Heat Pump Repair Costs and Refrigerants

[Ian S]

Shortly after we moved into our home some 3 years ago, both old heat pumps failed badly within a few weeks of each other. The home warranty we had paid a good chunk to replace the outside units while we had to pony up for some inside components which were fine but incompatible with the new refrigerants used in newer systems. Forward to now with one heat pump not working; we had the home warranty company send out a repair man and he claims that there is some kind of obstruction in the system and he will have to take it apart to clean it out. Now most of the parts if any that need replacing will be under warranty but the repair guys says he will have to remove the R410a refrigerant to fix the problem and that he will then have to recharge the system with new. He expects the cost of installing the 8 lbs refrigerant alone to be nearly $1600 but he hasn't yet provided me with written details of what exactly is wrong and a proper estimate of the cost to fix. Of course, neither the home nor manufacturer's warranty covers the cost of refrigerant.

To me, what the guy is charging to install the refrigerant seems very high and I'm wondering why they just don't put the old refrigerant back in. He claims they are not permitted to. Fortunately, the weather is still fairly mild and the working heat pump keeps the place comfortable. I think I'm owed a written estimate at the very least. I paid for the service call and paid for the other heat pump to be topped up with refrigerant. The tech was also pushing startup assist kits on both systems but at $300 a pop, I'm not sure of the worth. Don't modern heat pumps already have effective startup systems? TIA for any comments/advice

 

[38Chevy454]

R410a at your HVAC guy's cost is nowhere near the $200/lb he is quoting. His cost is more like $15-20/lb. Purely trying to make back some profit since the warranty company probably lowballs the payment for the job. So you are the one making the job worthwhile from a profit perspective.

Since the removal and recharging is required by the repair, why doesn't the warranty cover it? It has to be done as part of the repair. You should have some deductible and then job is covered for costs above that. At least that is the way i see it should work.

 

[FLSUnFIRE]

That sounds weird. My HVAC guy was going to pressure test my system to find a leak using nitrogen and was going to "store" the refrigerant in the compressor before isolating the lines and testing them and the air handler. I ended up having "fix-a-flat" put in (was a 3 day weekend and 90+) and it has held pressure since so I never had the leak diagnosed.

 

[Ian S]

Since the removal and recharging is required by the repair, why doesn't the warranty cover it? It has to be done as part of the repair. You should have some deductible and then job is covered for costs above that. At least that is the way i see it should work.

That's a good point. I'm going to press for a report and estimate then ask the warranty company why I have to pay for the install of the R410a. If I can't get reasonable answers I may just go elsewhere for the work.

 

[NW-Bound]

R410a is a zeotropic mixture of 2 gases at a 50/50 ratio. Supposedly, if a system has a leak then one gas may leak out more than the other, causing an imbalance.

By the book, for R410a you are supposed to evacuate and refill with all new gas. It still should not cost $1600.

 

[Ian S]

R410a is a zeotropic mixture of 2 gases at a 50/50 ratio. Supposedly, if a system has a leak then one gas may leak out more than the other, causing an imbalance.

By the book, for R410a you are supposed to evacuate and refill with all new gas. It still should not cost $1600.

Thanks for that info. Supposedly there is no leak but rules are rules. I have sent email and have left voicemail with the tech but no response. If by tomorrow there is still no response, I'll call the warranty company and see if they can explain.

 

[Bamaman]

I have a buddy that inherited a very large HVAC company. A few years ago, one of the big refrigeration giants bought his company and hired him back to run it. In most major markets, there are few owner operated HVAC installation companies. And since they're employees, they're given big sales and profit objectives--not at all objective in their business dealings.

I had an individual HVAC guy doing my repair work in the last 10 years. He suggested I replace some expensive parts in my Trane heat pump when he knew it was at the end of his usable lifespan. So I found another owner/operated HVAC company with 3 employees and low cost of doing business.

I suggest you find such a HVAC business to do your repairs. The funny thing is that there are plenty of profits in this highly skilled business without ripping off the heads of the customers. They don't need to hit a "home run" on every home they visit.

 

[NW-Bound]

That sounds weird. My HVAC guy was going to pressure test my system to find a leak using nitrogen and was going to "store" the refrigerant in the compressor before isolating the lines and testing them and the air handler. I ended up having "fix-a-flat" put in (was a 3 day weekend and 90+) and it has held pressure since so I never had the leak diagnosed.

Speaking of "storing" the refrigerant in the compressor, that's what I did earlier this year to fix a leak in the lines of my mini-split.

The instruction of the manufacturer is as follows. You close the valve at the high-pressure port of the compressor. Then, run the compressor, which pulls all the refrigerant off the lines and the indoor evaporator. A gauge hooked up to the low pressure port will tell when the refrigerant has been all sucked into the compressor. You then close off the valve on the low pressure port, and trap the refrigerant. The lines which are mostly emptied of refrigerant can now be opened up and serviced.

After the lines are reattached to the compressor, you evacuate them with a vacuum pump to pull all the air out. Then open the valves on both ports of the compressor to let the refrigerant recirculate to the system.

I measured the system pressure before and after the procedure. It stayed the same, showing very little loss of refrigerant.