Inappropriate Hugging?

[Midpack]

Maybe it's just me, but one of my golf regulars makes a habit of hugging (very) young women like servers, and it's not to be friendly IMO. He's 73 divorced, and he's decided it's OK for him to frontal hug the 20 something girl that drives the beverage cart for tips at the golf course we play at. She plays along but I can't believe she appreciates it - he's old enough to be her grandfather. He does it with other young women as well, flirts with them at every opportunity (also seems out of line to me at his age). It seems totally inappropriate to me, but I am sure it would end our friendship if I called him on it no matter how carefully I word it - he has a very short fuse anyway.

Is it even my place to say anything, if the girls put up with it? Since it's always in a customer (him) to server (girls) situation, I can understand how they might choose to accept his hugs.

Or maybe I should just keep my nose out of it?

 

[Car-Guy]

Dirty old man. Maybe say casually and privately, "Hey Bob", she's a bit young for you, isn't she! Maybe then he will realize he's making a fool of himself and making the girls uncomfortable too.

No doubt the girls are talking about him behind his back. Not sure why they put up with it.

 

[disneysteve]

Totally inappropriate and should be reported. If you don't feel comfortable confronting your friend, I'd reach out to management and bring your concerns to them. Customers sexually harassing their staff shouldn't be tolerated.


The girls "put up with it" because they're scared. That's how abuse works.

 

[braumeister]

I would certainly bring it up. "How do you get away with doing that? Most people would probably call that sexual harassment."

 

[Sunset]

Just another reason to do away with tipping.

I can only think, they consider the tips are worth the hug and the flirting.

You could really throw him off and after he hugs the server, go in for a hug yourself from him (I know you are a fellow). I have a friend that hugs when we go visit him, but he hugs males and females, so I know () there is nothing sexual behind it.

 

[jimbee]

Sounds like a creep. If he was my friend, I'd tell him to knock it off. People shouldn't have to put up with physical harassment like that.

 

[Sojourner]

Maybe it's just me, but one of my golf regulars makes a habit of hugging (very) young women like servers, and it's not to be friendly IMO. He's 73 divorced, and he's decided it's OK for him to frontal hug the 20 something girl that drives the beverage cart for tips at the golf course we play at. She plays along but I can't believe she appreciates it - he's old enough to be her grandfather. He does it with other young women as well, flirts with them at every opportunity (also seems out of line to me at his age). It seems totally inappropriate to me, but I am sure it would end our friendship if I called him on it no matter how carefully I word it - he has a very short fuse anyway.

Is it even my place to say anything, if the girls put up with it? Since it's always in a customer (him) to server (girls) situation, I can understand how they might choose to accept his hugs.

Or maybe I should just keep my nose out of it?

My 19 year-old niece worked at a golf course one summer, and based on what she told me, that kind of behavior was considered highly inappropriate and borderline sexual harassment. She was the victim of an elderly man who sounds very similar to your golf buddy, and the interactions with him had her in tears at one point. She ended up reporting the man's lewd behaviors to the management staff at the golf course and requesting to be transferred to another shift so she'd never had to interact with him again.

I don't know what I'd do in your situation. Talking to him yourself will do no good, as you say, so perhaps he needs to be reprimanded more forcefully in some "official" way. Maybe talk to one of his female victims and suggest that you both go to the golf course management, together, with a formal complaint about this man's sketchy behavior.

 

[badatmath]

That seems gross to me. I wonder if young server girl has mentioned this to her boss and if this is supposed to be "okay". I'd probably tell him to knock it off in the moment but I would not "have a talk with him" as it would do no good. Maybe make a remark about keeping his hands to himself. You'd have to have a chance in the moment to disrupt it and give server a chance to step back or whatever.

 

[Amethyst]

He sounds like he's lost a step. The young women either have to put up with creepy old men because it's part of their job (some job!) or they were raised to be polite to the elderly.

His friends might say something to him privately about how young women, such as their daughters, truly feel about being pawed by such as he, but if he's lost a thread or two, he may not care to believe it.

BTW, it's also not OK for him to hug older women, unless he knows them and knows they like public hugs.

 

[ivinsfan]

That sucks in many ways. She's way younger, an employee and needs to be payed for her work. She has zero leverage...man up and next time the minute he gropes her say, "Hey that's inappropriate and you need to get your hands off her". Don't go to the management, do it then and there. They might choose to accept hugs so they get paid and don't get fired?, come on you know that's not right.













We have a family at church with a couple disabled sons who have some mental impairments as well. The oldest one suddenly started body hugging people. Well not people, just cute high school and college age girls. Long hugs, full body type hugs that left everyone uncomfortable, well except his Dad who stood there laughing. My girls and I talked and they started saying HI X and then giving him the extended arm don't come any closer signal. Which he did respect. After awhile he stopped bothering my girls,but other girls still got the huggie treatment.

 

[badatmath]

Dirty old man. Maybe say casually and privately, "Hey Bob", she's a bit young for you, isn't she! Maybe then he will realize he's making a fool of himself and making the girls uncomfortable.

No doubt the girls are talking about him behind his back. Not sure why they put up with it.

Because they need the job? Because it probably happens every day?

 

[Aerides]

Is it even my place to say anything, if the girls put up with it? Since it's always in a customer (him) to server (girls) situation, I can understand how they might choose to accept his hugs.

Or maybe I should just keep my nose out of it?

You, as another older Male who is a customer, and who therefore enjoys a similar power position to this friend should absolutely say something. She cannot. She risks her job - not just tips - and is doing the literal grin-and-bear-it. No, he can't even ask if it's ok for him to hug her, he should just stop it, full stop, it's gross and creepy and bad and wrong and I could go on?

So, please, say something. Embarrass him if he doesn't stop.

When I was 19, I was a server at a nice restaurant in a nice hotel. A guest - sitting with his wife - got out of his booth and side-hugged me while asking me a question. His hand extended around my back and cupped the side of my breast. I froze in the moment, extricated myself, and told my boss. He reassigned the table to a male server and I made myself scarce.

I asked my boss...what if I hadn't frozen, what if I'd given him a well-deserved slap? I was told...well, everyone would have seen that, but no one would have seen what he'd done to you.

35 years later it still bothers me that I didn't slap him anyway.

 

[Car-Guy]

Because they need the job? Because it probably happens every day?

No doubt but it's not right by a long shot.

 

[ivinsfan]

Because they need the job? Because it probably happens every day?

Because the other men standing there watching saying nothing? By default acting as if it's OK?

 

[latexman]

These are your feelings, I'd keep out of it.

 

[badatmath]

Even just yanking him back with "Geez can't take you anywhere" might work.

But you know him best

 

[Texas Proud]

Dirty old man. Maybe say casually and privately, "Hey Bob", she's a bit young for you, isn't she! Maybe then he will realize he's making a fool of himself and making the girls uncomfortable.

No doubt the girls are talking about him behind his back. Not sure why they put up with it.

I would agree that a short comment might be appropriate... I do not agree with it either...


BUT, and this might not be true in today's society, I had talked to some young girls about this and they said that they got some really good tips from some old geezers...



There was this one lady who cut hair.. would wear tight t-shirts with no bra and stand in front of the guys as much as she could... I could not believe some guys went to her as she was horrible at cutting hair... but they liked the show...

 

[Amethyst]

The more I think about it, the more I think something should be said before Mr. Creepy starts patting rear ends, or worse.

It's usually best to deflect to an authority, such as a head server. I guess if the head server laughs it off, you have your answer: Your chosen watering hole is a place where sexual harassment in the workplace is tolerated. Then you have to decide whether you keep going there.

 

[Car-Guy]

There was this one lady who cut hair.. would wear tight t-shirts with no bra and stand in front of the guys as much as she could... I could not believe some guys went to her as she was horrible at cutting hair... but they liked the show...

Now seriously, that's a different issue.

 

[jollystomper]

I would say something to him. If that were my wife/daughter/niece/daughter of a friend I would not like that behavior, so I am going to be consistent. I have been in similar situations and said something. Most men have thought I am overreacting. For those who continued to behave in that manner I have "phased out" our relationship. The woman has always (at some point) thanked me for saying something.

 

[Texas Proud]

Now seriously, that's a different issue.

True... she was encouraging it herself...

 

[Dtail]

I would say something to him, irrespective of the friendship. If you had a granddaughter her age, what would be your thought process then?

 

[MarieIG]

Yuck. I am usually soft spoken and non-confrontational - but I believe this would motivate me to act.

I would tell the perve to knock it off - and if he didn't do so, I would report him to management.

The young girls don't necessarily know how to handle an unwanted situation. At 17 I would have been upset and confused. At 35 he would have very speedily been put in his place.

 

[Midpack]

I may well say something though I’m pretty sure it will break up my regular Friday golf foursome. I am pretty sure he’ll never forgive me for calling him out, but he’s totally out of line IMO, and I’m just not comfortable with that. She always wears tight clothes and tiny shorts, but that doesn’t give (old) men license to touch her IMO.

 

[audreyh1]

If your friend has a short fuse on top of behaving inappropriately, I wonder why you have kept them as a friend.

I’m glad you feel like you have to say something.