Russia's 'Internal Feud' Boiling Over

Chuckanut said:
I was listening to an interview the other day and a fellow who studies wars and conflicts said the plane crash was essentially a less gruesome way to have a public execution. I suppose that's one way to look at it.



Who knows? I don't.
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Except that the other 9 people on board do not think so...
 
Koolau said:
Prigozhin must have been an arrogant so-and-so to think he was gonna come out of this alive. Had I been him, I would have attempted an escape to the West and offer "Tales out of School" to whomever would guarantee his safety.
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This is the problem with despots and the people that support them. There is no place to hide. They cannot find refuge in any developed western country because they will be arrested, tried for war crimes or crimes against humanity, and probably spend the rest of their lives in prison.
 
Birdie Num Nums said:
According to the Igor Sushko Twitter (X) feed: "Prigozhin anticipated his own probable assassination and prepared a hard drive of data for release if that happened."
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I can't imagine flying in an airplane over Russian territory was the behavior of a man who "anticipated his own probably assassination."

He was probably arrogant, figured he was above that sort of retribution. I hope I'm wrong, and there is a trove of data somewhere which will lead to the dictator's downfall.
 
Texas Proud said:
Except that the other 9 people on board do not think so...
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The plane was owned by Wagner, so I figure everyone was an employee.

Utkin, the #2 and founder of Wagner was there. He was an actual Nazi, covering himself in swastika tattoos. He named the group Wagner after Hitler's favorite composer.

The #3 was the head of Wagner security. So Putin decapitated the whole Wagner group with one stroke.

Prighozin wanted Russia to go harder after Ukraine and the west, going for total mobilization and total war and had already caused a lot of grief and chaos in Africa and Syria. No friend of ours. With Wagner dismantled, Russia will now have to find another way enslaving innocent people around the world.

The best we can hope for is that powerful bad Russians infight with powerful worse ones in the aftermath.
 
Exchme said:
With Wagner dismantled...
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I think Wagner was decapitated, not dismantled. You can bet your bottom ruble Putin has a plan to absorb the Wagner rank and file into the Russian military in some way, or maybe continue as a mercenary unit led by someone under Putin's thumb.

Whatever their structure or name going forward, I doubt we've heard the last of them.
 
MichaelB said:
Prigozhin in a plane crash? What a remarkable coincidence. How unfortunate for those traveling with him.
.
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Imagine: your sitting in a private jet, munching some preflight peanuts and sipping a vodka, minding your own business when Prigozhin walks in the door! What must go through your mind!?

(Oops, I left my briefcase in my car....you guys just go ahead and leave without me...)
 
"As I wrote 16 years ago, if you want to understand Putin's regime, don't read history books, read Mario Puzo," Garry Kasparov, the chess grandmaster who fled Russia in 2013 after his involvement in a series of ill-fated anti-Putin protest movements, tweeted. He was referring to an op-ed he wrote for the Wall Street Journal in 2007, comparing Putin's rule to The Godfather series of novels. "If a member of the inner circle goes against the capo, his life is forfeit."
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Loved this quote from Kasparov.
 
marko said:
Imagine: your sitting in a private jet, munching some preflight peanuts and sipping a vodka, minding your own business when Prigozhin walks in the door! What must go through your mind!?

(Oops, I left my briefcase in my car....you guys just go ahead and leave without me...)
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That would be worse than having Jessica Fletcher show up at your anniversary dinner.
 
Chuckanut said:
I was listening to an interview the other day and a fellow who studies wars and conflicts said the plane crash was essentially a less gruesome way to have a public execution. I suppose that's one way to look at it.



Who knows? I don't.
Click to expand...



And what are the odds that a Russian serf peasant out in the hinterlands has his/her iphone camera trained to the sky in the exact position and exact instant to catch a corporate jet plunge through the clouds and nose dive straight into the Fatherland. Puhleeze.
 
Markola said:
And what are the odds that a Russian serf peasant out in the hinterlands has his/her iphone camera trained to the sky in the exact position and exact instant to catch a corporate jet plunge through the clouds and nose dive straight into the Fatherland. Puhleeze.
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Good point, Puttie must have wanted indisputable video evidence of the event.
 
Dead Man's Switch ?
So, I heard there's a Dead Man's Switch, which becomes activated if Prigozhin dies and/or his 2nd in command also dies.
That this will activate an Assassin/Assault Group that Prigozhin hired/paid and go after Putin.
 
cyber888 said:
Dead Man's Switch ?
So, I heard there's a Dead Man's Switch, which becomes activated if Prigozhin dies and/or his 2nd in command also dies.
That this will activate an Assassin/Assault Group that Prigozhin hired/paid and go after Putin.
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That would certainly be interesting. Of course there are probably many layers of lies and intrigue in all of this. Who knows what's really true?

For example, assuming this really was in place, it's possible that Putin's goons were in on it, or aware of it, or had their own plans to thwart it, or some other convoluted plot.

I don't generally wish anyone an untimely end, but the old adage about he who lives by the sword comes to mind. I don't think Putin is a happy man right now. And I don't see him joining us in early retirement.
 
cyber888 said:
Dead Man's Switch ?
So, I heard there's a Dead Man's Switch, which becomes activated if Prigozhin dies and/or his 2nd in command also dies.
That this will activate an Assassin/Assault Group that Prigozhin hired/paid and go after Putin.
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There is enough evidence that Putin has been killing rivals of his for a long time... and evidence of his stealing billions of dollars.. even evidence of him killing Russians band blaming it on the Chechen's that actually got him into power...


I doubt anything that comes out is going to change anything.. it just might have him kill some other people...


Someone actually has to take him out to change the regime... and who knows if it will be any better...
 
My opinion , Putin never had Prigozhin killed . Prigozhin did not have a lot of friends and many enemies . From the UK , Africa , Ukraine , US and his own men . He had his own men wanting him removed . Prigozhin and Wagner was a business , he made billions ,billions from these battles . Prigozhin was making a deal in Africa without Putin’s input. From information his men were getting tired of dying while he enriched his pockets . Remember his men shot down a few Russian Airforce helicopter’s. A Russian Air Force commander just might have had it done. Putin was an attorney and would have used other methods . Russia is not the Soviet Union .
 
Breedlove said:
...Putin was an attorney and would have used other methods. Russia is not the Soviet Union .
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I wouldn't credit Putin with any qualms about this method.

But I agree with your point that it could have been someone else. Or someone else acting with a wink and a nod from the dictator. We will probably never know.
 
Breedlove said:
My opinion , Putin never had Prigozhin killed . Prigozhin did not have a lot of friends and many enemies . From the UK , Africa , Ukraine , US and his own men . He had his own men wanting him removed . Prigozhin and Wagner was a business , he made billions ,billions from these battles . Prigozhin was making a deal in Africa without Putin’s input. From information his men were getting tired of dying while he enriched his pockets . Remember his men shot down a few Russian Airforce helicopter’s. A Russian Air Force commander just might have had it done. Putin was an attorney and would have used other methods . Russia is not the Soviet Union .
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A few rebuttals.... he does not do things legally... he kills people... has been doing it for years... I read a list of about 20 killed or were attempted to be killed over the years that went against him...



No commander in the Russian army is going to shoot down anybody on their own... if it was shot down it was at Putin's direction...
 
CaptTom said:
I wouldn't credit Putin with any qualms about this method.

But I agree with your point that it could have been someone else. Or someone else acting with a wink and a nod from the dictator. We will probably never know.
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Putin's MO is to always blame others.
 
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