Fedup
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Ouch, TSLA stock drops 36 dollars, it’s $270.
Thoughts on TESLA
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bobandsherry
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Opportunity is knocking, you answering the door?
Fedup
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Falling knife I think.
Tempting, but I will wait until it finds a bottom. Looks like Tesla may be forced to bring in a "real" CEO. If so, will Tesla become a better run company?
kcowan
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
The board seems to support Musk so a new CEO might need a new board.
From what I have heard the SEC wants Musk to resign. We are at the beginning stages of a negotiated deal to make the charges go away.
bobandsherry
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What do you think is bottom?
Better run perhaps, but from stock price the Musk premium goes away, stock is then easily under $200.
bobandsherry
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The initial deal was Musk steps down for 2 years. I'd say the deal doesn't get better in that regard, but could be wrong.
Running_Man
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I find it amusing to hear from TESLA bulls "everyone is just hating on MUSK he is the genius and better than anyone" to now "Tesla will be a greater company without Musk"
Tesla without Musk is bankrupt, it is only the shell game Elon has played that has allowed for large grants of tax remediation, customer credits, cheap loans and high stock price to maintain the drive for his global vision of personally controlling the world's power grid and transportation network. It was never run as a caretaker of investor assets but an investment vehicle to fund Elon Musk's personal goals, which has motivated a great many people to believe in those goals.
Selling on fundamentals without Musk it will get swallowed up in asset sales and diluted shareholder interest . It is so corporately dis functional as an operating entity that a new CEO would have too many fires to put out without the cache of Elon Musk to put a fog over any issues.
I have no doubt in the 3rd quarter they have cherry picked as many high value orders as possible they had in their order book and may well show a small profit, but the days of 5% interest on billions of loans and no need for marketing of cars will be over and it will operate as a real company with real cash flow issues and real investors demanding a real plan. With as many shorts as there are in this stock this can have some violent upside rallies, but the SEC has made clear Musk has to go and I do not see how he can survive this.
Tesla without Musk is bankrupt, it is only the shell game Elon has played that has allowed for large grants of tax remediation, customer credits, cheap loans and high stock price to maintain the drive for his global vision of personally controlling the world's power grid and transportation network. It was never run as a caretaker of investor assets but an investment vehicle to fund Elon Musk's personal goals, which has motivated a great many people to believe in those goals.
Selling on fundamentals without Musk it will get swallowed up in asset sales and diluted shareholder interest . It is so corporately dis functional as an operating entity that a new CEO would have too many fires to put out without the cache of Elon Musk to put a fog over any issues.
I have no doubt in the 3rd quarter they have cherry picked as many high value orders as possible they had in their order book and may well show a small profit, but the days of 5% interest on billions of loans and no need for marketing of cars will be over and it will operate as a real company with real cash flow issues and real investors demanding a real plan. With as many shorts as there are in this stock this can have some violent upside rallies, but the SEC has made clear Musk has to go and I do not see how he can survive this.
The bottom for me will be when I feel like the initial hysteria has settled and no new negative news is expected. Could be soon.
Something tells me that Musk will still be an icon closely associated with the brand. Taking away a title should not change that in the public perception.
Wow. I guess all of those happy Tesla owners must just be confused.
A "ban" that short won't be effective. Given his aura/star power and the grip he has on the BoD, Musk would just be made "special advisor to the CEO" without any official power. He'd be running things through the CEO, who would merely be a figurehead/placeholder until Musk can legally and officially return as CEO.
Going public and taking stockholder money has a price. Musk ceded a lot of flexibility by going this route, but his ambition required cash, and this is the route he picked.
jazz4cash
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
It's a GREAT product. Nothing confusing about that, but it has nothing to do with the issues of TMC or the issues of TSLA.
jazz4cash
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Montana, it that you?
ExFlyBoy5
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Reading on the special manufacturing of the trailers reminds me of the Vert-a-Pack rail car.
https://www.railwayage.com/mechanic...k-in-time-the-gm-southern-pacific-vert-a-pac/
Texas Proud
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I am with Bob.... he had a sweetheart deal and did not take it...
There will be no better deal for Musk... and some on TV thought the SEC might refer to Justice for criminal charges...
He should have taken the deal on the table.. even if he wins (not likely IMO, but others have gotten off when I thought they would not) it will take a good amount of time and Tesla will need some kind of funds between now and then...
This is the disconnect for me regarding critics of Tesla and Musk. He is lambasted by many as a lying and dysfunctional CEO. Yet, replacing him with a more traditional CEO is also deemed a catastrophic event for Tesla. Which is it?
Does it really make sense to anyone here that Tesla survives solely because Musk holds a CEO title? Take away the title and he will still be the public, visionary voice for Tesla. Let's get real. I will abandon investment in Tesla if I see the product failing in the market place. I think the odd hatred (jealousy) of Musk is clouding judgment for many.
Initial offers are the start of a negotiation, not the end point. The point when offers will get no better is when a hearing begins. Until that point the SEC will remain open to counter offers from Tesla and Musk. That being said, Musk may refuse to enter into a negotiated deal and fight it to the bitter end. If so, then anything goes.
mistermike40
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The number of happy GM, Ford, Toyota, Nissan, *or* VW owners far outnumber happy Tesla owners.
I have a feeling when the three years in service TGW numbers come in (on the recent Teslas that were frantically slapped together to try and meet production targets), that disparity will widen considerably.
I have a feeling that you are wrong.
Running_Man
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No if you buy a $100,000 car for $70,000 and get the government to pay $7,500 of that cost in US, or in the EU to not pay any extremely burdensome car taxes you will be pretty happy, so owners are good with the product. This is exactly my problem with Tesla as Musk formed, it is designed to make great cars to be the impetus for government action to fund his vision of TESLA running the electric infrastructure of the world. This is not a business plan this is a long term dream and Musk views the stock market as a necessary short term evil to implement his plan, he is totally unconcerned about his shareholders other than as founders of a global vision. This is why he took in Solar City even though it was bankrupt and made no sense from a financial view, he needs to keep together the whole in order to expand when he can through government funding.
I see Tesla spiked today to 307 on a single trade before falling to a new daily low of 267 was that you getting in?
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bobandsherry
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SEC can very well require that he have no active role in Tesla. Unless there is someone on the Board that has leverage with the SEC, Musk is jerking around the wrong people. SEC can make things very interesting for him, especially when it's time for needed capital.
You are right on both counts though, Tesla is now screwed however you look at it. With Musk they will be challenged as SEC will now be riding him hard. Without Musk Tesla will be challenged as they lose the one person who people were betting on.
That's why I see under $200 as possibility, and if they can't raise capital to cover the convertible bonds coming due it could be as bad as a spiral to BK.
bobandsherry
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Yep, do a search and you can find video of a Tesla fanboy that is now experiencing issues with his car. No longer under warranty Tesla doesn't care about him any more and repairs are expensive. He's turned to repairing his car, buying parts off the internet. Yep, that sounds like a car I want to drop some $$$$$ to buy.
exnavynuke
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Lots of people were happy with K-Mart too... how'd that work out for the company?
Happy customers is not a defining trait of a profitable and sustainable business. While it's preferable to have happy customers over unhappy customers, that customers are happy doesn't mean the business is solid. If McDonald's sold all their food for a penny, customers would go there and smile a lot more, but the business would fail.
We agree that it is good to have happy customers. I would also add that it is good to not have any significant competition for a popular product for the next 2-3 years.
Musk was foolish to send that tweet, but the likely scenario is that he will still work out a settlement that removes the CEO title without barring all interaction with the company (and to pay a fine). Once that settlement is known the stock will bounce back quickly, provided that they can continue to increase production and sales. Musk is one person in a company with thousands going to work everyday. If Musk died tomorrow the company would go on. How many thought Apple could not survive without Steve Jobs?
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