Any Experience With Class B RV's?

Hi, I'm shopping for a used Class B (van-sized) RV such as the Roadtrek (www.roadtrek.com), and have a few questions for anybody who might have owned/lived in one of these:

  • How are they for a couple to live in for an extended period, of say a few weeks or a month? We'd need to use it a lot to justify the cost, but is that realistic in such a small space? (We've done a lot of camping in the past, even owned a VW camper van at one point, but I really wouldn't want to spend a few weeks in one of those right now.)

I have not spent time in a camper that small. Mine was 20+ Winnebago. Which I spent over a year in traversing the USA.

I expected that size (conversion van) to be too small for extended period for couples.

A friend and his wife (late 30s) made a nearly year long cross country trip in a Ford conversion van. My bet was that they would divorce after a few months. I lost my bet. They did very well, thogh I wold not even imagine the trip with DW. DW's idea of camping is a balcony suite overlooking the beach with room service.

Much whitespace was covered here in poo.
grin.gif
That stuff getting dumped, is such a trivial part of the camping experience as a flyspeck on sheet of legal paper. If that puts you off, don't even bother.

My current RV is an Argosy 23', with the requisite holding tanks. Though my preference is for boondocking. Where the poo disposal issue is finding a suitable spot with shovel in hand.

That said: happy trails!
 
First buy used. Second spending a couple of nights or weeks in an rv in a state park is all you need to do to have fun. You can not go anywhere and stay in a motel six and do nothing and have fun. So if your into nature it is a cost savings. If you buy right you should not loose more than 500 a year deprecitation and maybe less. In Florida State parks are 1/2 price for resident seniors and handicapped. So your looking at 10 a night.
 
Thanks for any info and I'm sure YMMV

Yeow. I have been to Hawaii on vacation many times (more than 20) so I have some idea of why there are few (if any) RVs there. First off, the climate is such that shelter is not really a consideration -- a blanket and pillow is probably overkill. (Yes, I have been "caught" in the rain -- once thought I would drown -- but if you live there that is more a schedulling problem than anything else.) The other thing I noticed about Hawaii was all the State and Federal parks lock the gates at 5:00 (or some such early hour). I don't know if they lock you in or out but it doesn't feel right. Above all is the thought that an island is an island and "getting away from it all" seems like an impossible quest since everything is so close. What is that saying? "Another lousy day in paradise." If you have a permanent (grounded) house, how could you possibly top that with a mobile one?

As to your real question: First, I have a difficult time relating a "Motel 6" to my own home. In any event, I am unable to put a price on sleeping in my own bed with my own pillow(s) -- as in the commercial... priceless. (Rich In Tampa said this much more eloquently earlier when he spoke about "the bed bugs, mystery stains on the sheets, partially clean bathrooms, smoke residue, carpets of many delights" in commercial establishments.) In addition, there are those that enjoy eating in restaurants... I am not one of them. The portions are too large as are the checks that appear at the finish. A "special occasion" is okay but it is nice to eat your own meals most of the time and, most importantly, the choice should be mine. That I cannot put a price on either.

Above all is that you are in charge of your itinerary -- if something catches your eye on your travels, you can calmly explore it without being pressured by hotel reservations. My experience is that the things you didn't know about (the word is serendipity) are the best destinations... primarily because you get to enjoy them without the crowds (or, at least, I find them as good as, the heavily promoted -- read watch your pocketbook -- destinations.)

Bottom line, however, is as RAWahoo says: It is a lifestyle not a business... profit is not the point.

Now, if you are serious about getting into the RV life, you could start at the beginning:

RV Home Yet?: First RV ever built for sale this month
 

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Off the top of my head, I wonder about e.g.,

gas mileage vs a car
depreciation of a "dedicated" vehicle vs a daily driver which you need anyway.
opportunity costs or finance cost (or both)
RV park costs vs Motel 6 (esp. when it's a couple and not a whole family.)
storage - in my old MW life we had ordinances against some types of home-storage of RVs
routine maintenance of dedicated vehicle
breakdowns costs vs a car
propane for heating during winter
other?

Can't speak for Hawaii, but on the mainland I can give you an idea of our costs. We don't have a motorized RV: we have a 16 foot trailer I can tow with my existing minivan. We bought new last year before the bottom came out of the economy. Including the camper, all the associated fees, an involved hitch on the van, putting an OEM tow package on the van at my local mechanic, and completely outfitting the thing for travel, we spent under $20k. You could spend less or a whole lot more.

When towing, our gas mileage is cut in half, so my 25MPG van gets a little over 12MPG. Then again, with two small children and two elderly dogs in teh van with us, we typically don't drive more than an hour or two each way for most of our trips.

We paid cash for the trailer. We could have financed it at 5 or 6%.

RV parks vary. Of the ones we frequent, daily charges range from $20 to $35 a night. We usually patronize state and local parks rather than private campgrounds. Since we are in NJ, there aren't really opportunities for boondocking (which is usually free).

Couldn't say about storage. We specifically chose a trailer that would fit easily in our driveway and not be in the way, plus it is an extra guest room in a pinch. We don't have ordinances against driveway storage here.

Maintenance/breakdowns increase with age. Thus far our maintenance has been a hundred bucks to have it winterized. I've been told to expect an average of $500 a year in maintenance and repairs.

I think we used less than 20 pounds of propane for an entire season of camping. I'd be thrilled to winter camp, but DW is having none of it, so October is the end of our season here.

The savings are iffy, IMO. We bought this thing because we like spending time outdoors and wanted to be able to travel with the kids in relative comfort. But it does make for inexpensive outings. We typically go away for 2 to 5 nights (lots of 2 and 3 day weekends). It costs whatever extra gas because we are towing and an average of about $30 a night in fees. I figure we save significant amounts of money by not eating out much when travelling and of course if you are in the woods having fun you aren't dropping $$$ in stores. But where can a family of 4 go for a 3 day weekend for $100? Maybe the in-laws.
 
In all seriousness, if anyone is looking to purchase an RV (first-time or whatever), then now is probably as good a time as there has ever been:

California RV dealer offers new RVs at half price (one of many, many such articles of late)

California RV Dealer - Altmans Winnebago

"A brand new, fully equipped 30' Winnebago Class A motorhome, originally priced at $83,258 will be available for $41,629. A 2008 Class A Winnebago Tour 40-foot with a 400 hp Cummins engine, originally priced at $268,697 will be sold for $161,218. At 40 percent off MSRP, a brand new 2008 Class A 35L Winnebago Adventurer with a window sticker of $160,038 can be purchased for $96,023."
 
Your in-laws charge you to visit them? Dang, and I thought I had an unreasonable MIL...:cool:

No, they don't charge. But I couldn't think of anywhere else you could go and stay overnight for that amount of money.
 
I could gloat about it hitting 80 here yesterday but I know I'll pay for it come August. :p


Its not the cold, its the gray. The sky looked like the inside of a dirty ping pong ball all day. It can do that for weeks at a time here (but not as bad as the lake effect stuff in MI/OH/NY).
 
Yeow. I have been to Hawaii on vacation many times (more than 20) so I have some idea of why there are few (if any) RVs there. First off, the climate is such that shelter is not really a consideration -- a blanket and pillow is probably overkill. (Yes, I have been "caught" in the rain -- once thought I would drown -- but if you live there that is more a schedulling problem than anything else.) The other thing I noticed about Hawaii was all the State and Federal parks lock the gates at 5:00 (or some such early hour). I don't know if they lock you in or out but it doesn't feel right. Above all is the thought that an island is an island and "getting away from it all" seems like an impossible quest since everything is so close.
I think the main reason that Hawaii doesn't have an RV market is that there's not enough population for the RV demographic to support the niche industry. I don't know who'd pay the shipping fees from the Mainland, the $3-$4/gallon gas, and the fact that you can only drive about 30 miles in a "straight" line. RV dealers (and their repair shops) would quickly starve around here. Since there's few weather issues, just throw a tent in the back of the sedan (and a longboard on the roof) and go.

The only time I see RVs in Hawaii is for movie/TV shoots. The production crew probably find it easier to move/park/equip/inhabit an RV than a Matson container. When Disney came to town to film "Pearl Harbor", at least four of the stars shipped over their own custom-fitted RVs and parked them on Ford Island (the location of most of the filming). They had all the familiar comforts of their homes, including security, and could walk to work within minutes. It seemed like a better deal than spending thousands of dollars to convert a couple of government classrooms to furnish Bruckheimer's offices, and then donating all of the furnishings & office equipment to [-]our chiefs[/-] Goodwill.

One of the issues with Hawaii's parks is the homeless population. If you're only holding down a subsistence job but you can throw a tent in the car to go elsewhere on a moment's notice, then why even bother to try to pay rent on an overpriced & undersized apartment? The state has only found one way to deal with the chronically homeless-- to close the parks after sundown and to limit the length of camping permits.

Closure also tends to limit the late-night beach partying & noisemaking while making it easier for the security patrols. But as Trombone Al has pointed out before, classic camping is dead. Even in Hawaii, most of the kama`aina can't be without their generators, their lights, their high-volume audio systems... the only camping I've enjoyed around here is in the Boy Scout/Girl Scout campgrounds where such noise is discouraged.

What is that saying? "Another lousy day in paradise." If you have a permanent (grounded) house, how could you possibly top that with a mobile one?
The expression we usually hear is "All y'all are from Hawayuh an' yer vacationin' hee-yer?!?"

The fact is that "getting away from it all" only takes about an hour on Oahu to go from "town" to "country", and doing so means that you don't sit around your abode looking at unwashed dishes, unfinished chores, in-progress projects, unanswered mail... you get the idea. Surfing happens a lot quicker, too, when you're living next to the beach.

When we visit our kid at college graduation, wherever that is, we're going to try to rent an RV and park it on the grounds. Beats the heck out of the crowded town lodgings and the campus traffic jams.
 
...
we have a 16 foot trailer I can tow with my existing minivan.

When towing, our gas mileage is cut in half, so my 25MPG van gets a little over 12MPG.

I find this most interesting. That you can tow this trailer with a minivan.

A few months ago, we stopped by an RV dealer just to look around. The smallest and lightest trailer they have (similar to your 16-footer?) is around 4000 to 5000 lbs.

Though we did not buy it, the above would be something we probably barely pull with our smallish SUV, an Xterra with a factory built-in towing hitch rated at 5000lbs. My previous experience with my minivan was not pleasant; it got overheated pulling just a moving trailer of perhaps around 1500-2000 lbs gross weight, going up 6% grade hills. Of course, the Xterra did not have problems. It also is built on a pickup chassis, not a crossover design.

So, what is the weight of your trailer? How does the minivan handle hills?
 
I find this most interesting. That you can tow this trailer with a minivan.

A few months ago, we stopped by an RV dealer just to look around. The smallest and lightest trailer they have (similar to your 16-footer?) is around 4000 to 5000 lbs.

Though we did not buy it, the above would be something we probably barely pull with our smallish SUV, an Xterra with a factory built-in towing hitch rated at 5000lbs. My previous experience with my minivan was not pleasant; it got overheated pulling just a moving trailer of perhaps around 1500-2000 lbs gross weight, going up 6% grade hills. Of course, the Xterra did not have problems. It also is built on a pickup chassis, not a crossover design.

So, what is the weight of your trailer? How does the minivan handle hills?

What we own is a 2008 FunFinder (yeah, I know) X160. See: Cruiser Rv : Fun Finder X Travel Trailer

The factory weight with air conditioner and other "options" is about 2500#, not including the stuff we put in it or any water or propane. It was the only "bunkhouse" model (1 full size bed and 3 twin bunks) I could find that was light enough for our purposes. We generally travel with 5 gallons or so of fresh water and empty gray and black tanks, so added water weight is modest. Most of the additional weight is our stuff, which we try to keep on the light size and the small space helps enforce. I believe that the trailer generally weighs about 3000# when we hit the road for a trip.

We tow with a 2005 Honda Odyssey with a weight distributing hitch, brake controller and factory tow package (added last year). The van has a reasonably beefy V6 and most of the weight in the van is passengers (2 adults, 2 kids under 5, 50 pounds of dogs). We will typically put most of the stuff in the trailer, but the van ends up carrying a full size spare and some bulky (but light) stuff. I think that between the van and the trailer the whole kit and kaboodle weighs about 8000#, give or take, and is about 35 feet long.

The van is rated to tow 3500# which we take seriously, although I have heard tell of Honda vans towing Airstream trailers (which are quite heavy). The van and the trailer are pretty well matched because the van is big enough that the trailer cannot really push it all over the road (a seriously issue when you tow a 30' trailer with a 16' truck). The trailer is about 6 inches wider than the van on each side, so its not hard to adjust to the width when driving.

Acceleration is slower than when unladen, but I generally have no problem getting up to highway speeds in time to merge with 65 MPH traffic. Comfy cruising speeds are 60 to 65, although the van is definately capable of faster. Heavy grades are more of a push, but aside from a slower pace we had no real issues going up 6 and 8% grades in a former coal-mining area in Pennsylvania this summer. Not sure what it would be like at high altitude, although I think it would be doable. We've had nary a suggestion of overheating.

We've been pretty happy with the setup thus far. I suppose its possible that towing would be easier with a truck frame vehicle, but for this size trailer the van seems to be more than adequate.
 
I find this most interesting. That you can tow this trailer with a minivan.

A few months ago, we stopped by an RV dealer just to look around. The smallest and lightest trailer they have (similar to your 16-footer?) is around 4000 to 5000 lbs.
NWBound, there are a number of small trailers on the market, and most are designed to be towed by today's smaller SUVs. There are hard-sided A-frame trailers that weight from 500--3500 pounds (search for Aliner or Chalet RVs), and then there are a bunch of fiberglass "eggs", like Casita or Scamps. Check out a website goxrv.com, which is dealer, but there are links to a bunch of tiny trailer manufacturers on the website.
You can certainly find a trailer that your vehicle can easily tow! (Whether you want to camp in something that small is another issue...)
 
Thanks. I have seen pictures of the Chalet, which is really neat for a weekend trip. For a longer trip, a small trailer like Brewer's would work well for us. We probably would not have problems towing it with the Xterra.
 
we LOVE our "mobile command center". we travel frequently from san jose,ca up to our property in oregon. it weighs about 34,000 lbs. & gets about 8.5 mpg & can tow a 40,000 lb. trailer with its 430 hp caterpillar diesel.
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It's nice to have the high MPG from the diesel, but is all that weight necessary? :) Armour plating?
 
Thanks. I have seen pictures of the Chalet, which is really neat for a weekend trip. For a longer trip, a small trailer like Brewer's would work well for us. We probably would not have problems towing it with the Xterra.

Xterra would do great.
 
we LOVE our "mobile command center". we travel frequently from san jose,ca up to our property in oregon. it weighs about 34,000 lbs. & gets about 8.5 mpg & can tow a 40,000 lb. trailer with its 430 hp caterpillar diesel.
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Well at least it is green.
 
Damn! You guys are a lot richer than I realized. I'll know who to beseech if I ever crap out.

Ha
 
Ha, these guys are too rich for my blood--here's my baby!
I don't have armor plating, but I do have hippie repellent if needed! :whistle:
 

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