Join Early Retirement Today
View Poll Results: How wouold you describe yourself
Engineer/scientist 68 56.67%
Artist/writer etc 3 2.50%
other 49 40.83%
Voters: 120. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-14-2009, 12:47 PM   #21
Recycles dryer sheets
Hobo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 274
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebird5825 View Post
Still w*rking on that...
All I had was Business 100 in college. The rest was self-taught online and through a lot of reading. And of course you good folks and the links you provide. TY
My grasp is still fledgling at best. But give me numbers and some logic behind it and I can fly!
One thing engineers can't do is understand the details of accounting. I had the GI bill and went back to school for a MBA - I went just to get some money to buy a hang-glider! Never got an MBA, but I did get a hang glider. Also, I managed to struggle through Accounting. Later I learned that understanding what your accountant is talking about is really important if you are in business.

Accounting 101 is the same type of basic fundamental information as Financial Analysis - it's all cookbook. No rocket science, nothing anybody can't learn by reading a book which covers net present value, present value of future cash flow, discount rates, alternatives analysis, etc. Concepts like sunk costs are really important if you are trying to make decisions after loosing money in the market. You can't let emotions get in the way of the numbers.
__________________

__________________
Hobo is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 08-14-2009, 12:51 PM   #22
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
IndependentlyPoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 1,142
Is this some sort of ploy to trick closet geeks to out themselves? O.K. I'll admit to being a geek and a nerd.

I guess that I am not too surprised at the results. The engineers I worked with were all tightwads. Driving a flashy car was definitely looked upon with suspicion. Expensive clothes? Fugetaboutit.

Looking back, I can see that peer pressure helped me from slipping into the standard American consumerist mode. (Well, it didn't prevent me from buying a red Alfa Romeo spider, but a young man has to have some indulgences.)

I also feel that engineering is basically a young person's game. The energy, concentration, and attention to detail it demands was O.K. for a while, but there is no way I could do it now. I will be quite happy if I never see a differential equation again.
__________________

__________________
IndependentlyPoor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 12:53 PM   #23
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
freebird5825's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Nowhere, 43N Latitude, NY
Posts: 9,017
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobo View Post
...Hey great website for figuring out all this stuff.. Wolfram|Alpha Try entering, "car loan 8% interest 3 year balloon" in the search slot and it spits out a ton of great information.
Nice link. Wolfram is a familiar name to me because of their Mathematica software.
Check this out
Wolfram|Alpha Examples - Money & Finance
However, I was unable to change the fields.
Must need a license for the software?
__________________
"All our dreams can come true, if we have the courage to pursue them." - Walt Disney
freebird5825 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 12:55 PM   #24
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
nun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobo View Post
One thing engineers can't do is understand the details of accounting.
Engineers and scientists usually first encounter accounting when they move into management roles. The concepts are pretty simple, but as these simple things compound they produce complex structures.
__________________
nun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 12:58 PM   #25
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndependentlyPoor View Post
I guess that I am not too surprised at the results. The engineers I worked with were all tightwads.
I'm interested in the cause-and-effect here.

I can see several different factors leading to whether or not some occupations are overrepresented or underrepresented in the FIRE realm. For example:

* How well it pays. The better it pays, the farther below your means you can live, the more you can save and invest, and the sooner you can FIRE.

* Whether or not you are covered by a good defined benefit pension plan, particularly one that provides for early retirement (say in your 50s or even earlier in some cases).

* Whether or not the occupation has a high level of "personal satisfaction." People are obviously more likely to not want to leave jobs they enjoy, even if they have reached FI.

So in a nutshell, someone who has a high paying job they dislike with a pension would be most likely to retire early, whereas someone with lesser income, no pension and a job they love may wind up dying in their job.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 01:23 PM   #26
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
IndependentlyPoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 1,142
I do miss Mathematica. When my computer died a couple of months ago, I called Wolfram to see how much it would cost to upgrade to the new version and move the license to a new machine. They wanted $2000, and that was after a 20% existing customer discount.

Yikes! I decided that $2K was above my means.

The graphics package was awesome though.
__________________
IndependentlyPoor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 01:25 PM   #27
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
nun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndependentlyPoor View Post
I do miss Mathematica. When my computer died a couple of months ago, I called Wolfram to see how much it would cost to upgrade to the new version and move the license to a new machine. They wanted $2000, and that was after a 20% existing customer discount.

Yikes! I decided that $2K was above my means.

The graphics package was awesome though.
I use IDL and AutoCad in my w*rk, the cost of a "seat" and upkeep is horrendous
__________________
nun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 01:28 PM   #28
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
freebird5825's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Nowhere, 43N Latitude, NY
Posts: 9,017
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndependentlyPoor View Post
O.K. I'll admit to being a geek and a nerd.

I will be quite happy if I never see a differential equation again.
Hey, buddy, there's a line here! <leading to the geek/nerd confessional>

DiffEq? You made me shudder.

Ok, show of hands for this one...did any of you ever really care how long it took to fill and/or empty
that *@#! water tank ?
__________________
"All our dreams can come true, if we have the courage to pursue them." - Walt Disney
freebird5825 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 01:38 PM   #29
Moderator
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Eee Bah Gum
Posts: 21,153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobo View Post
One thing engineers can't do is understand the details of accounting.
B.Eng in EE here.

Our degree included 3 Accounting courses which were mandatory to pass to get the degree. Reasoning is that Engineers often go on to manage departments, companies and Corporations. They certainly are often required to write proposals to justify capital projects, so need to know ROI, RONA, NPV, etc. I never thought about it before, guess I assumed that all engineering degrees required Accounting.
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Now it's adventure before dementia
Alan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 01:46 PM   #30
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan View Post
B.Eng in EE here.

Our degree included 3 Accounting courses which were mandatory to pass to get the degree. Reasoning is that Engineers often go on to manage departments, companies and Corporations. They certainly are often required to write proposals to justify capital projects, so need to know ROI, RONA, NPV, etc. I never thought about it before, guess I assumed that all engineering degrees required Accounting.
My B.S. in EE (at Texas A&M, a long time ago) didn't require me to take any accounting classes although many chose accounting as an elective. I have never taken an accounting or economics or business class. We did have to take a 2 unit senior level EE class called "Engineering Economics". It was generally considered to be a "gimme" - - in other words, nearly everyone got an A in that class (and believe me, it was the *only* EE class like that! ). We learned about Gantt charts and that sort of thing.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 01:50 PM   #31
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebird5825 View Post
Hey, buddy, there's a line here! <leading to the geek/nerd confessional>

DiffEq? You made me shudder.

Ok, show of hands for this one...did any of you ever really care how long it took to fill and/or empty that *@#! water tank ?
Me! Me!



I have to admit that I LOVED diff eq and got an A in it. One of the things I might do in ER, is to brush up on diff eq just for fun.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:00 PM   #32
Moderator
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Eee Bah Gum
Posts: 21,153
Quote:
Originally Posted by Want2retire View Post
My B.S. in EE (at Texas A&M, a long time ago) didn't require me to take any accounting classes although many chose accounting as an elective. I have never taken an accounting or economics or business class. We did have to take a 2 unit senior level EE class called "Engineering Economics". It was generally considered to be a "gimme" - - in other words, nearly everyone got an A in that class (and believe me, it was the *only* EE class like that! ). We learned about Gantt charts and that sort of thing.
Maybe it's just a UK thing with Engineering degrees requiring Accounting. I did find it interesting and pretty easy - a nice break from many of the EE classes !! We were also required to pass a class in Industrial Sociology (think labor relations, managing employees etc).




Quote:
Originally Posted by Want2retire View Post
Me! Me!



I have to admit that I LOVED diff eq and got an A in it. One of the things I might do in ER, is to brush up on diff eq just for fun.
me too, and I even majored in Transmission Theory and began my career as a Radar engineer. However, all that 3-D math did wear me down and when I switched to Process Control I was much happier
__________________
Retired in Jan, 2010 at 55, moved to England in May 2016
Now it's adventure before dementia
Alan is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:01 PM   #33
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by Want2retire View Post
One of the things I might do in ER, is to brush up on diff eq just for fun.
You are one sick individual.
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:09 PM   #34
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
You are one sick individual.
Well, maybe not sick but definitely a social misfit. In one way or another, I think most of us here fit in that category (just maybe not in loving diff eq, but who ever heard of someone retiring in their 30's or 40's? Definitely misfit material.).

I loved differential equations, and still do. I enjoyed all my calculus classes, too, and linear algebra was really cool! But diff eq was more challenging and so much fun. I still have my old textbooks and I think they have half the answers in the back of the book, so I can have a lot of fun re-doing all those problems.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:13 PM   #35
Moderator
ziggy29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 15,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by Want2retire View Post
I loved differential equations, and still do. I enjoyed all my calculus classes, too, and linear algebra was really cool! But diff eq was more challenging and so much fun. I still have my old textbooks and I think they have half the answers in the back of the book, so I can have a lot of fun re-doing all those problems.
Leave it to an Aggie!

I was really good at linear algebra. Got an A+ in it. I think I still have the textbook and solutions manual in the garage. I've probably forgotten 2/3 of it...
__________________
"Hey, for every ten dollars, that's another hour that I have to be in the work place. That's an hour of my life. And my life is a very finite thing. I have only 'x' number of hours left before I'm dead. So how do I want to use these hours of my life? Do I want to use them just spending it on more crap and more stuff, or do I want to start getting a handle on it and using my life more intelligently?" -- Joe Dominguez (1938 - 1997)

RIP to Reemy, my avatar dog (2003 - 9/16/2017)
ziggy29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:18 PM   #36
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
IndependentlyPoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 1,142
When I retired, the problem of the moment was simulating noise in electrical circuits and that requires stochastic differential equations. I'm OK with regular DiffyQs, but it gives me the heebie-jeebies when their coefficients start wiggling around randomly.
__________________
IndependentlyPoor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:19 PM   #37
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan View Post
me too, and I even majored in Transmission Theory and began my career as a Radar engineer. However, all that 3-D math did wear me down and when I switched to Process Control I was much happier
That's fascinating! Physical oceanography involves a lot of PDE's, but the assumptions you have to make are pretty mind boggling and most of the art in that science is in the assumptions, not the PDE's. Math that really isn't math, in a sense. In retrospect I would probably have been happier doing something that was more mathematical and less dependent on intuition and tradition, but really, it's all good.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:21 PM   #38
Administrator
W2R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 38,950
Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
Leave it to an Aggie!
tee-hee! Yep!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy29 View Post
I was really good at linear algebra. Got an A+ in it. I think I still have the textbook and solutions manual in the garage. I've probably forgotten 2/3 of it...
Gotta like someone who got an A+ in linear algebra! And see? You might end up working through some of those problems after ER, too! Gotta keep your mind sharp.
__________________
Already we are boldly launched upon the deep; but soon we shall be lost in its unshored, harbourless immensities.

- - H. Melville, 1851
W2R is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:27 PM   #39
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 7,533
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndependentlyPoor View Post
I guess that I am not too surprised at the results. The engineers I worked with were all tightwads. Driving a flashy car was definitely looked upon with suspicion. Expensive clothes? Fugetaboutit.
Spending money on that stuff is suboptimal.
__________________
FUEGO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-14-2009, 02:34 PM   #40
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
IndependentlyPoor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Austin
Posts: 1,142
Want2retire, this will help keep you sharp.

The Spider Problem
, first homework in vector calculus and the traumatic event of my sophomore year:

Assume a regular N-gon. The distance from each apex to the center is 1. There is a spider at each apex and they are arranged male-female-male-female....
The spiders all look in the clockwise direction and, seeing a member of the opposite sex, begin pursuit . They all travel at speed 1.

Their paths form a spiral.

Give the equation of the spiral, its arc length, and the time they arrive at the center.
__________________

__________________
IndependentlyPoor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:05 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.