What to reply to "what do you do?" when FIREd

[Cut-Throat]

This "contribute to society" thing is mostly an ego deal.

I hear it mostly from ex-CEOS, that have not come to grips that they are not 'important' any more. They never were, they just didn't know it at the time.

A lot of them try and start some major foundation and start fundraising. Mostly they are a pain in the ass (which is what they were in their previous life). Most of them were really needed at home taking care of their family and spending time with their friends.

 

[riverrat]

My reply to the question "what do you do?" depends on who's doing the askin. If I sense that people are a resentful and think that I should be workin at age 58 and that even in retirement I should be doing something, I love to say that I do as little as possible but when I get the time I eat chips and watch tv.

If they persist then I spring out my business card. I have a web site where I sell crystals and rocks mounted on exotic woods. If I start to peddle my wares they retreat quickly.

 

[haha]

If they persist then I spring out my business card. I have a web site where I sell crystals and rocks mounted on exotic woods. If I start to peddle my wares they retreat quickly.

Could you give the URL? I'd like to look at your stuff.

Mikey

 

[eridanus1]

I'll say this much, if someone retired in their 30s, you better at least be a millionairre, or have some other form of alternate income, or I guarantee you you will be going back to work or you will be roughing it bigtime.

4% of $1MM is $40000. You live in California, right?

 

[JonnyM]

As someone who arrived late to this party, WOW, I must say this thread sure did get interesting, at least based on the Topic, which I have spent some time thinking about.

I am still working so haven't faced the actual question yet, but spend considerable time evangalizing the FIRE concept in a very large office without much success. This group (ER boarders) is an extremely small minority of society, and a fascinating demgraphic to say the least, by far my favorite board on the Internet, and I try to read and contribute to many in my other areas of interest.

I agree with the posters that state that context is essential to giving the best answer, because frankly the reality is so many people just don't "get it". The ER thing is just such a foreign concept. Retirement age to your average Joe is usually 62 or thereabouts, based on that first year of SS eligibility. The more you count back from that, the stranger the idea becomes, until at some point their eyes glaze over, EXCEPT for the fortunate few that do 'get it'.

I work in a place where 10 years early, call it early 50's is very doable for nearly anyone that is motivated, yet hardly anyone does. I am very alone in my plans. Some smile at me, and ask a few questions as to how that can be possible, then realize that it would involve some sort of compromise in their current perceived lifestyle, and quickly decide it is just not possible for reasons that generally don't hold water. OK whatever floats your boat. Work 5 or 10 more years, stay in debt up to your ears, drive those two new cars, get the latest thing that Jones guy has, because your neighbors and friends, and relatives have 'em, and in the case of my coworkers, if their health holds out, they will be fine at 58 or 61 or 65. It will work for them, and they'll just be "retired"

Did they or I contribute to society? You betcha. Our jobs directly effect and improve the lives of others. This branch of this thread leaves me wondering what that has do with the price of rice, but I know in my heart of hearts that the work that I do, and the work that I did made a difference in people's lives and for the better. I just don't see what that has to do with what age I choose to change careers. Isn't ER just a different job after all. Low pay, but very flexible hours? Freedom to pursue other interests?

I don't have to earn a high salary or ANY salary to contribute to society, Do I? My hobbies are Art related. DW and I create glass and silver art and art jewerlry. I enjoy writing and performing music. Do I ever expect to make a dime of either of these endeavours? Nope. I intend to devote just as much time to them as they merit each and every day of ER, anywhere from hours to well, zero. If the thread question comes from someone that I don't know, I expect I'll say I'm and "artist" and see where the conversations goes. Anyone that I'm close to that I think might benefit from by ER diatribe will get both barrels, or until their eyes glaze over. I do think perception matters, and in some circles being preceived as too young to be 'unemployed' would make others uncomfortable. Depending on the situation, we may choose to avoid that effect, then again we may not.

 

[BUM]

I agree with the posters that state that context is essential to giving the best answer, because frankly the reality is so many people just don't "get it". The ER thing is just such a foreign concept.

Better late than never JonnyM.

DW and I were having this very conversation over coffee this morning as we enter ER. And context is the key. In most situations DW and I have been in so far has been casual acquaintances asking, "Well, whatever will you do?". Not wanting to be bothered with keeping differing witty comeback stories straight. We simply say, "Not sure, were taking a year off to think about it." Everybody says, "Wow thats great. I wish I could do that."

BUM

 

[Nords]

I've said it before, some days are so damn productive that I wish I could take a vacation. Mostly those are yardwork days.

Someday I'd like to meet two legends: (1) The guy who retires, in six months has his house looking like a real estate model and his yard looking like a golf course, and subsequently sits around moaning about how bored he is, and (2) the working-for-the-rest-of-his-sad-life guy who whines "But waddya DO all day?!?".

Then I'd lock those two into an airtight room and throw away the key...

Or maybe I just have my surfing priorities screwed up again.

 

[Sparky]

When most people ask this question, we respond with "We work part time out of our home". That's the end of that conversation. No one yet has said, "Wow, how interesting, tell me more about your part time job."

We've told a few friends that we are taking a couple of years off.

At 44, only our accountant knows the truth. And he had a hard time with it.

I agree with Mikey - if you tell people you are retired at 44, the next mental leap is, you must be rich, crazy or a drug dealer.

 

[Beachbumz]

I agree with Mikey - if you tell people you are retired at 44, the next mental leap is, you must be rich, crazy or a drug dealer.

If you are a drug dealer, then you are not retired. So, must just be rich and/or crazy!

 

[riverrat]

mikey,

since we want to keep this message board free from commercial opportunists I think I'll refrain from posting my website's url for now.

Wonder what majority contributors to this board think about this?

 

[laurence]

Whoa, as a really late arrival to this thread, I'm really surprised at this conversation!

azanon, what's up with the cockroach reference? Eewww! My parents ER'd in a nice middle class house, home schooled my younger brothers and sisters during jr.High, who are all going to top teir schools now via scholarships etc., participate in many civic activities etc. No one in the family "looked down on them" for doing it. Of course you should care what your family thinks of you, but their opinion should be based on are you a good father/husband/brother/son, not "is he vice president of the corporation yet?" If they do, I feel very bad for you. No one said on their deathbed, "man, I wish I had spent more weekends in the office!"

Frankly, I find it interesting that you worry what the neighbors would think, then say some pretty downright nasty things about people you don't know, just because their house wasn't painted or whatever. It sounds like an insecurity disease of some sort, and I hope I don't catch it! It's obvious you have stong opinions on how people should be valued, that's fine. But your mistake is assuming everyone else has that value system. By all means, keep working if it makes you feel better.

 

[JOhn Galt]

Hey ronin, I never have surfed, but have acquired just about every ear problem known to medical science. I often thought it may be related to all that time I used to spend in the water (some of it not too pristine). Anyway,
I just stay out of it now (water) except for hot tubs and
a little "branch" in my bourbon

JG

 

[preben]

Thanks for all the great replies! Cheers, Ben

 

[Nords]

Re: What's wrong with "I'm retired!!"  ?!?

Just got the word from my doctor that my good ear is 1/3 occluded and the one that is giving me problems is growing a surfer's knot and closing off.   Friggin' surfer's ear!  I had to explain it to her.  She's going to verify my diagnosis on the internet.   :-/

Ouch. Sorry to hear that, Ronin. Keep us posted, man. Sounds like you need a surfing doctor, and I don't mean the Internet.

I've often wondered if Monterey diving days (wetsuits, couldn't afford drysuits) did the same to one of my ears. I've been strictly warm-water since then and I'm not eager to test the hypothesis...

 

[John Galt]

I know nothing specific about surfer's ear, but I do have
a lot of experience with ear problems.
In general, surgery should be a last resort. I have heard of folks who ended up worse off than before
they had it. I have a whole collection of ear afflictions,
but until I go stone deaf, I will skip the surgery option.

JG

 

[Martha]

There is something about the question "what do you do?" that has an elitist feel to it.

When my husband retired from a regular paycheck in his 40s, I think there were a number of people who thought he was a drug dealer. Once over a period of several weeks he made some large cash withdrawls from the bank. Our bank is pretty small and he had the same teller each time. On the last withdrawl, the teller asked "Mr. X, you are retired aren't you?" and my husband said she seemed uncomfortable. I was worried there would be agents of some sort knocking on our door.

The women at work think that I am the luckiest person around. I have a husband at home who cooks and cleans.

Martha

 

[preben]

As an expat I have often met partners/husbonds of women working abroad (embassies/companies/whatever) and while I of course envy them I generally experienced that other (mostly male) expats looked down on them.

Not that it would stop me from becoming an expat spouse! Any takers? 8)

 

[brewer12345]

There is something about the question "what do you do?" that has an elitist feel to it.  

When my husband  retired from a regular paycheck in his 40s, I think there were a number of people who thought he was a drug dealer.  Once over a period of several weeks he made some large cash withdrawls from the bank.  Our bank is pretty small and he had the same teller each time.  On the last withdrawl, the teller asked "Mr. X, you are retired aren't you?" and my husband said she seemed uncomfortable.  I was worried there would be agents of some sort knocking on our door.  

The women at work think that I am the luckiest person around.  I have a husband at home who cooks and cleans.

Martha
 

Martha, I think that nosy qustions and a general air of too much interest in your personal business would probably inspire me to change banks. Bigger banks and brokers and those catering to the well off tend not to be ruffled by such transactions.

 

[ESRBob]

Great thread -- I especially liked cut-throat's analysis of why so many former CEO's continue to be bothering people trying to be important and start foundations-- hilarious and right on target! (as an ex-ceo who did just that until i realized it was just ego balm and shut it down).

And Mikey's idea that ER solves work problems like divorce solves marriage problems -- sort of a suicidal final solution... intriguing, but I am with Nords that we should be proud to be ER, and we need to get that way by being proud of the way we spend our days. If you aren't then do something different.

I respect azanon's opinions -- it may reflect his having been in a closer family/community than others, so there is more sense of belonging and cross-obligation. When we all talk about spending more time with our families, we may be yearning for that sort of close bond, too, and it carries obligations on both sides.

In my view, education is the big conundrum: society puts lot of resources into educating youth with the hope that we'll figure out how to solve some of our collective problems later on down the road. So if you are really just hanging up your spurs for a life devoted to the care and feeding of your pot-belly, then you could be short-changing society.

The other conundrum for me is defense: lots of people are working hard and putting their lives on the line so I can be safe here in the good ole USA. Just like the bumper sitcker says, 'freedom isn't free', we don't get all the comforts of the modern world without a lot of sacrifices made by a lot of people. What is my obligation in return, especially if I don't pay taxes? Simply buying stuff isn't enough to make a vibrant culture and society worthy of defending and passing on to our kids.

My way out of these conundrums is to say to myself, "I may not do work in the way others do, but I am doing something I like and which one day I expect could be valuable to others if only in a small way". My 'contribution' is theoretical, future and modest: my scultpture hobby means I am learning to create art which people may be able to enjoy (or hate) and studying yoga means I might one day be able to teach it to elderly, over-stressed or over-weight people, or just people trying to clear the mental fog. Day to day I try to 'contribute to society' simply by not being another stressed out *******. (some days I contribute more than others in that regard!)

Azanon, you can be a biologist, but you could be something else you like even better, if you had a few years to make a transition. You may not have an obligation to your family to have a high-status role in Little Rock society by their definition, but if you can figure out how to apply your skills and interests in some measured way toward doing something for the good of the tribe, then maybe that is the middle ground you are looking for.

Certainly just staying at work doesn't justify being a miserable son-of-a-gun any more than having money justifies being a selfish lay-about.

 

[laurence]

I agree we need to be good citizens, that freedom isn't free, and there is a social contract, but I don't understand how being ER'ed violates that. If it's a taxes contributed issue, I believe ER's play plenty of it between capital gains, property tax, sales tax etc. just not payroll tax. In addition, if you have saved enough to ER, you probably made more during your working years than average, and you probably paid more taxes than average. In addition, your burden on society is so much less as an ER. Example, you're not clogging the freeway at rush hour, you drive less in general releasing less CO2 into the atmosphere, you can run your appliances at off peak hours, you buy your meals during non rush times at resturants and help support businesses that otherwise would be losing money on employees utilities etc. When you leave your job, you save the company money, while opening up a new position for a younger, less expensive employee, boosting shareholder profit...I could go on forever, but my point is I think ERing is the socially responsible thing to do!

 

[azanon]

4% of $1MM is $40000. You live in California, right?

My apology, i was talking about living, not existing.  Also, if that would constitute living for you, are you absolutely sure nothing's going to happen over the course of a potential 50-60 year retirement to lower that withdrawal rate?  If so, by all means, pull the trigger with a mil.

I value safety, security, comfort, and responsibility above freedom.  Quitting a job in my 30s that i worked 25 years in school to get (from age 6 to grad school) would easily be the dumbest thing I could ever do, IMHO.

Again, my very point is i realize the masses are quite comfort with peanuts for income.  I know this for a fact cause I see it with my own eyes everytime i drive through my small hometown in Arkansas; those dilapidated houses I spoke of earlier.  I will always prefer comfort - 40hrs/week of work, until I can get the same level of comfort minus the work.

ER or comfortable, deserving-of-respect living?   My answer is, and will be both, thank you very much ;-).  The irony here is you guys advocating retiring to live on virtually nothing are actually the status quo.  I'm the outlier.  There's all kinds of people from my small hometown living on nothing, have nothing, and you can certainly find many of them inside their "house" at 2pm on a Thursday.

 

[RockMiner]

IMO the best gift you can give to society is to avoid becoming a burden on it.

Accomplishing this should be enough, and It would be, if more made it a goal.

 

[azanon]

IMO the best gift you can give to society is to avoid becoming a burden on it.

Its too bad so few think that way. 9 out of 10 people will not receive that explanation well. You'll say it, then they'll just think you're lazy just the same.

 

[laurence]

azanon,

No one is saying live in a dumpster or go without health insurance. I think everyone would agree that you should ER if you are risking true poverty/destitution. But the definition of comfortable is different for each person. If you are only comfortable with a house that impresses/intimitades your friends and associates, and a luxury car that does the same, that's your preference. Others need less than that. And what's with "deserving of respect" ? From who, you? Who gives a crap what others think, especially if they judge you for material posessions? They should judge you for who you are, not what you own. I'm curious, are you just trolling, because if you are, I commend you for your subtlety and sophistication.....

 

[gia6898]

Seriously, I've met janitors I have more respect for than some of my co-workers.  It is pretty sad when people are judged by their salary or their material possessions.