Question for Coffee Enthusiasts

[Another Reader]

You used to be able to go into Peet's or Starbucks and buy coffee from a certain country. It was no big deal to pick up a bag of Guatemalan, Colombian, Sumatra or whatever. There were price differences, maybe a dollar a pound.

Then Starbucks started creating blends to sell cheaply at Costco and the grocery store. Lower grade coffee mixed with some of the better stuff according to my taste buds. I don't buy the blends with the fancy names that Starbucks and Peet's sell at these outlets. It's inferior to what I used to buy.

Because the blends incorporate cheaper beans and are sold for the same high prices as the coffees from the various countries used to be, these companies decided to distinguish the better beans by calling them "single origin" and charge even more for them.

I can still buy whole bean or ground "single origin" Starbucks at the grocery store for the same price as the blends. That won't last much longer.

 

[NW-Bound]

Maybe my homes are money pits and the RV a gas guzzler, and they keep me from affording pan sauce with XO Cognac. I am broke.

I currently have about 1/2 dozen bottles of different brands, but I have to reserve them for sipping only.

Speaking of XO Cognac, I am going to go out to my liquor cabinet to pour meself a shot. Have not had any for a while.

I just use the basic Courvoisier for pan sauces/deglazing. I think anything sophisticated is going to lose any subtleties under that treatment. Incredible pan sauce though!

That's all you need, although if I were rich, I would shock my guests by using XO Cognac.

But then, they may hate me for being a wasteful snob, which I would not be, even if I were rich.

 

[audreyh1]

Do coffee distributors routinely mix the beans from different sources to have a certain blend of flavor? Cognac makers always mix different batches, different vintages to have a certain desirable characteristic, in contrast with single-malt whisky.

PS. There are single-cru cognacs that are not blended. They are not as popular. I have not had any.

Yes, the roaster blends beans from different sources to get a certain blend of flavor. I did that when roasting my own, as I thought a blend of two to three different beans complemented each other and gave a very satisfying flavor, better than any single origin alone.

You can also do it for yourself after the fact.

Personally I never got into single origin that much. Certain beans have certain flavor profiles, and I definitely prefer beans from some areas. But I’m usually enjoy a blend as long as it isn’t dominated by the “winey” flavors of a Colombian bean.

 

[NW-Bound]

I have told this story before, but like to repeat it.

Once after a holiday dinner, my two brothers and myself were doing blind tasting of an XO Cognac against a lesser VSOP grade. We were telling each other how good the XO was, and it should be as it cost 3x more. One brother said, "imagine if we were so rich we could use it as mouthwash".

 

[NW-Bound]

Yes, the roaster blends beans from different sources to get a certain blend of flavor. I did that when roasting my own, as I thought a blend of two to three different beans complemented each other and gave a very satisfying flavor, better than any single origin alone.

You can also do it for yourself after the fact.

Personally I never got into single origin that much. Certain beans have certain flavor profiles, and I definitely prefer beans from some areas. But I’m usually enjoy a blend as long as it isn’t dominated by the “winey” flavors of a Colombian bean.

I am no coffee connoisseur, and my palate is not that fine to do that.

Even with Cognac, I can usually tell that I like an XO grade better than a lesser grade. But between XO grades from different popular brands, for example Remy Martin vs. Courvoisier vs. Martell, it is difficult to tell which one I like better. They are all good. And after a few shots, they start to taste the same.

 

[audreyh1]

I am no coffee connoisseur, and my palate is not that fine to do that.

Even with Cognac, I can usually tell that I like an XO grade better than a lesser grade. But between XO grades from different popular brands, for example Remy Martin vs. Courvoisier vs. Martell, it is difficult to tell which one I like better. They are all good. And after a few shots, they start to taste the same.

If you drink coffees grown in different locations around the world you’ll find that the flavors are quite different.

 

[Chuckanut]

I would say



Great job of showing us this character by describing her order!

I have to agree. However, she offends me. She should have placed her order this way:

a 100% Organic cheddar non-GMO cornbread honey waffle and a single-origin Fair Trade espresso in a reduced water orchard almond hand harvested macadamia nut latte.

 

[ERD50]

If you drink coffees grown in different locations around the world you’ll find that the flavors are quite different.

Agreed. I enjoy coffee, am far from any sort of coffee-snob level, but from my experience, anyone who actually tastes their coffee (doesn't load it up with flavorings), would easily notice the difference between, say an Ethiopian and a Costa Rica sourced coffee.

The Ethiopian coffee is bright and acidic, the Costa Rican coffee is more full-bodied. It is not subtle.

To me, it makes no sense at all to call out "single origin" w/o specifying the origin. That would be like going to the ice cream counter, and saying "I want a specific flavor ice cream, but I'm not going to tell you which flavor"? No one would do that, they would say "I'll take chocolate (or whatever your favorite is)."

-ERD50

 

[TromboneAl]

If I were to hazard a guess I would guess Al is writing another book.

Quite right. I don't remember where I stole that phrasing, but my editor thought it didn't sound quite right. So I checked here.


I decided it's close enough, and, as BestWifeEver said, it does a good job of showing what the character is like (the teenage heiress in upcoming book, The Abducted Heiress).

 

[Scuba]

I am no coffee connoisseur, and my palate is not that fine to do that.



Even with Cognac, I can usually tell that I like an XO grade better than a lesser grade. But between XO grades from different popular brands, for example Remy Martin vs. Courvoisier vs. Martell, it is difficult to tell which one I like better. They are all good. And after a few shots, they start to taste the same.

My friends and I did a blind tasting of Veuve Cliquot ($45-$50 bottle) against three different CA sparking wines ($15-$20). Interestingly, Veuve placed second or third with everyone. Gloria Ferrer Brut won by a significant margin.

 

[Maenad]

If you drink coffees grown in different locations around the world you’ll find that the flavors are quite different.

Oh yes. DH and I have started ordering beans from Fresh Roasted Coffee and the variations are really enjoyable. I think we have upwards of a dozen different varieties in our cupboard right now, as we're going through them to find favorites.

Like others, I'm blown away by ordering a single-origin espresso and not specifying the origin (unless the shop had a daily special and it was implied) and by dumping it into a latte with flavored syrup. The sugar and artificial flavorings will pretty much drown out any variations between the different types of coffee. And who knows how clean their coffee makers are - residue from other blends can throw off the taste too.

 

[Chuckanut]

and by dumping it into a latte with flavored syrup. The sugar and artificial flavorings will pretty much drown out any variations between the different types of coffee. And who knows how clean their coffee makers are - residue from other blends can throw off the taste too.

Yes. It is a horror beyond words.

 

[haha]

I never heard the term "single-origin" coffee till now. But if the coffee beans come from a single source, they still don't have to be good, right? And then, without knowing exactly where they come from, what does that mean?

It has been many years since I lived anywhere other than espresso mad cities. But I think single source is only ordered by naming the source, in whatever detail that the shop supports.

Ha

 

[NW-Bound]

I drink coffee for years, but mostly to get caffeine to stay awake. Yes, I do appreciate real coffee compared to instant coffee.

But I never spend the time to savor it and to enjoy the different nuances. One's palate has to be trained to enjoy the finer things, and I often do not have the patience or enough interest.

 

[deserat]

Like others, I'm blown away by ordering a single-origin espresso and not specifying the origin (unless the shop had a daily special and it was implied) and by dumping it into a latte with flavored syrup. The sugar and artificial flavorings will pretty much drown out any variations between the different types of coffee. And who knows how clean their coffee makers are - residue from other blends can throw off the taste too.

+1 There is significant diluting and masking of coffee flavor in that order, so frankly, the main benefit would be the caffeine in the espresso and at that point blend or no blend, you'll get a similar taste sensation.

Methinks it was a type of 'coffee snob' signaling......plus, Starbucks tends to over roast their beans so that they tasted burned to me...all of them.

 

[audreyh1]

It has been many years since I lived anywhere other than espresso mad cities. But I think single source is only ordered by naming the source, in whatever detail that the shop supports.

Ha

Yep. Makes no sense otherwise.

A coffee shop may advertise a wide variety of single-origin coffees. But when you go to order, you simple specify which one.

 

[audreyh1]

I drink coffee for years, but mostly to get caffeine to stay awake. Yes, I do appreciate real coffee compared to instant coffee.

But I never spend the time to savor it and to enjoy the different nuances. One's palate has to be trained to enjoy the finer things, and I often do not have the patience or enough interest.

I think several of us are saying that you don't actually need palate training to taste differences in coffee origins. It's not a nuanced thing. The flavor differences from different parts of the world are substantial.

 

[Chuckanut]

plus, Starbucks tends to over roast their beans so that they tasted burned to me...all of them.

My theory is that they have to do so, otherwise the coffee flavor would be totally masked by soy-milk, flavoring, sugar and other stuff put into the so-called coffee beverages. Just my opinion, of course.

There is one good cup of coffee at Sbux. If your local Sbux has the Clover system device, I can recommend it.

 

[NW-Bound]

I think several of us are saying that you don't actually need palate training to taste differences in coffee origins. It's not a nuanced thing. The flavor differences from different parts of the world are substantial.

OK. I guess I still have to pay attention though.

Or perhaps I have not tried off-the-main-stream coffee, so what I have had is just meat-and-potato type.

 

[Clone]

I have to agree. However, she offends me. She should have placed her order this way:

a 100% Organic cheddar non-GMO cornbread honey waffle and a single-origin Fair Trade espresso in a reduced water orchard almond hand harvested macadamia nut latte.

That's all fine and good, but what are you going to serve it in?? A plain old waxed paper cup??

 

[NW-Bound]

That's all fine and good, but what are you going to serve it in?? A plain old waxed paper cup??

I was thinking the same thing! Gotta be a fine bone china cup.

Would something like the below be suitable? How would our heroine specify that?

Oh, don't forget a silver spoon for stirring. No, make it a gold-plated one, because silver may get tarnished with the acidic coffee.

 

[Chuckanut]

That's all fine and good, but what are you going to serve it in?? A plain old waxed paper cup??

Goodness NO! Don't get me started on the way SBUX and other coffee houses serve cappuccino in a disposable cup. It's like eating a great steak on a paper plate that gets soggy from the juice, and using plastic utensils that break easily.

With standards this low, it's easy to be a coffee snob.

 

[braumeister]

Starbucks tends to over roast their beans

I think most of us would agree with that comment.

When I lived in Rio de Janeiro, I had no idea how good I had it. Ordinary, run of the mill supermarket coffee was better than most of what we have in this country today. And you could drink those tiny cups (cafezinhos) all day long. It was even common to top off a meal with one or two around midnight, and still go right to sleep with no trouble.

One thing to be aware of: The best coffee beans are the Arabica variety (all Brazilian coffee is Arabica), so that's what you want, no matter where they are from. For cost reasons, many suppliers mix in at least some Robusta coffee beans, which are an abomination IMHO.

Coming back to the US, I found that Starbucks Verona blend was about as good as I could get, and I've never found one of their baristas who disagreed. In fact every Starbucks employee I've ever asked has said Verona was their preferred morning coffee. But either my palate is aging or they have changed their process, since I don't think it's as good as it used to be.

One thing I have learned recently is that the type of coffeemaker I use makes a real difference. I got a fancy Swiss coffeemaker this year and I was blown away by how much better my morning coffee tastes. Blow that dough!

 

[haha]

Goodness NO! Don't get me started on the way SBUX and other coffee houses serve cappuccino in a disposable cup. It's like eating a great steak on a paper plate that gets soggy from the juice, and using plastic utensils that break easily.

With standards this low, it's easy to be a coffee snob.

If you go in and sit down they serve your drink in a plenty good porcelain cup. What would one expect in his/her car, or walking down the street, other than paper? They also discount I think 10 cents a cup when you have it in a real cup.

There is a Seattle Coffee Works downtown just east of the Market on Pike. If you order something that is not nonsensical, like an espresso, they know that no one ordering this is going to ruin it walking around with a paper cup. How long could it possibly take to drink a double shot anyway?

Ha

 

[Chuckanut]

One thing I have learned recently is that the type of coffeemaker I use makes a real difference. I got a fancy Swiss coffeemaker this year and I was blown away by how much better my morning coffee tastes. Blow that dough!

+. 1 on Verona.

The besting I did was get a good burr grinder. What a difference!