Why do you think US doesn't have national federal ID?

[tenant13]

We all have social security numbers - which is a form of a federal ID and we are constantly being asked to disclose those as a form of identifying ourselves. Which obviously allows people to see all the relevant information on their computer screens. Why not print a bunch of plastic cards with that number - and some verified information embedded in it so we could join the 21st century? Technology exists.

 

[CRLLS]

I one reason why not might be that my SS card says right on it "Not to be used for identification purposes" or some wording to that effect. I'm too lazy to go to the safe and get the exact wording. If a national ID is necessary, and I don't like the idea at all, why not just go to fingerprint technology? That can't be easily stolen and used by others. Perish the thought.

 

[NW-Bound]

No national ID because some people say "I don't wanna".

Speaking of finger printing, I installed an electronic door lock with a fingerprint reader. Tried several times to program my mother-in-law's fingerprint into the lock. Kept failing, so I dropped it.

Looking at her fingers, I saw that her prints were all messed up. She's 93, and I don't know if that's true with other elderlies. The lock has absolutely no problem reading my fingerprint.

 

[Car-Guy]

 

[tenant13]

No national ID because some people say "I don't wanna".

Speaking of finger printing, I installed an electronic door lock with a fingerprint reader. Tried several times to program my mother-in-law's fingerprint into the lock. Kept failing, so I dropped it.

Looking at her fingers, I saw that her prints were all messed up. She's 93, and I don't know if that's true with other elderlies. The lock has absolutely no problem reading my fingerprint.

There might be such a thing as going "too far" with collecting the information (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-66383325) but I'm not suggesting for the government to create a DNA database of every citizen, just coming up with something that makes lives easier. Like a national driver's license even. Why wouldn't that be consolidated?

 

[USGrant1962]

Because we are a Federal Republic of 50 states.

 

[rwdflynavy]

What would be the purpose of this national ID? States run elections, so, you don't need it for that. Same with most licensing whether for driving, employment etc.

 

[tenant13]

I one reason why not might be that my SS card says right on it "Not to be used for identification purposes" or some wording to that effect. I'm too lazy to go to the safe and get the exact wording. If a national ID is necessary, and I don't like the idea at all, why not just go to fingerprint technology? That can't be easily stolen and used by others. Perish the thought.

But it IS used for that purpose and we all know it, try to refuse to disclose that number at any financial institution and see what happens - why not codify it and enhanced its usability?

 

[mpeirce]

Like a national driver's license even. Why wouldn't that be consolidated?

Federalism.

Basically, the way the US constitution is setup, states are in charge of "most things".

 

[tenant13]

What would be the purpose of this national ID? States run elections, so, you don't need it for that. Same with most licensing whether for driving, employment etc.

One good use: the end of voter fraud discussions. The other: my national ID from Europe is readable by the NFC chip in my phone. If I need to do anything official over the internet, all I need is to let my phone read the ID, confirm it with the PIN and the necessary documents are validated as if I were actually present there. Nobody needs to go to any governmental facilities if they don't feel like it and I can sign anything I want remotely.

 

[mpeirce]

We all have social security numbers - which is a form of a federal ID and we are constantly being asked to disclose those as a form of identifying ourselves.

Use of SSNs has evolved over the years. A little history at: https://www.history.com/news/how-we-got-social-security-numbers

the assignment of Social Security numbers, or SSNs, was controversial. The U.S. government had never distributed individual numbers like this before, and some “were very frightened of giving the government the ability to have a number to track people,”

In the 80's my university used SSN as our student ID number.

A group of us created a student computer based voting system and it was based on student IDs / SSNs. I had a magtape with every students name and SSN that we used. That wouldn't go over well these days.

 

[Aerides]

Have you met many Americans who would embrace this?

 

[aja8888]

I think what is more pressing than a federal ID is to have all states get onboard with highway EZ tag's so that one device can work on any toll road.

When I go back East to visit family, I end up getting toll bills mailed to me from three different states.

Most toll roads are not manned anymore to collect cash.

 

[Jerry1]

All I can think of is the voice of Shultz from Hogans Hero’s - “Let me see your papers.” Call it individualism or distrust of the government but most people don’t want that kind of set up.

 

[Greenblue]

Growing up, I knew some people to whom any new citizen-tracking system or newfangled way of making purchases was the "mark of the beast". A national ID would totally be despised by them.

 

[NW-Bound]

Have you met many Americans who would embrace this?

Count me as one.

The Fed already knows about me. They issued my passport for travel, tracked my income for taxes, gave me Medicare and SS benefits, tax incentives for various things. What else don't they know about me?

Perhaps the state does not know as much about me. But don't they share info?

Heck, Google knows more about me than anybody else. They know the places I recently visited in Scandinavia. They know how much time I spend hanging out on this forum, etc...

If you surf this forum with a smartphone, Google or Apple even knows from which room in the house you surf, thanks to the GPS of your phone.

 

[Walt34]

But it IS used for that purpose and we all know it, try to refuse to disclose that number at any financial institution and see what happens - <snip>

To the best of my knowledge actually you can. A bank will then withhold a high amount (I think 20%) of any interest, dividends, etc and send that to the IRS which you would then get back at tax time. I've never actually tried it though.

Supposedly the only institutions that are entitled to your SS number are the IRS and of course, SS. To all others, especially schools which are notoriously lax about security, you are free to refuse. They might huff and puff about it, but they can't make you disclose it. Now that might get awkward if you're applying for financial aid and the like, but by law they can't require it. But they're not required to give you financial aid either, so there's that.

 

[NW-Bound]

To the best of my knowledge actually you can. A bank will then withhold a high amount (I think 20%) of any interest, dividends, etc and send that to the IRS which you would then get back at tax time. I've never actually tried it though...

How do you claim it with the IRS, if the tax withheld by the bank is not associated with your SS?

 

[Walt34]

How do you claim it with the IRS, if the tax withheld by the bank is not associated with your SS?

I haven't the foggiest idea. If I could remember where I learned all that I'd say so, but I can't, so take it with a large grain of salt.

 

[frayne]

Which obviously allows people to see all the relevant information on their computer screens.

Who are all these people? As long as they don't have my banking/brokerage info, who cares?

 

[Spock]

"Arguing that you don't care about privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say" - Snowden

 

[braumeister]

I haven't the foggiest idea. If I could remember where I learned all that I'd say so, but I can't, so take it with a large grain of salt.

I believe that was true some years ago, but no longer. From the FDIC site:

At a minimum, the bank must obtain the following identifying information from each customer before opening the account:
• Name,
• Date of birth for an individual,
• Address, and
• Identification number.

https://www.fdic.gov/news/financial-institution-letters/2021/fil21012b.pdf

For this purpose, the ID number for U.S. persons must be a tax identification number.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Because Americans are scared Sh!^less about giving any information to the government that they do not have to, even though they already have it if they pay taxes, have a passport, drive a car, have a car loan or a mortgage, own credit cards, have bank accounts, are registered voters, etc. .... duh! go figure. They do not mind giving it to Amazon, Facebook, Google, Bing etc., for some reason that is OK. We all have this illusion that we think we are free, but alas we are far from it. The land of the shackled and home of the skeptical. Personally, I have never understood the mindset, and I come from the worst nanny state of all, The UK with CCTV on every corner and even in public toilets (I may be exaggerating just a little).

 

[Popeye]

No national ID because some people say "I don't wanna".

Speaking of finger printing, I installed an electronic door lock with a fingerprint reader. Tried several times to program my mother-in-law's fingerprint into the lock. Kept failing, so I dropped it.

Looking at her fingers, I saw that her prints were all messed up. She's 93, and I don't know if that's true with other elderlies. The lock has absolutely no problem reading my fingerprint.

DM is 91 and I couldn’t get the fingerprint reader to work on her IPhone 13. She has to enter the cod3 every time to unlock it.

 

[jimbee]

Because Americans are scared Sh!^less about giving any information to the government that they do not have to, even though they already have it if they pay taxes, have a passport, drive a car, have a car loan or a mortgage, own credit cards, have bank accounts, are registered voters, etc. .... duh! go figure. They do not mind giving it to Amazon, Facebook, Google, Bing etc., for some reason that is OK. We all have this illusion that we think we are free, but alas we are far from it. The land of the shackled and home of the skeptical. Personally, I have never understood the mindset, and I come from the worst nanny state of all, The UK with CCTV on every corner and even in public toilets (I may be exaggerating just a little).

That's because corporations are a-ok with a lot of free-dumb people. Government is not.