberance -
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Old 07-28-2016, 10:49 AM   #210
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I used to think getting a massage was a little too unmanly for me. A little too touchy feely for my style. But now that I've had one I realize just how fantastic they are and I'm over any such concerns. High quality ones geared for sports recovery are amazing.


So, my amazing wealth indicator would be to have my own personal masseuse to use multiple times a week as desired.


Muir
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Old 07-28-2016, 10:52 AM   #211
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Yes, they are very nice and I get one whenever I'm at a spa. Couple of hundred bucks, no biggie!
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Old 07-28-2016, 10:57 AM   #212
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Hehe, I actually went through this scenario when I was on my last few weeks at work. One of the guys asked what kind of car I was going to buy (we all had Co. cars) and that got me surfing. I found that I could afford a Maserati and actually planned a visit to a dealer to look. But then I started thinking. If I parked a Maserati in the driveway of my modest tract house the neighbors would not look at me the same and I would need a bigger house in a more "upscale" neighborhood. And that would be expensive.
If one considered them rich, they would get a Bentlyy and not give a hoot what the neighbors thought. I would park mine in the Garage anyway.


A chap across the way in our development has a Bentley we think no better or worse of him. He has a modest home too.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:05 AM   #213
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Hehe, I actually went through this scenario when I was on my last few weeks at work. One of the guys asked what kind of car I was going to buy (we all had Co. cars) and that got me surfing. I found that I could afford a Maserati and actually planned a visit to a dealer to look. But then I started thinking. If I parked a Maserati in the driveway of my modest tract house the neighbors would not look at me the same and I would need a bigger house in a more "upscale" neighborhood. And that would be expensive.

See, my "frugal genes" protected me from irrational exuberance -
Good thinking! You saved yourself quite a bit of money, too.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:09 AM   #214
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I think you mean the obsession with *not* spending? Yup, it is well known. Along with studies that show large AD nest eggs. Still there is this reluctance to *splurge*

I dunno. It is hard and I've really had to force myself, but it can be done -
I have my moments but mostly pretty frugal and happy about it so the splurge really feels good!
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I don't know about other frugalistas, but I enjoy bargain hunting. Members here have a lot of different hobbies - golf, travel, bridge, cooking, raising livestock, boating, etc. I like math and spreadsheets. I find it fun to try to live better but on less money than we used to spend. I play beat my own budget as a game but this month we gave a big chunk of my 2016 savings to date to family members who can use a little budget help right now. We get to help them out and we're still under budget for the year.
I think we are on the same page, viz:
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$100 at a whim? No way! Got to research the very best way to blow the bucks.
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Firecalc doesn't assume that you will die broke... it just calculates the ending value based on a certain series of annual returns and stops if the balance goes negative.

If someone has 90% success that means 10% of the scenarios ended up broke but 90% did not... and often substantial balances have been accumulated.
OK I was thinking that those at say 89% were close to the line, whereas those at 10% would accumulate a bundle. Forgive me for reading too much into the results.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:09 AM   #215
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If one considered them rich, they would get a Bentlyy and not give a hoot what the neighbors thought. I would park mine in the Garage anyway.

A chap across the way in our development has a Bentley we think no better or worse of him. He has a modest home too.
IMHO, Maserati has lost a bit of luster, similar to Jaguars. (apologies if you own one!)

You can lease a Maserati now for less than what I'm paying for my current car lease. Bentley's OTOH are still in the $2K per month lease range.

The hell of owning a really high end car is that you really should have a second/third car for when you'll be leaving it in a shopping center parking lot.
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Old 07-28-2016, 11:09 AM   #216
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Old 07-28-2016, 12:10 PM   #217
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I used to think getting a massage was a little too unmanly for me. A little too touchy feely for my style. But now that I've had one I realize just how fantastic they are and I'm over any such concerns. High quality ones geared for sports recovery are amazing.


So, my amazing wealth indicator would be to have my own personal masseuse to use multiple times a week as desired.


Muir
I like that one! Agree that they help with recovery but I have a hard time justifying one when I have a foam roller and a "stick" to do it myself.
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Old 07-28-2016, 12:11 PM   #218
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I keep a spreadsheet of the value of my bargains / contests / discounts / freebies each month. I am at almost $2K this month so far with not many hours of "work" a week, and most of that is not taxable. On a proverbial $1M type of nest egg that would be a ~3% before tax WR equivalent I do not have to take out. Plus we have to watch our taxable income to keep our ACA subsidies, so the nontaxable discounts help with that.

With money saved there is no SS taken out, no income taxes to be paid, no commute, no set hours, no customers, no boss, no boring meetings, no deadlines, no work clothes, no train fares, no parking fees, no tech classes to take to keep my skills up to date, etc. so I think after everything added up my bargain hunting is not too bad of a per hour return on my time compared to some other hobby job type income I have with taxable 1099 type income.
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Old 07-28-2016, 12:45 PM   #219
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The hell of owning a really high end car is that you really should have a second/third car for when you'll be leaving it in a shopping center parking lot the high end car is in the shop for expensive repairs.

fify...
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Old 07-28-2016, 02:02 PM   #220
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... If I parked a Maserati in the driveway of my modest tract house the neighbors would not look at me the same...
So, you still care about what other people think.

I like to be truly rich, so that I can park my generic car in the circular driveway of a big home, and don't care what people think.

By the way, I like nice homes, not nice cars. I live in the former, not the latter.
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