The next generation coming of age - We are all doomed !!

[Bigdawg]

Spacex is one of many players that have entered the market because of skyrocketing costs at Boeing, LM, and NASA. Spacex did receive government funding but it was also the first one to receive significant private sector funding from Google and Fidelity ($1 billion). There was zero government funding in the development of Falcon Heavy.

"As of May 2012[update], SpaceX had operated on total funding of approximately $1 billion in its first ten years of operation. Of this, private equity provided about $200M, with Musk investing approximately $100M and other investors having put in about $100M (Founders Fund, Draper Fisher Jurvetson, ...).[80] The remainder has come from progress payments on long-term launch contracts and development contracts. As of April 2012[update], NASA had put in about $400–500M of this amount, with most of that as progress payments on launch contracts."

Seems to me that half of SpaceX funding came from NASA (Government). I don't have a problem with that. The government funds all kinds of military/tech projects, DARPA, RDT&E $ for the private sector.

 

[Freedom56]

"As of May 2012[update], SpaceX had operated on total funding of approximately $1 billion in its first ten years of operation. Of this, private equity provided about $200M, with Musk investing approximately $100M and other investors having put in about $100M (Founders Fund, Draper Fisher Jurvetson, ...).[80] The remainder has come from progress payments on long-term launch contracts and development contracts. As of April 2012[update], NASA had put in about $400–500M of this amount, with most of that as progress payments on launch contracts."

Seems to me that half of SpaceX funding came from NASA (Government). I don't have a problem with that. The government funds all kinds of military/tech projects, DARPA, RDT&E $ for the private sector.

What about the private funding in 2015 from Google and Fidelity?

https://techcrunch.com/2015/01/20/spacex-raises-1-billion-in-new-funding-from-google-and-fidelity/

There is a big difference between Spacex and NASA and other companies that rely on government welfare. As they say, it takes five NASA employees to do the work of one. It take one Spacex employee to do the work of five. There is a big difference between companies that live on government welfare like NASA, LM, and Boeing's space division and Spacex that have to work on fixed price contracts and internally fund new development. I worked my entire career for technology companies that funded their own development and product marketing. It was a "survival of the fittest" environment and the leadership of the company took risks. We paid our employees much more than government employees or companies that lived on government welfare. We also tended to attract better caliber talent and operated with far fewer staff. In the environment I worked, there was nowhere to hide, you either produced or carried you box out the door. What Elon Musk has done with Spacex, is take the practices of technology companies, and apply it to an Aerospace industry that has spent their lives on government welfare and did little to innovate. Look what Spacex has accomplished in such a short history - 49 successful launches, dropping the cost of a launch to a fraction of their counterparts in this country, and establishing a viable commercial launch platform that can compete in the international satellite launch business. Give credit where credit is due.

 

[kgtest]

I don't think I ever gave a thought to car maintenance or any other kind of maintenance when I was that age. 18-year-olds have other things on their minds.

Sideswiped at 16, paid for a weld and did all the other swapping of parts myself from U pull. Was that or buy a new car.

Did my first engine swap at 19 after blowing mine. Paid $500 for the engine. Did the clutch at the same time.

Been doing much of my own automotive repair since, occasionally hire out welding and painting. Now these folks are willing to do the work right in my garage don't even need to drive. If its below 30 degrees I delay until the garage is warm, or pay someone.

Still rotate my own tires, breaks, fluids, wipers, filters and other incidentals that are easy. plugs, heads, intake manifolds, gaskets although when you start tearing down the block I might hesitate. I hate crawling under the car if its rusty or wet. If its dry I'll do the starter and alternator work. I've dropped tanks and swapped fuel pumps.

Finding the replacement motors at a reasonable cost sometimes makes replacing gaskets seem illogical.

I think you need to enjoy it to be able to work on your own stuff. If its not something of interest it just isn't of interest. I used to fix friends problems, but they are never willing to help, keep hands in their pockets and don't even have a desire to learn.

Its sort of like investing, if you don't take an interest, you likely don't know much about it.

The way I look at it the more DIY I do the sooner I can quit work. So far its been helpful.

 

[Pilot2013]

Can millennials change a light bulb?

Too funny!

 

[always_learning]

I am going to give the OP the benefit of the doubt and take his post as a "last straw" kind of thing, where it was just one more in a long line of things that made him shake his head.

That said, I have a lot of patience for an 18y/o kid who is probably still in school or working at a first job and is inundated with, my kids' favorite phrase, "learning to adult".

I suspect we (as a society) will see a lot more of the "wait, I have to check the oil in my car??" stuff as we (as a society) become more technologically advanced. Tech has a strange draw for the younger folks, and they seem to exclude learning about other things in life. I love to learn about almost any topic but plenty of people have only a few areas of interest. As a DIYer, I find it sad that so many skills are being lost to tech advances/tech interest/tech tunnel vision.

All of that to say that I do believe we should be routinely checking fluids & air in the tires and have taught our kids to do so. My 20something millennial DS also pulled out the owner's manual and changed his flat tire recently when he blew a tire in the middle of nowhere. He had never seen a tire being changed before, but he figured it out.

 

[always_learning]

Can millennials change a light bulb?

Yup. That's what we've noticed with our kids' peers. They don't know to even try to do it on their own because they have been spoon-fed everything. It's really sad.

My kids have apartments (college) with roommates... my kids are the ones who end up going to the office to report broken items or request repairs. It's like no one else has any desire to "take care" of themselves. Two apartments with a total of eight roommates and no one else will see to it that things get fixed.

Can millennials change a light bulb?

Too funny!

That was fabulous.

However, I now have an earworm for Obladi Oblada (Life Goes On). Thank you.

 

[bUU]

I suspect we (as a society) will see a lot more of the "wait, I have to check the oil in my car??" stuff as we (as a society) become more technologically advanced.

That's a good point. As much as oldsters shake their heads at youngsters who cannot change their own oil, I'm sure youngsters shake their heads at oldsters who cannot figure out how to take advantage of the many services that are on the verge of becoming "online only".

 

[pj.mask]

Wouldn’t it be logical to expect older people to have more experience? Not knowing how to change your oil is a problem but so is being condescending superior - the difference is one can easily learn how to change oil once they are made aware and the other is a behavioral trait that is much harder to correct.

I’m glad people have different talents because the guy who changes oil for a living probably makes a terrible software programmer and visa-versa. As this thread started out - it takes talent to be book smart and make straight A’s - society tends to value this (monetarily) more than changing oil. Some people like pointing out someone else’s weakness to make themselves feel superior.

 

[kimcdougc]

My dad taught me how to check the oil and change a tire before I could get my drivers license.

Fast forward, DH taught both DD (29 years) and DS (37 years) all the ins and outs of taking care of their vehicles.

 

[Pilot2013]

Wouldn’t it be logical to expect older people to have more experience? Not knowing how to change your oil is a problem but so is being condescending superior - the difference is one can easily learn how to change oil once they are made aware and the other is a behavioral trait that is much harder to correct.

I’m glad people have different talents because the guy who changes oil for a living probably makes a terrible software programmer and visa-versa. As this thread started out - it takes talent to be book smart and make straight A’s - society tends to value this (monetarily) more than changing oil. Some people like pointing out someone else’s weakness to make themselves feel superior.

Judgmental much? I think the premise is that they don't know that there is oil to be checked, much less how to add it, or god forbid change it if they want to save a few bucks.

 

[KCGeezer]

I was talking to DS a few weeks ago and he said he had a taillight out. He said he stopped at the place he had his brakes done and they wanted $30 to fix it. He thanked them, went home, looked at the manual and had it replaced in about 30 minutes. There is hope.

 

[REWahoo]

He thanked them, went home, looked at the manual and had it replaced in about 30 minutes. There is hope.

I was surprised to read "manual" as almost all DIY repair instructions are available on YouTube! My 19 year-old grandson did a similar job a couple of weeks ago but would never think of reading a book when he could watch a video.

 

[KCGeezer]

Well, I think his exact words were “I figured it out”.

 

[ncbill]

I was talking to DS a few weeks ago and he said he had a taillight out. He said he stopped at the place he had his brakes done and they wanted $30 to fix it. He thanked them, went home, looked at the manual and had it replaced in about 30 minutes. There is hope.

Replacing a headlight bulb on my newest vehicle requires removing the entire front "grill" assembly (6 bolts) before one can gain access to the rear of the headlight housing.

 

[KCGeezer]

He’s an early LBYM type, ‘83 Buick he’s had since college.

 

[Clone]

About 20 years ago, my younger son was in 6th grade or so. He came home from school one day and asked if he could take some tools to school. One of his friends had a leaky faucet (or something similar) and they didn't know how to fix it. They were going to call a plumber. My son said,"Dad, they don't even have a screw driver in their house!!".

We used to have a bunch of neighbor hood kids around our place. We were the interesting place to be, because our kids 'did stuff'. They were always building or fixing something, and I usually had some interesting projects to work on. We re-shingled a garage, fixed up lawn mowers, build R/C stuff, etc. A lot of kids don't get their hands dirty anymore, Mom and Dad work at a desk, so they don't have a place to practice and learn. But many of them will pick it up if given some guidance and a chance.

 

[bUU]

Wouldn’t it be logical to expect older people to have more experience?

Of course, though to be fair, "more experience," does not necessarily translate into, "more operationally useful experience," and especially doesn't necessarily translate into, "more currently relevant, operationally useful experience." The prototypical example is some operationally useful experience regarding how to address a problem with some part of a vehicle engine which is now obsolete because that part of vehicle engines is no so substantially integrated into the computer control systems of the vehicle that the legacy knowledge is worthless.

Not knowing how to change your oil is a problem but so is being condescending superior - the difference is one can easily learn how to change oil once they are made aware and the other is a behavioral trait that is much harder to correct.

That actually raises an interesting point: Millennials are different than prior generations in several ways, as we've been noting, but the most notable differences are actually a set of character traits that are more prevalent in that generation than in previous generations, including their penchant for collaboration and cooperation, stemming from their choice to live hyperconnected lives. That drives those folks to more consistently value all contributions equally. As a generation, us baby boomers have practically no chance of developing the skills necessary to compete with the Millennials on this character trait that has become among the most important in many contexts, both vocational and avocational.

 

[marko]

.... including their penchant for collaboration and cooperation, stemming from their choice to live hyperconnected lives. That drives those folks to more consistently value all contributions equally.

This is very insightful. It explains a lot of the disconnects, for me anyway.

Of course, valuing all contributions equally can get in the way of defining a proper direction, but it seems that everyone feeling good about a wrong direction is better than conflict; who's to say that's a bad thing as we go forward. (Might this explain the "leadership gap" at FB?)

 

[Nemo2]

but it seems that everyone feeling good about a wrong direction is better than conflict

Lemmings as an example?

 

[Pilot2013]

including their penchant for collaboration and cooperation, stemming from their choice to live hyperconnected lives. That drives those folks to more consistently value all contributions equally.

I can think of several people from several generations ago that thought heavily this way too. Those society's failed over the test of time, however.

 

[joeea]

but it seems that everyone feeling good about a wrong direction is better than conflict; who's to say that's a bad thing as we go forward.

Me. I'll say it's a bad thing if nobody else will. That statement is nonsense.

Some things aren't important and perhaps "feeling good" is most important.
But in the real world, many things are important enough to need a real answer rather than a "feel good" answer.

For example, we are discussing this in the context of an Early Retirement forum. When someone talks about retiring early using a financially unsound approach, I think it's far better to point out the problems and risks, rather than make the OP feel good.

I believe in the truth rather than just going along with the hive mind whenever the truth is important. And I value expertise - I don't think everyone's answer counts the same. Some folks (and clearly some folks in this forum) offer answers but simply don't know what they are talking about - sorry if that offends some.

If you prefer to wear orange and it makes you look foolish, I might just say "that's nice". But if you want to invest your life savings in bitcoin in hopes of retiring next year, I'd like to think intelligent people would point out the risks involved. And I'd like to think intelligent people would prefer an honest answer.

 

[bUU]

I can think of several people from several generations ago that thought heavily this way too. Those society's failed over the test of time, however.

What a weird claim. This is very much a new phenomenon in the US - a whole generation so substantially different than the previous generations. Trying to project some qualitative point from "several people" thinking in a way you claim is the same as this generational shift is piling assumption on top of assumption. Beyond that, that generation WILL be in charge when we are just a few survivors. This claim of yours seems to be disaster-wishing yourself.

In reality, the closest comparison to the Millennials is the first generation in Japan after WWII, a society transformed into one grounded in collaboration. Ask the Big Three carmakers how successful Japan was once that post-war generation became the ones in charge in Japan.

 

[bUU]

I believe in the truth rather than ...

I suspect though that you assume that truth is what you agree with. That tends to despoil analysis you build on top of that assumption.

 

[MichaelB]

I don’t agree with marko but that opinion is certainly not “nonsense”.

These generational rants bring out some harsh views. We can disagree without being disagreeable.

 

[Pilot2013]

What a weird claim. This is very much a new phenomenon in the US

I should have clarified, I am talking other countries.... Europe, FORMER USSR, etc. Karl Marx comes to mind.