Electrical Circuit out - tracking it down

[Chuckanut]

Just in time for record heat, one electrical circuit in my home has stopped working. Several rooms have lost their lights and about 6 outlets are not working. I can live with it for a few days but if I can fix it quickly that would be better.

Of course, it's Sunday on one of the hottest days of the year (over 100). My plan to beat the heat was to do a lot of nothing today while drinking iced coffee, ice water and beer.

Yes, I have checked and re-checked the circuit breakers. Something similar happened several years ago. Quite by accident I discovered when I wiggled a plug in one of the outlets, the power came back on for a few seconds, then it was out again. I replaced the outlet and things were fine.

This time after wiggling plugs in as many outlets as I can reach, no good news. What can I do next to track down the fault?

 

[braumeister]

Circuit breakers can go bad. I would start by replacing that one.

 

[38Chevy454]

Agree with Braumeister, since it seems all plugs and lights on that circuit are out. If you have a voltmeter you can check if the breaker is allowing voltage to pass through.

 

[jazz4cash]

How old is the home? Do you have Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter (GFCI) outlets? Are any of the outlets located outdoors or near a water source e.g kitchen or bath?

 

[Car-Guy]

Almost sound like a bad CB or maybe just the wire connecting to the CB. That's where I'd start checking.

 

[Chuckanut]

How old is the home? Do you have Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter (GFCI) outlets? Are any of the outlets located outdoors or near a water source e.g kitchen or bath?

The home is about 40 years old.

Good point. I made certain the GFCI is reset, though I suppose it could have problems like any other outlet.

 

[GTFan]

Another problem is bad backstab connections, common in older homes where backstabs were used (like mine). One bad outlet in a circuit can take all of them out. Usually happens when you have a high load on a circuit, like a window A/C. The fun part is figuring out which outlet is bad because it can be any of them, but if you can get a non-contact A/C voltage tester all you have to do is unscrew each outlet cover and put it next to the hot wire to see if you have power coming into a bad one.

 

[Freedom56]

Start at the breaker panel and look for breaker that tripped and reset it. I recently had a GFCI circuit whose breaker tripped but could not be reset after my wife plugged in an appliance that drew too much power. This was the first time I saw a breaker fail. The circuit was connected to GFCI outlets in some of the bathrooms and garage but nothing was plugged into those outlets. I tried resetting at the outlets but the breaker remained tripped. I cut the main power off and replaced the circuit breaker with a new one with the same rating, restored power, and the issue was resolved.

 

[Chuckanut]

I appreciate the suggestions.

I found my $7 Voltage Tester made by a company called Garden Bender.

It indicates there is power to these outlets and the wall switches. So, the circuit breaker must be OK.

 

[NW-Bound]

Another problem is bad backstab connections, common in older homes where backstabs were used (like mine). One bad outlet in a circuit can take all of them out. Usually happens when you have a high load on a circuit, like a window A/C. The fun part is figuring out which outlet is bad because it can be any of them, but if you can get a non-contact A/C voltage tester all you have to do is unscrew each outlet cover and put it next to the hot wire to see if you have power coming into a bad one.

A bad connection like this could cause a fire. It could be a lot worse than just losing power.

 

[finnski1]

I appreciate the suggestions.

I found my $7 Voltage Tester made by a company called Garden Bender.

It indicates there is power to these outlets and the wall switches. So, the circuit breaker must be OK.

If there's power to the outlets then how come you said that the outlets were "not working" Am I missing something? Is it now working but wasn't earlier?

 

[omni550]

Check ALL your GFCIs to make sure one is not tripped. I had a guest bathroom GFCI tripped and it also killed the circuits on the other side of the house.

omni

 

[Chuckanut]

If there's power to the outlets then how come you said that the outlets were "not working" Am I missing something? Is it now working but wasn't earlier?

Well, the voltage tester says there is power. It flashes and beeps continually. But nothing I plug in works. And the light switches have the same issue. The Voltage Tester flashes and beeps, but the lights don't come on.


I tested the voltage tester on a socket that is controlled by a light switch. Power Off the tester give one beap and stops. Power On, the tester beeps and flashed like crazy.

Is it possible I have very low voltage in the wire? Enough to trigger the tester but not enough to power anything of use? Right now I am shooting in the dark hoping to hit something.

 

[mountainsoft]

the voltage tester says there is power. It flashes and beeps continually. But nothing I plug in works.

Sounds like a bad connection to me (high resistance). You can measure a voltage, but the resistance is too high to carry a full load. Note, resistance means heat, which could result in a fire!

Personally, I would just turn off the power and replace all of the outlets that are not operating. Outlets are cheap and if it's an old house they're probably getting worn out anyway. A bulk pack of 10 outlets is like $10-15 at the box stores. Might as well install new cover plates while you've got them off. I replaced all the outlets at my mom's old house (a few dozen) in an afternoon. It's not a hard job.

If it were me, I would probably replace the breaker too just to be sure it's working properly (a power surge took out a few of our GFCI outlets and breakers a couple years ago). Just make sure you get the right breaker for your panel (take the old one to the store to match up if you can).

 

[mountainsoft]

Another problem is bad backstab connections, common in older homes where backstabs were used (like mine). One bad outlet in a circuit can take all of them out.

Which is why I never use backstab connectors. I also prefer not to wire "through" an outlet. I always connect the incoming and outgoing wires together with wire nuts, with dedicated pigtail wires for the outlet. Assuming you have enough space in the box, of course. Even if you take the outlet out of the circuit, the rest will continue to work.

 

[Chuckanut]

I think I've got it. The symptoms seem to match this diagnosis.

Somewhere I have a bad neutral connection. Some other outlets work on this circuit. Some don't. The tester says that it detects power going in on the hot wire. Somewhere I have an open neutral and at that point and farther down the line, nothing works even though the hot wire is powered up.

The Voltage tester just senses voltage in the hot wire. Sot the tester things everything is A-OK. But, a busted neutral won't trigger any warnings in my little sensor. So, I am off to the hardware store for a tester that will tell me if the entire circuit is OK, including the neutral.

Makes sense?

 

[Freedom56]

I appreciate the suggestions.

I found my $7 Voltage Tester made by a company called Garden Bender.

It indicates there is power to these outlets and the wall switches. So, the circuit breaker must be OK.

Have you considered using a multi-meter? You may have a short in your circuit. Either one of your black or white wires may have come off and is shorting to ground. This will cause your lights and anything you plug in not to operate.

 

[Bamaman]

How old is the home? Do you have Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter (GFCI) outlets? Are any of the outlets located outdoors or near a water source e.g kitchen or bath?

I once had the same thing happen. I finally found a GFC circuit in the basement to be the start of that upstairs circuit of outlets.

It always pays to take time to map a home's electrical system. That means figuring out which circuits have GFC outlets and which plugs go to them.

I also diagram all circuits and lights and note which circuit breaker goes to which rooms. Makes diagnosing a problem quick & efficient.

I'm presently without hot water for our downstairs. I rebuilt the hot water heater, but it's still kicking off the circuit breakers. A plumber's coming tomorrow to just replace the hot water heater. $ $

 

[Jerry1]

Go get one of these.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Klein-Tools-GFCI-Receptacle-Tester-RT210/206517824

It will test for bad and improper connections along with open neutral.

 

[CaptTom]

I think I've got it. The symptoms seem to match this diagnosis.

Somewhere I have a bad neutral connection. Some other outlets work on this circuit. Some don't. The tester says that it detects power going in on the hot wire. Somewhere I have an open neutral and at that point and farther down the line, nothing works even though the hot wire is powered up.

The Voltage tester just senses voltage in the hot wire. Sot the tester things everything is A-OK. But, a busted neutral won't trigger any warnings in my little sensor. So, I am off to the hardware store for a tester that will tell me if the entire circuit is OK, including the neutral.

Makes sense?

Yes, a loose neutral somewhere along a daisy-chained string of outlets would do that. I'd also bet on backstabbed connections, but even a screw terminal can be improperly installed or come lose. I like the idea of replacing them as you go. You're going to be in there checking connections anyway. Just for future reference, do one at a time and make a note of which downstream outlets and lights suddenly start working. You might be able to figure out what order (from the breaker) they're connected in, up to a point.

I'd throw away that little sensor, unless you can figure out why it's showing you what you think is a normal connection when there's no neutral. I thought those things would show you various conditions like missing ground, ground fault, reverse polarity and no neutral. But first, check the manual, maybe all that blinking is trying to tell you something.

 

[ERD50]

... I'd throw away that little sensor, .....

It sounds like a 'sniffer' type, not very useful for finding faults - as mentioned you can have a poor connection that bleeds enough current to sense, but not enough to power a lamp. And a connection like that can start a fire.

Go get one of these.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Klein-Tools-GFCI-Receptacle-Tester-RT210/206517824

It will test for bad and improper connections along with open neutral.

That type is better, but still, those little neon lights or LEDs take very little current. Try plugging a 100 watt old style bulb, or other high current device (toaster, heater, etc) into the outlet with the tester, and swap them. That will test it under load.

If the OP can figure which outlets are closest to the panel, start at the close end. That's not always obvious though.

-ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

Just in time for record heat, one electrical circuit in my home has stopped working. Several rooms have lost their lights and about 6 outlets are not working. I can live with it for a few days but if I can fix it quickly that would be better.

I would remove the covers of all the dead outlets, and pull out the receptacles to examine. If a connection is loose, just some motion will wiggle it enough to cause an intermittent contact.

If nothing found, I would continue pulling nearby outlets.

Of course, this assumes that you have looked at the start of the circuit first, meaning at the distribution box or breaker panel. Use a meter to check the output terminal of all breakers after resetting them. Tighten all the neutral connections on the neutral bar, and the ground connections on ground bar too.


PS. By the way, if the lighting in several rooms plus 6 outlets share one circuit, the original electrician should be tracked down and hanged.

 

[Ronstar]

I would replace the breaker with a GFCI breaker and replace any GFCI receptacles on the circuit with standard receptacles. Then I would check every receptacle to see what's going on.

I've had problems with GFCI's years after building and this solved my problem.

 

[Car-Guy]

Go get one of these.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Klein-Tools-GFCI-Receptacle-Tester-RT210/206517824

It will test for bad and improper connections along with open neutral.

+1

I use mine often

 

[427Vette]

I PS. By the way, if the lighting in several rooms plus 6 outlets share one circuit, the original electrician should be tracked down and hanged.

Really? How exactly should it be wired?