The power of Social media

[MultiEventer]

No Politics please , last night there was a story on the local news . They made it out as a joke but it truly is a sad joke . It seems last summer there was a big protest downtown Houston . Two different sides people shouting and screaming at each other . Local Houston news did an investigation prior to the protest and found out the whole thing was created by Russian hackers . They found the originating websites since have been removed and found the bots had sent out 1.4 million hits to facebook and other media. Now the sad part when one of the reporters interviewed a handful of the protestors from each side they just shook their heads . One guy even said he felt duped . The main issue was there was no issue to protest once the two sides were brought together and told the truth .

I enjoy talking about economics, FIRE and politics online and with people. But it's a contentious thing to do and you must tread lightly. The most important thing I learned long ago, especially when debating online, is to wait for the facts to come out before you make any personal judgments or declarations. I've been burned more than once with the fake news/hoaxes out there and had retract things and personally apologize. In the past 5 years, the fake news phenom is real and disturbing. We have militants in big cities attacking people over false presumptions, lies, deceit and fake news. Don't be part of it and make damn sure you get your news from sites that are telling the truth! I avoid all mainstream media sources like the plague!

 

[Chuckanut]

What? You people don't want to know how JJ Celebrity took down Mayor LaDilbert with a great tweet? What could possibly be more important than that in your lives?

 

[SpinDoctorTX]

A lot of people get their news from social media clickbait, and not from credible & balanced news sources. It's sad but folks aren't always thinking for themselves these days.

 

[Chuckanut]

A lot of people get their news from social media clickbait, and not from credible & balanced news sources. It's sad but folks aren't always thinking for themselves these days.

Worse is that previously credible news sources have become biased to the point where one no longer can depend on them. Often it's not a direct falsehood, but something left out that spins the story in favor of one group while making their opposition look exceptionally bad.

One of my least liked 'reporters' has the habit of interviewing people and then adding onto the end "So what you are saying is.... blah, blah, blah." I don't need him/her to tell me what Senator Bumblebottom is saying. I can figure that out myself. Just ask good questions that get to the issues. I have a mind. I can think.

 

[Lsbcal]

How do I know you aren't all Russian bots made believable by the latest AI tech?

 

[Walt34]

How do I know you aren't all Russian bots made believable by the latest AI tech?

If I wanted you to know I'd tell you....

 

[jimbee]

Critical/Analytical thinking and logic [-]went out the window decades ago[/-].

...were never very common (IMO).

 

[ERD50]

A lot of people get their news from social media clickbait, and not from credible & balanced news sources. It's sad but folks aren't always thinking for themselves these days.

IMO, there are no "credible & balanced news sources". The only thing credible is the source itself, like an unedited video of the event (even that may be from an angle that misses important information), not the video clip the news media shows you. And the source itself doesn't need to be measured on 'balance' - it just is (assuming it is complete, and unedited).

Worse is that previously credible news sources have become biased to the point where one no longer can depend on them. Often it's not a direct falsehood, but something left out that spins the story in favor of one group while making their opposition look exceptionally bad.

One of my least liked 'reporters' has the habit of interviewing people and then adding onto the end "So what you are saying is.... blah, blah, blah." I don't need him/her to tell me what Senator Bumblebottom is saying. I can figure that out myself. Just ask good questions that get to the issues. I have a mind. I can think.

+1

So much of the bias I see is what is not reported. And as you say, the "news person" interjecting their spin in to the report. Just report it, let me decide if it is "controversial", or "said in response to the turmoil", or "favors one group".

Originally Posted by Badger View Post
Critical/Analytical thinking and logic went out the window decades ago.

...were never very common (IMO).

Yes, I think this is revisionist history "good old days" thinking. Some of those "common sense isn't common" quips are probably from a hundred years or so ago.

OK, here' some good ones:

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/tag/common-sense

“Common sense is not so common.”
― Voltaire, A Pocket Philosophical Dictionary

“Common sense in an uncommon degree is what the world calls wisdom.”
― Samuel Taylor Coleridge, Literary Remains, Vol. 1

“Common sense ain't common.”
― Will Rogers

“Common sense is the most widely shared commodity in the world, for every man is convinced that he is well supplied with it.”
― Rene Descartes

And a contrary view, maybe:

“Common sense is what tells us the earth is flat.”

-ERD50

 

[Chuckanut]

How do I know you aren't all Russian bots made believable by the latest AI tech?

We might be. Or maybe not. Perhaps we need more FIRE get-togethers so we can meet each other.

I had in interesting experience in 2016 when I briefly followed a political forum recommended by an acquaintance. (I plead temporary insanity.) If a person said anything even slightly negative against Candidate A, this one person would counter it within 15-20 minutes, often with a wisecrack, personal attack, or a snarky comment about Candidate B. This happened no matter what time the comments were made - 1:00PM or 1:00AM, 4:00PM or 4:00AM) I suppose this guy could have been up 24/7 monitoring the forum for comments he did not like. But, I think it much more likely 'he' was a bot.

IMHO, the most important part of the Mueller report was the part that detailed how these foreign agents manuevered their way into seeming to be credible.

I have since returned to sanity and ignore political forums and those who haunt them.

 

[Lsbcal]

Interesting comment Chuckanut. I bet your are not a Russian bot because that point of view would not come from such a source.

Sometimes I wonder what drives the world orders and what sets those political boundaries we see on maps. I generally wind up putting this down to nasty raw power. Emotions and drives that exist in all humans. Partly it is self defense but then there was the ancient Roman Empire. A great example of going beyond just defense. And in the scheme of things, it wasn't that long ago.

 

[Music Lover]

IMHO, the most important part of the Mueller report was the part that detailed how these foreign agents manuevered their way into seeming to be credible.

I think by far the biggest threat is from the media. They've long since given up an pretense of objectivity.

 

[HFWR]

I think by far the biggest threat is from the media. They've long since given up an pretense of objectivity.

And this is one of the things identified as one of their goals, i.e. convince people that all media outlets are guilty, and that we can’t trust anyone....

 

[Music Lover]

And this is one of the things identified as one of their goals, i.e. convince people that all media outlets are guilty, and that we can’t trust anyone....

The media is doing a fine job of discrediting itself without any outside help. It's not like you need a push or have to look very hard to find evidence of them lying.

 

[Lsbcal]

Here is one source that places media in context of bias: https://www.allsides.com/media-bias/media-bias-ratings

A helpful chart from them:

I tend to read Reuters and BBC(best on a smartphone). Bloomberg seems to be going to a pay model and at rates I don't like.

 

[HFWR]

The media is doing a fine job of discrediting itself without any outside help. It's not like you need a push or have to look very hard to find evidence of them lying.

As noted, the “Russian interference” seemed to have three goals in mind:

- Support one candidate over another;
- But, regardless to that outcome, post inflammatory, often false and conspiratorial, memes and comments on social media, to create more tension around already divisive issues;
- Create the impression that “the media” was fake news.

I submit there’s plenty of bias, but with a bit of curiosity, it’s possible to come to a reasonable conclusion about the objective, measurable truth. Of course, not everything is objective or measurable...

 

[MichaelB]

Of course, not everything is objective or measurable...

DW says this to me all the time

 

[Music Lover]

As noted, the “Russian interference” seemed to have three goals in mind:

- Support one candidate over another;
- But, regardless to that outcome, post inflammatory, often false and conspiratorial, memes and comments on social media, to create more tension around already divisive issues;
- Create the impression that “the media” was fake news.

Well, I do agree that the media pushed that version of events but that doesn't make it even remotely true. There are a dozen examples of outright lies...not just bias...in the last few months alone from the media with no help from foreign bots, most of which would prompt any reasonable person to be suspect of anything that they say.

 

[Chuckanut]

I would love to continue the discussion with you folks, but one of the on-line influencers I follow on social media just wrote about a new kitchen device I must have to make perfect Osso Buko. It will positively dazzle my friends, and make me a valued contributor to the gourmet glitterati in my area.

 

[MichaelB]

There is one news source that is absolutely reliable, and many here look to it for completely unbiased reporting. Yes, I’m referring to The Onion.

For example, their current headline story is this

MENLO PARK, CA—In an effort to put to rest concerns about the direction of the social media giant, Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg announced Friday that all of the company’s future decisions would be made by the Cube Of Justice, which reportedly cannot be questioned nor misled by any mortal means.

Looks like they even have an exclusive on this story - no one else is saying a word.

 

[HFWR]

Well, I do agree that the media pushed that version of events but that doesn't make it even remotely true. There are a dozen examples of outright lies...not just bias...in the last few months alone from the media with no help from foreign bots, most of which would prompt any reasonable person to be suspect of anything that they say.

I agree, that propaganda from Russians is “interference”, and from Americans it’s “free speech”. Apparently there’s no requirement to be truthful... But, having said that, “the media” is pretty diverse, though I suspect going down that road would invoke bacon. So I ‘ll quote a bit from the Senate report:

(U)TheRussiangovernment'sattackonthe2016electionwastheproductofa deliberate,sustained,andsophisticatedcampaigntoundermineAmericandemocracy.Russian militaryintelligencecarriedoutahackingoperationtargetingAmericanpoliticalfiguresand institutions.TheInternetResearchAgency—an entitywithtiestoRussianPresidentVladimir Putin—^usedsocialmediatosow disinformationanddiscordamongtheAmericanelectorate, And,asthisreportmakesclear,individualsaffiliatedwiththeRussiangovernmentlaunched cyberoperationsthatattemptedtoaccessournation'selectioninfrastructure,insome cases succeedhig.
(U)TheRussianobjectiveswereclear:deependistrustinourpoliticalleaders;exploit andwidendivisionswithinAmericansociety;undermineconfidenceintheintegrityofour elections;and,ultimately,weakenAmerica'sdemocraticinstitutionsanddamageournation's standingintheworld.TheCommitteedidnotdiscoverevidencethatRussiachangedor manipulatedvotetalliesorvoterregistrationinformation,howeverRussianoperatives undoubtedlygainedfamiliaritywithourelectionsystemsandvoterregistrationinfrastructure— valuableintelligencethatitmay seektoexploitinthefuture.

Sorry about the missing spaces. Would not let me fix... Source document here...

https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/documents/Report_Volume1.pdf

 

[athena53]

I would love to continue the discussion with you folks, but one of the on-line influencers I follow on social media just wrote about a new kitchen device I must have to make perfect Osso Buko. It will positively dazzle my friends, and make me a valued contributor to the gourmet glitterati in my area.

And I just clicked through the list of must-have wardrobe items for Fall and I'm headed to the mall.

 

[Lsbcal]

Just had a talk with dear Vladimir. He kind of disdains this site. But took special interest in this thread.

 

[Major Tom]

I'm quite surprised this thread is still here.

 

[Lsbcal]

I'm quite surprised this thread is still here.

I think people have been very respectful of others on this thread so maybe that is why. Plus the moderator has ignored my silly posts.

 

[Major Tom]

I think people have been very respectful of others on this thread so maybe that is why. Plus the moderator has ignored my silly posts.

Agreed. Even so, we've danced pretty close to the edge, IMHO.