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Old 07-27-2013, 07:12 PM   #21
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If you want your personal data in the cloud then thats ok for you. All systems can be broken to extract information.
I agree with the OP. I have a system with VMWARE and a partition with finance only. The only thing that partition does is personal finance. Maybe I am fooling myself, but unless I am actively working, that partition is sleeping and not responding to anything (I hope).
The cloud is convenient (for us) and lets us use our multiple devices to access our data very nicely but beware. Put the stuff in the cloud that you are wiling to let anyone see, because the only people beside you that see it are you, the people that you allowed and the industrious people looking for nuggets.
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Old 07-27-2013, 10:57 PM   #22
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I don't know that the iPad is technically more safe than a computer. I think they use the same kind of SSL encryption, though it's nice to see the visual confirmation with the lock icon on the secure pages you load.

I've looked at a bunch of apps. like the Vanguard app, but really to enter all the data, you need to use the computer.


On a related note, I'm looking around at various retirement calculator because there's been some threads on the topic. So searching around, I came across this:

Quote:
Economic Security Planner
Lusardi says some people don’t trust calculators because they suspect their bias is always to tell you to save more. If that’s your suspicion, and you can tolerate complexity, give this program a try. Rather than simply assuming you should replace, say, 80% of your income in retirement (a common assumption of simple calculators), ESPlanner takes where you are now financially and then calculates the optimum amount to save and spend going forward, to achieve a stable living standard, now and through retirement. (In other words, it won’t suggest you live like a pauper now, so you can live in luxury later.) We at Forbes like this program so much that we’ve made it into the Forbes Lifetime Financial Planning app, available for download free on the iPad. Or try the free basic web version here. Warning: Both versions require a lot of data input, and some getting used to, although the iPad version has better graphics and, we think, is more user friendly.
Here's their app.:

https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/forb...491483343?mt=8

Anyone use it or the underlying calculator on which it's based, Economic Security Planner?
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Old 07-28-2013, 09:35 AM   #23
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I may be missing something, but the only thing I really have to protect is my usernames & passwords. If someone sees my holdings, it's annoying but so what, many people publish that kind of detail here.

I know some people (here) look at their holdings online daily, but I think that increases the likelihood of a "security breach," and why bother if you're a long term, buy-n-hold investor? I don't care about paper losses/gains so I "look" on average quarterly or less, and I'd never use a public PC to access my financials.
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I bother because I want to check to see that no one has changed the email address on the account and no one has initiated any transfer transactions on the account. If I see that happening, I can contact Vanguard before anything gets finalized. Checking quarterly (!) or even monthly or weekly doesn't do that as you can find out too late someone accessed your account.
Fair point. I checked Vanguard's fraud policy and found

"If assets are taken from your account in an unauthorized online transaction on Vanguard.comŽ—and you've followed the steps described in the Your responsibilities section below—we will reimburse the assets taken from your account in the unauthorized transaction. Check your account frequently"

though I didn't see any definition of frequently Deliberate?

So maybe I should check a little more often, though the more often I access, the more risk of hacking a password. Another of life's Catch 22's. OTOH, Vanguard's security measures look as solid as they can make them ( as expected) even if there are no absolute guarantees.

I'd still say looking daily should be unnecessary. YMMV
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Old 07-28-2013, 11:41 AM   #24
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I bother because I want to check to see that no one has changed the email address on the account and no one has initiated any transfer transactions on the account. If I see that happening, I can contact Vanguard before anything gets finalized. Checking quarterly (!) or even monthly or weekly doesn't do that as you can find out too late someone accessed your account.

I don't check on public WiFi networks, but when I'm at home I check on each business day.
If there are any changes of this sort, Vanguard will email you to your current email account with a message on the changes. Transfer transactions would be to accounts you hopefully have good security on and that you control. For the bad guy to be successful, he would have to change the VG account to transfer to an account he controls but that is in your registered VG name and you would have to miss seeing the email about the change.

I do not think one could add a transfer account change and quickly do that transfer i.e. I think (but am not sure of this) that there is a transition period before you can actually do that transfer. My guess is if the transfer is out of character, VG will flag this as unusual. I guess if one is leaving on an extended trip and will not access one's secure email, you would have a security risk there. In that case, one could notify VG of the trip length like one does with a credit card company.
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Old 07-28-2013, 11:43 AM   #25
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Here is a link to what Vanguard wants from us regarding our security practices: https://personal.vanguard.com/us/hel...dgeContent.jsp
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Old 07-28-2013, 11:45 AM   #26
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Has anyone here had really good security (similar to the Vanguard requirements) and still been hacked?

I understand some of this paranoia as I read too many spy novels myself. Still, I'm not prepared to go to a totally separate piece of hardware to do financial transactions.
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:02 PM   #27
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Here is a link to what Vanguard wants from us regarding our security practices: https://personal.vanguard.com/us/hel...dgeContent.jsp
Again, Vanguard's definition of "frequently" could make a huge difference for any account holder if they were hacked...
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:24 PM   #28
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Probably no more necessary than me blowing $119 for an HP Slate 7 inch tablet I bought online today. Just couldn't pass it up and was itching to waste some money today.
Where did you get an HP Slate 7 for $119? I notice that they are now $139 on the HP site with an instant $30 savings, but might pull the trigger on one if I can get it for even less.
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:28 PM   #29
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Where did you get an HP Slate 7 for $119? I notice that they are now $139 on the HP site with an instant $30 savings, but might pull the trigger on one if I can get it for even less.
Do you have a chase credit card, Tom? If you do, go to their Ultimate Rewards shopping mall online under Chase Ultimate Rewards. Then go to HP in their directory of companies participating. There it will show you HP specials. One of them is spend $100 or more by July 31 and get an additional $20 off purchase.
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:30 PM   #30
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Do you have a chase credit card, Tom? If you do, go to their Ultimate Rewards shopping mall online under Chase Ultimate Rewards. Then go to HP in their directory of companies participating. There it will show you HP specials. One of them is spend $100 or more by July 31 and get an additional $20 off purchase.
Unfortunately, no. I do have an Amex Blue card though. They tend to offer a lot of specials, so perhaps I'll get lucky with that card. Thanks for the tip.
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:31 PM   #31
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Where did you get an HP Slate 7 for $119? I notice that they are now $139 on the HP site with an instant $30 savings, but might pull the trigger on one if I can get it for even less.
Also make sure you put the special code in that it mentions to get the additional $20. Although it redirects you to the HP site, it originates through the Chase Mall.
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:52 PM   #32
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Unfortunately, no. I do have an Amex Blue card though. They tend to offer a lot of specials, so perhaps I'll get lucky with that card. Thanks for the tip.
Worth a shot. Most CC brands have a shopping site under there website. As long as you are truly shopping for something you are going to buy, it pays to go under them and look for additional discounts. For example Priceline and Hotwire both have additional percentage off of price through cash back program, if you just buy through the Mall that is linked to their respective websites.
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Old 07-28-2013, 06:36 PM   #33
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If there are any changes of this sort, Vanguard will email you to your current email account with a message on the changes. Transfer transactions would be to accounts you hopefully have good security on and that you control. For the bad guy to be successful, he would have to change the VG account to transfer to an account he controls but that is in your registered VG name and you would have to miss seeing the email about the change.

I do not think one could add a transfer account change and quickly do that transfer i.e. I think (but am not sure of this) that there is a transition period before you can actually do that transfer. My guess is if the transfer is out of character, VG will flag this as unusual. I guess if one is leaving on an extended trip and will not access one's secure email, you would have a security risk there. In that case, one could notify VG of the trip length like one does with a credit card company.
What are the mechanics of redemptions/withdrawals from Vanguard?

Say you sell some Wellsley shares. Does the proceeds go automatically to some kind of cash account?

Then you can have them send a check or do an ACH transfer to another institution?

It's been awhile since I set up the ACH between VG and my credit union but I believe it took a few days and required some kind of verification. And I've only used it to send funds from the credit union to VG, not the other way around.
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Old 07-28-2013, 07:15 PM   #34
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For an ACH it takes a few days. One cannot just transfer to any old account without some verification which takes awhile to set up.
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Old 07-29-2013, 02:56 AM   #35
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If there are any changes of this sort, Vanguard will email you to your current email account with a message on the changes. Transfer transactions would be to accounts you hopefully have good security on and that you control. For the bad guy to be successful, he would have to change the VG account to transfer to an account he controls but that is in your registered VG name and you would have to miss seeing the email about the change.

I do not think one could add a transfer account change and quickly do that transfer i.e. I think (but am not sure of this) that there is a transition period before you can actually do that transfer.

I agree that it could not be done quickly, which is why I think it is so effective to check your account online frequently in that you have a chance of finding something while it is still in process and nothing has happened yet.

I do realize emails come in but it is possible to miss an email or have it go to spam so that is why I like to also check online.

I just think that for the safety of the account it is a prudent thing to do and is easy enough to do.

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OTOH, Vanguard's security measures look as solid as they can make them ( as expected) even if there are no absolute guarantees.

Well, no, there security measures aren't as solid as they can make them. They are good in many ways. On the other hand, Vanguard has limitations on password length and characters that make their passwords not as secure as they are at many sites. Also, Vanguard has you first put in your user name and then put in your password. The negative of this is that it allows someone to know whether the user name is correct or not rather than having a site where you put in both user name and password at the same time and if it doesn't go through you don't know which was wrong.
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Old 07-29-2013, 09:37 AM   #36
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I called up Vanguard and the best way to secure your computer access while on vacation is to set the account for restricted access to just one (probably home) computer. This seems like a good choice for most since logging on from a hotel wifi is not a good idea IMO. This also restricts one to just one browser. You will be asked a security question if you use another browser on the same computer.

If I need vacation access I'll just call VG. One could temporarily restrict all access but this seems too drastic to me.

BTW, I was told that VG will eventually be allowing longer passwords. Apparently this is a slow to be implemented improvement.
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Old 07-29-2013, 05:57 PM   #37
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Web security personnel have advised me if its within my means, have dedicated financial hardware if possible.
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Old 07-29-2013, 09:42 PM   #38
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Web security personnel have advised me if its within my means, have dedicated financial hardware if possible.
Isn't that a bit like asking a barber if you need a haircut?

It would be very easy for vanguard and other banks to really increase the security on accounts. But the fact that they don't makes me think the risk is minimal.

Does anybody actually know of an individual who had their brokerage account hacked by a stranger and they lost money? The only cases I've heard this occur is with business accounts which is different matter.
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Old 07-29-2013, 09:44 PM   #39
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Well, no, there security measures aren't as solid as they can make them. They are good in many ways. On the other hand, Vanguard has limitations on password length and characters that make their passwords not as secure as they are at many sites.
Vanguard doesn't even use security tokens. The last time I asked about that they had no plans to do so.
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