Grand Jury Summons

[audreyh1]

I appeared for a Grand Jury Summons this week.

I was pretty worried about it over the holidays because I knew it could be a long commitment, and DH has a medical procedure scheduled early Feb and I was in the middle of getting estate taxes pulled together due this week, plus the county courthouse is pretty far away with major interstate construction going on. And we have only the one vehicle. I just had no idea what to expect.

In fact it took almost an hour for me to get to the courthouse by 8am!

It turns out the time commitment in our county is not particularly onerous. The term served is 3 months, one day a week from 9-3 occasionally going later to 4 or 5. For this group it would have been every Tuesday January thru March. And you can occasionally arrange to miss a week.

A second grand jury group was being summoned the following day for the same time period and they would meet on a different day of the week. These time commitment details vary widely between counties in TX. I think for Bexar County it is for 2 months but meeting 2 days each week.

So this particular one would have worked out OK for me. The day of the week did not conflict with DH’s scheduled procedure and we tend to stay close to the Valley Jan thru Mar anyway.

But I was the very last in line - #58 so of course I wasn’t selected.

It was also kind of amusing because it was our (newly elected) District Attorney’s first week on the job, and his first grand jury selection. He had an experienced staff with him of course.

There was quite a bit of waiting around. But those of us not selected were dismissed by 10:30am. Not bad!

 

[aaronc879]

You get compensation for mileage and time?

 

[Car-Guy]

Interesting.. I'm over 70 so I can opt out now, but I prefer to serve when called... Never been called for a Grand Jury though.

 

[athena53]

I almost wish I'd get on a jury. I worked in property-casualty insurance and even though my work was with aggregate statistics and not claims adjusting, it was enough to get me thrown out on a peremptory challenge the first time I showed up in the 1980s Second time I never even got into the box for questioning (but found that "voir dire" is pronounced "voy-er dire" out here in the hinterlands). Third time I was called was December, 2020- a perilous time and I was deferred because I was Old and a COVID risk. After deferral was up I got a note the night before I was to show up saying I wasn't needed.

I think it would be interesting- just wouldn't want a long, ugly criminal case.

 

[audreyh1]

You get compensation for mileage and time?

You get paid $40 each day serving not counting the jury selection day where you get $16.

 

[audreyh1]

Interesting.. I'm over 70 so I can opt out now, but I prefer to serve when called... Never been called for a Grand Jury though.

I should elaborate. A Grand Jury basically works for the District Attorney’s office. You hear evidence in felony and misdemeanor theft cases and decide whether the evidence warrants bringing an indictment. You are not in a courtroom but in a conference room. You may end up listening to some witness testimony. I expect you hear several cases each meeting day.

After hearing the evidence the grand jury meets in secret to deliberate about whether to bring an indictment.

In TX you can opt out of any jury service once you reach 70.

In addition our county currently has an opt out for 65+ due to Covid (or other high risk health reasons). DH used this to excuse himself 2 years ago when he got a grand jury summons.

 

[JoeWras]

DW got selected here. They did a surprise lottery from the regular trial pool, so it was a shock to all chosen.

She served once per week, 4 hours, for 1/2 year. It's a real commitment under threat of contempt if you skip it. DW couldn't talk much about it except to say it was mostly procedural. They approved something like 99% of the indictments.

This is state dependent. In some states, the grand jury can be more hands on.

 

[aaronc879]

DW got selected here. They did a surprise lottery from the regular trial pool, so it was a shock to all chosen.

She served once per week, 4 hours, for 1/2 year. It's a real commitment under threat of contempt if you skip it. DW couldn't talk much about it except to say it was mostly procedural. They approved something like 99% of the indictments.

This is state dependent. In some states, the grand jury can be more hands on.

That seems crazy. How is a full time worker supposed to miss that much work and the employer not care? I'm sure you are protected from getting fired for that but it is a significant strain on all involved. They should ask for volunteers to serve. Bored retirees or stay at home spouses could do it.

 

[audreyh1]

DW got selected here. They did a surprise lottery from the regular trial pool, so it was a shock to all chosen.

She served once per week, 4 hours, for 1/2 year. It's a real commitment under threat of contempt if you skip it. DW couldn't talk much about it except to say it was mostly procedural. They approved something like 99% of the indictments.

This is state dependent. In some states, the grand jury can be more hands on.

Yeah that was what I was originally worried about - 6 months.

I got the impression that they were pretty flexible here for people who had the occasional conflict.

They selected 12 jurors and 4 alternates. They need 9 in attendance to have a quorum.

 

[Irishgirlyc58]

I received a grand jury summons in the mail about 10 years ago.
California grand juries oversee various local government agencies. Not anything to do with the criminal side of law.

I was working and commuting at the time and the time commitment was huge. Several times a week. Since part of my day job was getting ready for ACA and Medi-Cal expansion I did not have the time to commit. The court had no problem with that and let me off the hook.

From a professional side I can only say California’s grand jury system is kind of nuts. People on them don’t typically have the in-depth knowledge needed to provide reasonable assessments of operations or practices.
In my experiences with them.

 

[cathy63]

That seems crazy. How is a full time worker supposed to miss that much work and the employer not care? I'm sure you are protected from getting fired for that but it is a significant strain on all involved. They should ask for volunteers to serve. Bored retirees or stay at home spouses could do it.

It's only about 12 days of work altogether. Large employers cover that easily, and if you have an employer that doesn't, then you are excused.

Early in my career I missed 10 consecutive days of work on trial juries (that was before we had the one and done thing we have now, so I was on three juries for misdemeanor crimes in the course of two weeks). I worked for a huge multi-national at the time, and they would have paid me no matter how long I was out. Later on when I was with a different smaller employer I was on a 3-week civil trial but it was spread over about 5 weeks of actual time and I was able to work enough evenings and weekends that it wasn't a huge hardship for them.

Since retiring I've been on two more civil trial juries, did a one-day Fed jury duty, and have just been called again for the county superior court. I have already postponed it to April 14th and will be sure to have plane tickets booked for April 28th because I really, really do not want to be on another long trial, or really even a short one! The testimony is always interesting and I have learned a lot about things I never thought I'd be interested in, but I do hate the deliberations phase.

 

[Badger]

I have been called 4 times but only chosen once. The guy was a multiple offender that was caught running out the door of a retail business and down the street with electronic equipment. He pleaded not guilty. The day the trial was to start he decided it was in his best interest to change his plea. Good thing. The defense would not have been pleased with my vote.
At 74 I am no longer required but I would not have a problem with serving.

Cheers!

 

[Richard4444]

This brings up a rough memory: In 1980 I was robbed at knife point to my throat by two escaped (from prison) murderers in the garage of my apartment building. Ended up testifying to the Grand Jury. Both events were scary, but life happens.

Rich

 

[JoeWras]

That seems crazy. How is a full time worker supposed to miss that much work and the employer not care? I'm sure you are protected from getting fired for that but it is a significant strain on all involved. They should ask for volunteers to serve. Bored retirees or stay at home spouses could do it.

What was crazy was the fact that once per quarter, they take a trial pool and surprise people with grand jury service. You go in thinking you are going to be on a 2 day trial and end up with a 6 month commitment.

The clerk sent DW home with some strong instructions to give to the boss. If they didn't impress on employers this important community service, everyone would have an excuse. DW's boss was shocked but had to go along with it.

The strong words about contempt of court are there, but it doesn't mean you can't miss a session if you have a real excuse. The clerk and judge will want it in writing, though. They do not want to deal with lack of quorum on the grand jury.

DW did share one thing. Once when a snowstorm caused people to legitimately not make it, they barely had a quorum. Turns out some members voted strangely due to idealistic thoughts and it flipped the normal voting process due to small voting pool. The DA was not happy.

 

[FI_RElater]

DW did share one thing. Once when a snowstorm caused people to legitimately not make it, they barely had a quorum. Turns out some members voted strangely due to idealistic thoughts and it flipped the normal voting process due to small voting pool. The DA was not happy.

I'd suspect that it could work either way with a small quorum, after all it is supposed to be "of ones peer"... and given the potential pool makeup in some areas it could swing in different directions depending upon who showed up. The DA usually only wants her/his potential trial/conviction, the lack of which doesn't always show well (for reelection purposes). Because it's under secrecy, the public may not know the extent of evidence (from overwhelming to significant lack of).

I've only been on multiple criminal trial juries, in different states where I've lived; never was on grand jury. In one state where I was a juror, it was unique in that jurors could submit questions to the judge during the trial... which the judge could allow or not, after consulting the different councils; never heard of such anywhere else... one just had to consider evidence presented and then the deliberations might get interesting.

 

[athena53]

At 74 I am no longer required but I would not have a problem with serving.

I turn 70 next month and it's interesting to know I have an "out". I'll still serve unless it's likely to be snowy- the one hill in my neighborhood is impassable when there are a few inches of snow on it.

I had one manager who was called for jury duty shortly after he started at my company. It was for a widely-publicized trial of people in a day-care center accused of child abuse. He was a good, conscientious guy and a father himself- exactly the kind of person you'd want on that jury. With the help of company lawyers he wrote a letter to the judge explaining that he was willing to serve but he'd be trying to get up and running in the new job in all his spare time and he didn't know if he could devote the attention to that trial that was needed. He was excused.

I still hope I can get on a jury.

 

[audreyh1]

I turn 70 next month and it's interesting to know I have an "out". I'll still serve unless it's likely to be snowy- the one hill in my neighborhood is impassable when there are a few inches of snow on it.

I had one manager who was called for jury duty shortly after he started at my company. It was for a widely-publicized trial of people in a day-care center accused of child abuse. He was a good, conscientious guy and a father himself- exactly the kind of person you'd want on that jury. With the help of company lawyers he wrote a letter to the judge explaining that he was willing to serve but he'd be trying to get up and running in the new job in all his spare time and he didn't know if he could devote the attention to that trial that was needed. He was excused.

I still hope I can get on a jury.

Some states do not have an out based on older age.

 

[Car-Guy]

Lots of people here in Texas just don't show how up for a jury summons. Yes people can "get out of it" by requesting a delay or they may have a legitimate excuse prior to the summons date and are excused. However as many as half just don't show up in the small town/county where I live. (I understand in the big cities it is even worse) How do I know? Well I've had judges (two times that I recall) actually admit to it as they are releasing and thanking those of us who did show up for a summons.

And I've never heard of anyone being prosecuted/arrested/fined for ignoring a jury summons. Maybe it happens and I just don't know anyone. (Or maybe they just won't admit it )

For me, as I mentioned in an earlier post above, I go when I get a summons. I've been called ~10 times over the years but I've only been selected for two jury trials...

 

[audreyh1]

One time we were in Spain and we saw via Informed Delivery that DH had received a regular jury summons. DH called the District Clerk explaining that he was in Spain and thought he wouldn’t be back in time to respond. She wanted his ejuror number but all he had was an image of the front of the envelope. Anyway, she found him and moved him to a different time.

The call was free BTW - WiFi calling T-Mobile back to US even from a very small town in Spain.

 

[COcheesehead]

The one and only time I got called for jury duty I made it all the way into the box of 12 jurors. We went through rounds of questions by the defendant’s lawyer and the prosecutor.
After lunch, each lawyer was allowed to remove one juror. The defendant’s lawyer asked to have me removed based on my answer to one question: would you ever admit to something you didn’t do if given an incentive?
I found out later, the defendant signed a confession and his lawyer was having to defend around it at the trial.
So it was overall an interesting experience, but the length of the trial was such that I would not have been compensated. I owned my own business at the time so compensation from my employer was a moot point as well.

 

[braumeister]

I've been called a few times for petit juries, never for a grand.
The one time I made it all the way through to sit on a trial it was kind of a surreal experience.

It was a murder trial and the evidence was a little murky but the defendant admitted to enticing the victim into his home where he shot him, but the judge's instructions were clear and after a day's deliberations we all thought the same. We returned a guilty verdict and felt we had done our job well.

The judge thanked us and dismissed us. An hour later she reversed the verdict to not guilty "because it was clearly self-defense" and that was the end of the story.

 

[Car-Guy]

I've been called a few times for petit juries, never for a grand.
The one time I made it all the way through to sit on a trial it was kind of a surreal experience.

It was a murder trial and the evidence was a little murky but the defendant admitted to enticing the victim into his home where he shot him, but the judge's instructions were clear and after a day's deliberations we all thought the same. We returned a guilty verdict and felt we had done our job well.

The judge thanked us and dismissed us. An hour later she reversed the verdict to not guilty "because it was clearly self-defense" and that was the end of the story.

I'm not sure what the judge's instructions were but it sounds like she may have given you little choice. So did you feel, based on the evidence, that it was/could have been self defense but the jury couldn't consider it? Just curious.

 

[pacergal]

Last jury summons I received was for a two year Federal term. It came at the end of Dec 2019, and was for 2020 & 2021--didn't get called up for a single day--LOL.

 

[braumeister]

No, we were incredulous. The judge's instructions were heavily weighted toward the intent.

We learned much later that the victim was a bad actor, and the defendant wasn't very bright, so I guess there were mitigating circumstances that didn't come out in the trial (which lasted an entire week).

Obviously, jurors only know what they're presented with, so I can't say what should or shouldn't happen -- the judge would know the whole story. I just thought it was highly unusual.

 

[rodi]

I was called for grand jury during covid. I never had to show up, just phone in every Sunday night for 5 weeks. They had reduced schedules because of covid so they needed fewer jurors.

My son got his first jury summons a few weeks ago but he had to postpone because it was during the winter quarter. It's postponed till summer. He'll be working a local summer internship for a large local software company, but I guess they'll have to let him go, legally. Not optimal...

I've only been selected for one trial. The one and done is kind of misleading. I was part of the voir dire that ran into a second day. I was paid nothing for the first day and $15 for the second day. Oh. . and I was given a transit pass (could have chosen a parking stipend that only covers about 1/2 of daily parking, trolley is better.)