Financial assistance for the in-laws?

[Franklin]

Agree with many of the previous posters. One thing I haven’t seen mentioned—do you live close to them? What about the other siblings? Frequently the relatives closer to family take on more of the caregiving load, which IMO is a far larger contribution than a check. Unless you have a highly functioning family, which doesn’t appear to be the case, it’s very hard to just split things up evenly and have it all work out.

We are one of the closest siblings by location and the only siblings that don't have kids still in college. But mine are still not off my payroll either (another story for another day). I am hoping these are just storms that will pass over time.

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

OP here. Just taking all the advise in. FIL does work and makes a decent living but at 79 it will not be a forever thing. DW will push to take the bulk of financial responsibility for her parents. My worry is DW has never paid a bill nor does she grasp the retirement financial stage. Don't get me wrong, we've been married over 30 years but money is not her thing. The other siblings live a nice life and we all get along great, but they are in their 40's and 50's and never thought a bit about retirement savings etc.( nice trips and country clubs take the priority). Admittedly it bothers me that I seem to be the only financially responsible one.....but hey its my family now. So far I do agree that Ive got to let DW take the lead and just set limits and boundaries.

The best leaders know when to get expert advice. You can give your wife advice about finances, both in general and specifically for her parents' situation, without taking the lead away from her. While she should take the lead, it sounds like it would not be wise for her to attempt this completely on her own.

I agree that her parents should be required to have some skin in the game, or they will just expand their spending to completely nullify your assistance. Maybe start by paying the fees for a fiduciary financial advisor and a credit counseling service for them? You or your wife should go with them, to make sure they don't walk away hearing something completely different than what was actually said.

Good luck!

 

[kgtest]

My FIL and MIL have just turned 79 and are slowing down considerably. FIL still works and says he will till he drops. They are quite nice people but have never been any good with money issues. Their net worth is negative, most of their excess cash flow goes to past taxes or CC interest and there are no retirement funds. They barely make it from one SS check to the next. They have 4 adult children who were taught the wrong methods when it comes to money (I married one and have no regreats). Now I have voiced my concerns to the other siblings that the parents will need help financially. So far no family member has stepped up to offer help. I have indicated Ill cover my 1/4th of their needs but did not want to be the only one offering help. DW is the oldest of the 4 siblings and is open to us helping if needed however the other siblings say they have money needs of their own and can't help. The other siblings are clearly living beyond their means and have kids still in school. My question is should I consider further assistance (I can afford it) or insist on only covering my pro-rata share (4 siblings or 25%). In a few years I see the in-laws needing serious financial help and don't want to be the only family member willing to assist. Anyone ever been in this situation?

From what I've seen, its never even steven. Dad had to step up big time to take care of both his mom and dads needs through the years, buying them cars, paying insurance, and some other probably small things in the scheme. SS always covered their subsidized living expenses until death. Grandma most recently has been forgetting the day before so the talk is that Grandma will spend time between 3 of her 6 children's places (My dad has and will continue to snow bird so is sisters will need to step in to cover those months). Instead of the SS check going to the subsidized rent it will go to whichever sibling is taking care of grandma that month.

 

[Amethyst]

Verify that they are in real need, and then assist, but not with cash if you can help it. If they are not paying their taxes, yet still buying stuff they want, that is not need. That is improper prioritization.

I know (thankfully am not related) to a family where every one claims poverty, but finds money for things they really want.

So: If they are going hungry, provide grocery store gift cards.

If their car is falling apart, make an appointment for them at a car shop, and offer to pay for a reasonable share of repairs.

If they end up needing care, there is Medicaid.

Never mind the other siblings; they will do what they will do.

You are a good person.

My FIL and MIL have just turned 79 and are slowing down considerably. FIL still works and says he will till he drops. They are quite nice people but have never been any good with money issues. Their net worth is negative, most of their excess cash flow goes to past taxes or CC interest and there are no retirement funds. They barely make it from one SS check to the next. They have 4 adult children who were taught the wrong methods when it comes to money (I married one and have no regreats). Now I have voiced my concerns to the other siblings that the parents will need help financially. So far no family member has stepped up to offer help. I have indicated Ill cover my 1/4th of their needs but did not want to be the only one offering help. DW is the oldest of the 4 siblings and is open to us helping if needed however the other siblings say they have money needs of their own and can't help. The other siblings are clearly living beyond their means and have kids still in school. My question is should I consider further assistance (I can afford it) or insist on only covering my pro-rata share (4 siblings or 25%). In a few years I see the in-laws needing serious financial help and don't want to be the only family member willing to assist. Anyone ever been in this situation?

 

[ckelly78z]

Reverse mortgage for them ! LOL

 

[Franklin]

Reverse mortgage for them ! LOL

they don't qualify. They just got a 3% down loan on a townhome. No NW available anywhere. Yes, sadly i read that there are many seniors in the US that reflect this situation.

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

they don't qualify. They just got a 3% down loan on a townhome. No NW available anywhere. Yes, sadly i read that there are many seniors in the US that reflect this situation.

As soon as I saw a reverse mortgage mentioned, I thought of your earlier description, and figured that people like that rarely leave any credit or equity unused.

 

[gauss]

They could default on the CC and if their only income is "retirement" income that it would not be subject to garnish. Obviously a lien could be attached to their property (ie home) which would need to be paid off before a sale were to occur.

At this point, they should be able to meet their monthly expenses if they are both receiving SS checks.

May also be wise to assist them in placing "credit freezes" so that additional lines of credit could not be opened going down the line. Perhaps you hold the PINS to unlock the "credit freeze"?

You and your DW need to have some serious talks about the terms of engagement if either of you are contemplating any direct financial assistance to them.

-gauss

 

[Chuckanut]

May also be wise to assist them in placing "credit freezes" so that additional lines of credit could not be opened going down the line. Perhaps you hold the PINS to unlock the "credit freeze"?

Oh Dear! NO! I have to really, really disagree with the amiable and smart gauss.

Holding their pins will do little good other than make you the 'bad' guy whenever you tell them " No, you don't need another loan to buy a bigger OLED TV. Save up for it instead." I imagine your life will be a living Heck. You will catch it from all sides.

If they want, they can assemble whatever info the Credit Bureaus wants and get their account thawed anyway. It's a hassle, but not as great a pain in the rear as you will have when you tell them 'No'. My 2¢.

 

[gwraigty]

So many excellent response already.

I think you run the risk of being perceived as the "rich SIL who wants to control everything". Not saying you are, but if the other siblings have no ability to assist, then, to them, you are rich.

Expanding on this thought, there may be a risk that the siblings might also eventually come to OP with their hands out, especially if OP starts financially subsidizing DW's parents.

Now I have voiced my concerns to the other siblings that the parents will need help financially.

Mistake #1. What brought this up?

DW will push to take the bulk of financial responsibility for her parents. My worry is DW has never paid a bill nor does she grasp the retirement financial stage. Don't get me wrong, we've been married over 30 years but money is not her thing.

<snip>

Admittedly it bothers me that I seem to be the only financially responsible one.....but hey its my family now. So far I do agree that Ive got to let DW take the lead and just set limits and boundaries.

DW shouldn't accept the burden (and it will be) for financially supporting her parents if she's that unfamiliar with basic financial concepts. Your opinion counts, too. Marriage doesn't obligate one to provide for each other's adult relatives, especially when said relatives aren't doing everything possible to help themselves live within their means.

 

[Mdlerth]

Tell them you love them and leave it at that

I detect a minefield. In between the mines are pockets of quicksand, and in between the sand pits are piles of doggie doodoo. Stay out of it until asked.

I started to write a more exploratory response but it rapidly expanded into too many areas. There are issues of morals, emotions, relationships and practicality which could fill a master's thesis. I couldn't deal with them all.

Neither can you. So don't try. God bless you for being concerned about the in-laws, but forget about thinking you can proactively save them from themselves.

 

[samcat]

Not sure if this has been suggested but maybe help them with certain expenses - electricity, etc. To keep them comfortable.

 

[jollystomper]

I did not see anywhere that the in-laws ere currently asking for help. If they are surviving day to day and not yet asking, I would not offer ant at this time. However, I would start setting aside a "just in case" fund with the monthly amount you feel comfortable with providing. You mentioned several years down the road there might be problems, let your fund build and see what happens in several years, if you need to use or not (and not all at once, but monthly at that time).

When my mother needed home care my siblings got together (fortunately we are all close and willing to help) and came up with what we would be prepared to contribute if it was needed. Fortunately my mother (always an independent spirit) said he preferred her income from SS and Dad's pension to cover the amount, she still would have plenty for her needs. I just kept that monthly amount as a "virtual" fund in case she did need it. I drew on it a couple of times to "gift" her by paying for some home repairs but did not exhaust it.

 

[SpinDoctorTX]

My FIL and MIL have just turned 79 and are slowing down considerably. FIL still works and says he will till he drops. They are quite nice people but have never been any good with money issues. Their net worth is negative, most of their excess cash flow goes to past taxes or CC interest and there are no retirement funds. They barely make it from one SS check to the next. They have 4 adult children who were taught the wrong methods when it comes to money (I married one and have no regreats). Now I have voiced my concerns to the other siblings that the parents will need help financially. So far no family member has stepped up to offer help. I have indicated Ill cover my 1/4th of their needs but did not want to be the only one offering help. DW is the oldest of the 4 siblings and is open to us helping if needed however the other siblings say they have money needs of their own and can't help. The other siblings are clearly living beyond their means and have kids still in school. My question is should I consider further assistance (I can afford it) or insist on only covering my pro-rata share (4 siblings or 25%). In a few years I see the in-laws needing serious financial help and don't want to be the only family member willing to assist. Anyone ever been in this situation?

Yours is an eldest daughter tale. In general it seems that they end up in charge (just observations from some of my friends and members of groups). I'm the lucky first daughter, and am in a similar position with my Mom and a sibling. Eventually Mom will live with us full time, and not just as a snowbird (we purchased our last house with that in mind so it has a separate living area for her). I'm happy to do it, as she took me in after a crumbled first marriage left me nearly broke at 40 yo. She spends a lot of her SS on a sibling with kids. They really are in need at times and I don't resent it, as all family members have helped her out at times. This sibling will always be a paycheck to paycheck kinda person due to poor choices over many years. We have also helped out DH's kid at times.

A few years ago, I could tell that my Mom was fretting about her lack of $, so I called up the wealthy one explaining I'd never expect anyone to help out with Mom's expenses related to living here, but I could tell what was worrying her. I am not in a position to send a bunch of $ anywhere. He said he would help with some amt sent to her monthly & that is that last time I brought it up. I feel sure he is doing this for her (me) since she is still able to live alone on her farm- at 83! She is in superb health & her GM & Mo both lived to 101. Sibling parity with eldercare is hard to achieved. If siblings cannot help with $, ask that they take on some duties that only require time. I certainly intend to if needed!

As a previous poster pointed out, unless they have actually asked for help, I might just be very observant during interactions. Once the floodgate of generosity opens, it is mighty hard to plug the leak. I wish you & DW well as you embark on the journey.

 

[IMATERP]

Personally, I believe able bodied folks make choices throughout their life which essentially leaves some people retiring comfortably and some people uncomfortably.

A. I would not offer to fund 1/4 of anyone’s retirement.
B. I would not discuss the matter with other relatives.

Many seniors live in subsidized housing with their healthcare needs met by Medicare. They receive social security and other assistance based on the amount they have. Thus, they will be fine.

The only real conversation that you should have is to determine what their final wishes will be (burial, cremation, etc.). This is where you and your family may have to step up financially.

I

 

[Sunset]

Personally, I believe able bodied folks make choices throughout their life which essentially leaves some people retiring comfortably and some people uncomfortably.

A. I would not offer to fund 1/4 of anyone’s retirement.
B. I would not discuss the matter with other relatives.

Many seniors live in subsidized housing with their healthcare needs met by Medicare. They receive social security and other assistance based on the amount they have. Thus, they will be fine.

The only real conversation that you should have is to determine what their final wishes will be (burial, cremation, etc.). This is where you and your family may have to step up financially.

I

So you'll pay to bury them but not feed them ?

If you really want to save money, just don't declare the body, leave it with the city.

 

[IMATERP]

So you'll pay to bury them but not feed them ?

If you really want to save money, just don't declare the body, leave it with the city.

I did not say “that I would not feed them.” I said “I would not offer 1/4 of their needs.”

I have previously given $1,000 to my BIL 7 or 8 years ago - in order that he had a down payment for a car. I did not co-sign any loans and I made it clear - that our (wife and I) gesture was not a loan. He is 56 and a Walmart worker.

We buried a SIL earlier this year where we had to pay 2k for a portion of a burial. She was 53 and died of end stage liver failure (alcoholism.) The SIL who died constantly begged for monies from the church and other relatives but we continued to say “no” to her requests because of her daily life choices.

Hence, each situation has to be looked at in context of the individual. Facts dictate how much help one should or can provide. Also, the decision needs to be looked at with respect to how much discretionary money one has to give away.

I

 

[Luck_Club]

OP-My wife and I find ourselves in a similar situation. Her parents are still working and can "never retire". Over the past 30 years we have been together we have observed them make 1 bad financial decision after another.

Back in 2010 the cracks started to show themselves, when the parents had to file for bankruptcy. Even that was done the most expensive way possible dismissing a small attorney we had found that would do the filing for flat fee of $1000 in favor of someone charging several thousand dollars. At the time we first spoke with the other siblings about helping protect the parents by buying out the house and allowing them to live in it so they would always have a place to live as they got older. The response from the two other siblings was we will help them just not yet.

Fast forward to 2016 and they absolutely had to buy a new car because the car needed expensive repair and couldn't be registered. Wife and I agreed to front them the money and bought for them a used car, and sold their old car, which I continued to see on the road for several more years. After about a year or so the car was giving them all kinds of problems and had been racking up all kinds of repair bills, and they had to get rid of it and buy a new car, with the down payment of the car we had bought for them. We said to them they couldn't use the car as a down payment, because they hadn't paid us back yet for the car.

There was supposed to be a windfall from the mothers estate, which was due to settle in months at the time of the purchase when we bought the car. They contested the will, and the executor tying it up for several more years only to get less than the original amount, they were entitled to receive.

At age 73 while both are still working they received the money. It took less than 6 months of planning to wipe out all the money. Now all children are on the same page it will end badly when they can't work but it isn't their problem.

My wife and I being the only siblings living close enough will be tasked with cleaning out the crap at pennies on the dollar, while the parents go kicking and screaming into the government safety net.

Your family should enjoy what you have worked so hard for and be sympathetic but steadfast in not subsidizing a lifetime of bad decisions.

 

[Teacher Terry]

Luck, what a awful situation. Can they sell the house or did they take out all the equity?

 

[MarieIG]

My thoughts are this. Keep an eye on the situation. When FIL retires, you and DW can get involved in ensuring they have the basics - not necessarily footing the entire bill to keep their standard of living where it is now.

There are a number of government safety nets available for those with minimal income. You and DW can work on getting them signed up for that - and supplement with grocery gift cards, etc. w/n your budget. Again, I think your "job" will focus on making sure they are getting the basics, food/ heat / electricity. If you and DW want, you can also fund a "treat" for them now and then.