Where to move, and why?

[kcowan]

Take St. Louis MO where I live nearby. While it is a low cost area, it may not be quite as low as it appears. They quote median housing costs as around $139,000 which sounds cheap. However, STL city has not been able to annex with the more prosperous county areas like many big cities have, so the averages will skew some. Most people that I know and certainly myself would have no desire to buy that "median house", even though I am a very median type person.

I used St Louis initially and it show 41% more expensive than PV. But for housing, it compares in city rentals so it is just not representative because many snowbirds do not rent in city. However many comparisons like cost of eggs, bread and beer are very accurate. And it gets better with more participants.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Which fringe suburbs?

My housing costs are low but getting aggravated with the increasing traffic.

Even when I'm not driving, the idea of all those cars idling near my house (about 1/3 of a mile from a major intersection as the crow flies) is something I think about a lot.

There are some nice carless villages in some European countries I've visited.

Places like Cordelia and Discovery Bay. They are the opposite of walkable, though. The reason they are relatively cheap is because they are overbuilt bedroom communities, outside the commute zone unless you don't mind a really long commute. But the newer homes there can be less than half the price of older, high maintenance, less energy efficient homes closer to the City.

 

[explanade]

Places like Cordelia and Discovery Bay. They are the opposite of walkable, though. The reason they are relatively cheap is because they are overbuilt bedroom communities, outside the commute zone unless you don't mind a really long commute. But the newer homes there can be less than half the price of older, high maintenance, less energy efficient homes closer to the City.

OK, I figured something like that.

Or north of Santa Rosa or south of Morgan Hill, east of Pleasanton and so on.

Doesn't really feel like the Bay Area in some of those cases, like you're not near the amenities and such.

 

[explanade]

I used St Louis initially and it show 41% more expensive than PV. But for housing, it compares in city rentals so it is just not representative because many snowbirds do not rent in city. However many comparisons like cost of eggs, bread and beer are very accurate. And it gets better with more participants.

Saw an episode of House Hunters, where a young hipster couple (liked "industrial" look) was shopping for a combination business and residential property where they'd have a photo studio business -- I didn't realize photo studios still existed.

Anyways, they ended up choosing an old fire station, probably like 3-4k sq. feet, for around $150k. There was a lot of renovation work which was needed but he was going to do it himself.

I don't know the exact location but seemed like the money went pretty far.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

OK, I figured something like that.

Or north of Santa Rosa or south of Morgan Hill, east of Pleasanton and so on.

Doesn't really feel like the Bay Area in some of those cases, like you're not near the amenities and such.

I know. I get that, too. I would rather be in a more walkable area, closer to the coast and the Redwoods, and closer in. We haven't checked out north of Santa Rosa yet. That is on our list of things to do.

The price difference is hundreds of thousands of dollars just on house price alone, plus less ongoing maintenance costs for the newer houses in the 'burbs. If we aren't commuting to jobs every day and aren't billionaires, moving 20 - 30 minutes further out of town from a financial point of view makes a lot of sense. I could put a Zen garden in the back yard with a fraction of the money we'd save on the house price.

Plus on an absolute dollars scale, the less expensive houses don't have as far to fall when housing prices get hit and they aren't as expensive to sell, based on a 5% commission. And we would get to reset our capital gains tax exclusion.

 

[explanade]

Well I don't know about Cordelia but Fairfield and Vallejo supposedly have crime problems and they're close to refineries aren't they?

A couple of decades ago, people talked up Sacto, Stockton and maybe Modesto as areas which are likely to see faster growth in real estate values than the Bay Area, which was already seen as overpriced.

That not only failed to happen but there is gang activity around Stockton?

The value of an area further out could be lower housing prices. However, could they also attract more lower-income buyers so that you end up with just as much traffic and maybe as much or more crime?

 

[haha]

It is hard when you are single because there are so many things one could do and no one to negotiate with to narrow choices.

You could just make some arbitrary rules that you must satisfy, kind of a synthetic spouse.

Ha

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Well I don't know about Cordelia but Fairfield and Vallejo supposedly have crime problems and they're close to refineries aren't they?

A couple of decades ago, people talked up Sacto, Stockton and maybe Modesto as areas which are likely to see faster growth in real estate values than the Bay Area, which was already seen as overpriced.

That not only failed to happen but there is gang activity around Stockton?

The value of an area further out could be lower housing prices. However, could they also attract more lower-income buyers so that you end up with just as much traffic and maybe as much or more crime?

You can look at the crime reports and the school rankings on most of the real estate sites. Some of the suburbs tend to be lower crime than the more urban areas. I think if you want to find a nice but cheaper area you have to take a more micro look at neighborhoods, crime reports, parks, school rankings, etc. Your post mentions places that we aren't considering.

The Sacramento metro area is pretty big and diverse. There are some swanky gated communities with McMansions and some high crime areas. Fairfield is the same. They are just like Oakland in terms of extremes in crime and housing prices depending on what part of the city you live in.

Part of the reason some of the East Bay and Central Valley locations are lower cost is because they didn't live up to the predictions and were overbuilt. That is why they are bargain places to live now. The bubble already burst.

If you are interested in dramatic price appreciation from your personal residence then these may not be the best places for you to live. I'm more interested in low overhead and having less money invested in a continual boom and bust housing price area.

 

[wrigley]

Wow. I don't know that I am strong enough to get to love a pet that will be with us for so short a time. Our Pomapoo is 9 now and still acts mostly like a puppy. No shedding, no drooling, and we are not allergic. Dog is way too smart and we have to spell some words around him...until he catches on to that too, of course! At 15 lbs, their life expectancy is about 20 years.

Our Pom was 17 years, 4 months, and 3 days old when she passed.

Mike

 

[InParadise]

I'm sorry to hear that Mike. The fact you know how old your dog was to the day tells me of your loss.

 

[wrigley]

I'm sorry to hear that Mike. The fact you know how old your dog was to the day tells me of your loss.

Thanks. Pomeranian BTW. She lived the life of riley!

Mike

 

[InParadise]

Thanks. Pomeranian BTW. She lived the life of riley!

Mike

Heh. Ours too, but he gives back so much more than he takes. I've often said that if reincarnation is a thing, I would not mind coming back as a dog if we could be the caretakers. Pooch has it pretty darned good.

 

[Senator]

I looked at Prescott, AZ last May as a place to wind up. I am looking at SW FL this year. I may also look at a few others.

One rule I have is the place MUST be a warmer state than MN. That only rules out MN, Alaska, North Dakota and Maine...

 

[InParadise]

I looked at Prescott, AZ last May as a place to wind up. I am looking at SW FL this year. I may also look at a few others.

One rule I have is the place MUST be a warmer state than MN. That only rules out MN, Alaska, North Dakota and Maine...

Yes, warmth in the winter is a good thing, but so is a dependable supply of drinking water. Groundwater depletion, USGS water science Hard to tell which side of the depletion line Prescott is on the linked map.

We've bought a place that is fabulous for three seasons, but too cold for us most of the winter. We just figure we will use those three months as our travel time, exploring new areas like AZ via vacation rentals a month or so at a time, multiple locations per season. Looked at buying a small motor home, or a second home, but soon realized that if we simply kept the funds we would need to buy/furnish those things invested, we could just use the investment returns to pay for our rentals, keep the principal as insurance against a major error in expense projections, and leave the worry and maintenance to others.

I guess I should also say that we view our retirement as taking place in stages. The first 20 years should allow us to take advantage of our high outdoor activity rural home, with kayaking, hiking, biking and fishing being our focus. As we get to need more health facilities, perhaps are thinking about not driving so much, a small city looks attractive to us. Walkability will be important at that time, as well as the weather and services. Our winter travels should help us figure out where we want to go in 20 years when we need a more walkable life.

 

[wrigley]

I looked at Prescott, AZ last May as a place to wind up. I am looking at SW FL this year. I may also look at a few others.

One rule I have is the place MUST be a warmer state than MN. That only rules out MN, Alaska, North Dakota and Maine...

SW Florida is beautiful except when you are trying to get out of there during hurricane season.

Mike

 

[MRG]

I looked at Prescott, AZ last May as a place to wind up. I am looking at SW FL this year. I may also look at a few others.

One rule I have is the place MUST be a warmer state than MN. That only rules out MN, Alaska, North Dakota and Maine...

We liked the Prescott area. Went back later that same year, more towards fall. Both DW and I had terrible sinus issues. Stopped in local pharmacy, bought most every OTC product they had.

I asked the gal at the checkout about allergy issues there. She smiled said this is the high desert, all those little things out there are flowering about now, my allergies are bothering me too.
MRG

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[Options]

Has anyone relocated solo, that is no spouse along or kids in the area, etc.? I sometimes have dreams of relocating in retirement but don't know if I have the energy or desire to start "all over again" as I did several times for grad school and work when younger. It is hard when you are single because there are so many things one could do and no one to negotiate with to narrow choices.

In the same boat, but to me, being single gives one the energy and options to do just that: start all over again. I love the freedom!

I'm interested in solo responses too, as my relocation would be sans spouse/kids. Thanks Marita40 for posing the question.

It's a huge country. No spouse, kids, or other obligations to tie you down or have to compromise with. The possibilities are awesome!

I'm on the Peninsula of the Bay Area, probably the most expensive area in California. Unfortunately I don't own where I live and I can't buy here. Just waiting until I can figure out where to go. Single, not a huge amount of money, but enough. Not used to snow or heat. Want a slower pace but with amenities like good markets and libraries. Have no clue where that is and wonder if I would move where I know no one.

What helped me was doing some research. Last year, I read a book on the top 200 places to retire in US. It divided up the country by four regions and rated the best cities there by a number of factors: crime, amenities, weather, PT jobs for retirees, health facilities, culture, etc.

My plan is to live in a some targeted locales for a few months at a time, compare, and then make the best decision. I'll buy where I finally decide.

Ugh, wow! Wonder what makes the crime rate so high compared with the rest of the country? Our current zip code is rated a "3."

Amethyst

Tourists have a big impact. Palm Springs, CA is both a top retirement and tourist destination, which impacts crime rates as well. I'm not concerned with crime as much as I've lived in urban cities (SF and LA) my adult life, which are higher in crime by definition. Anywhere I move will be lower in crime unless it's another urban area and there's no chance of that happening.

 

[robnplunder]

OK, I figured something like that.

Or north of Santa Rosa or south of Morgan Hill, east of Pleasanton and so on.

Doesn't really feel like the Bay Area in some of those cases, like you're not near the amenities and such.

How about areas which are a stone throw from Sacto? I was internet researching Auburn, Lincoln, and other areas. Housing price aren't as low as I'd imagine but they are not congested (and have less crime, much less people). There could be less diversity and other issues but I think it's all depends on how much one is willing to adjust.

 

[kcowan]

Saw an episode of House Hunters, where a young hipster couple (liked "industrial" look) was shopping for a combination business and residential property where they'd have a photo studio business -- I didn't realize photo studios still existed.

Anyways, they ended up choosing an old fire station, probably like 3-4k sq. feet, for around $150k. There was a lot of renovation work which was needed but he was going to do it himself.

I don't know the exact location but seemed like the money went pretty far.

yes I saw that episode too. It is amazing how creative people can make a dollar go further. And those building are built like the brick sh*t house, solid and durable.

(OTOH I am amazed at the young couples with a couple of kids that must have a modern kitchen with steel appliances, open concept, pool, large yard, room for family to visit, and it is their second home! Our second home was under 1400 sq.ft.)

 

[daylatedollarshort]

How about areas which are a stone throw from Sacto? I was internet researching Auburn, Lincoln, and other areas. Housing price aren't as low as I'd imagine but they are not congested (and have less crime, much less people). There could be less diversity and other issues but I think it's all depends on how much one is willing to adjust.

We have some friends who ERed and did exactly that. It works well for them. Given a choice of working longer or moving there, I would move there.

But I think if you main goal is to just reduce housing costs to ER, and you enjoy the Bay Area with Mediterranean climate, the Redwoods parks, scenery, proximity to airports and the coast, an abundance of parks, gardens and museums, you don't have to move quite that far away to get the same housing prices.

 

[meierlde]

We have some friends who ERed and did exactly that. It works well for them. Given a choice of working longer or moving there, I would move there.

But I think if you main goal is to just reduce housing costs to ER, and you enjoy the Bay Area with Mediterranean climate, the Redwoods parks, scenery, proximity to airports and the coast, an abundance of parks, gardens and museums, you don't have to move quite that far away to get the same housing prices.

I have never been there but what about Davis?

 

[robnplunder]

We have some friends who ERed and did exactly that. It works well for them. Given a choice of working longer or moving there, I would move there.

But I think if you main goal is to just reduce housing costs to ER, and you enjoy the Bay Area with Mediterranean climate, the Redwoods parks, scenery, proximity to airports and the coast, an abundance of parks, gardens and museums, you don't have to move quite that far away to get the same housing prices.

Sacto area intrigued me b/c it is close to Reno/Lake Tahoe, Napa Valley, Bay Area, rivers, and mountains. I enjoy Bay area but I'd like to explore other options. And, most likely, I will rent for a while until I find the right place to retire.

 

[mpeirce]

Huh, my DBL lived in Sacramento when he was working. Upon retiring, he moved to Ashland, Oregon.

The grass is always greener somewhere else I guess...

 

[daylatedollarshort]

I have never been there but what about Davis?

I think that is a nice livable city, but we thought the housing was a bit higher than surrounding cities because of the university, and we are looking for low overhead. We want a relatively inexpensive home base and money freed up for slow travel.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Sacto area intrigued me b/c it is close to Reno/Lake Tahoe, Napa Valley, Bay Area, rivers, and mountains. I enjoy Bay area but I'd like to explore other options. And, most likely, I will rent for a while until I find the right place to retire.

I think Sacramento has a lot to offer. Less chance of earthquakes, more reasonable home prices, a large selection of newer housing, and one of the sunniest cities in the U.S. to retire:

The 10 Sunniest Places to Retire - US News

Check it out. It may be perfect for you. We thought of moving around there when we were more into river sports.