Why are Some (Most?) Dentists Con Artists?

My awesome dentist who I actually trust has mostly retired at something like 85 years of age. His name is on the building still but it's been over a year since the music in the office changed and the front desk staff got swapped out. My favorite hygienist and dental assistants are still there, and so far the young guy who he brought on is seeming pretty solid so hopefully I can keep trusting them, but we will see...
 
Rianne said:
This article is a long read. There are many specific paragraphs that apply to this thread. I gifted the whole article but am highlighting a bit. "The Truth about Dentistry"
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I have no problem with dentists "offering" the up-sell option as long as they explain the costs and benefits. A range of options is preferable to no options at all. My dentist offers some of the gee-whiz options, but never pushes them. He just lets me know they're out there.
 
Just another story to add. About 6 months ago, I had a dental visit in a town near my mom. I explained to the dentist - and he could tell himself, that one of my crowns, one that sits on an implant, is somewhat wiggly. His treatment plan was to replace the entire crown.

I ended up not replacing the crown and traveling for several months and I am now back in the US. I went to a cleaning appointment with a different dentist. Her suggestion for the wiggly crown? To send her an email of the implant brand and dimensions - and if she has the parts, she will fix it and stabilize the crown. If she has to get the parts, she will - and no new crown needed in either case. I am sure there will be a fee for this, but certainly less than a replacement crown.

Second opinions - I dig 'em
 
Rianne said:
"Among other problems, dentistry’s struggle to embrace scientific inquiry has left dentists with considerable latitude to advise unnecessary procedures—whether intentionally or not. The standard euphemism for this proclivity is overtreatment."
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While "utilization review" has gone overboard in health insurance, I think that the fact that dental insurers typically have low annual limits on what they pay out ($1,500- $2,000 is typical) means they don't have much motivation to control over-treatment. Once they've paid their limit, whatever you shell out for deep cleaning, scaling, veneers, etc. is your problem.

SunnyOne said:
About 6 months ago, I had a dental visit in a town near my mom. I explained to the dentist - and he could tell himself, that one of my crowns, one that sits on an implant, is somewhat wiggly. His treatment plan was to replace the entire crown.
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DH had that issue- our dentist drilled a small hole in the top, went in with a screwdriver, torqued it down, and filled up the hole. End of problem. I'm glad you found someone similarly conservative.
 
I'm not suggesting that either of the two dentists that I have seen recently are con-artists - but it seems dentistry is one area where a second opinion could be a very worthwhile expenditure of time, possibly money.
 
SunnyOne said:
Just another story to add. About 6 months ago, I had a dental visit in a town near my mom. I explained to the dentist - and he could tell himself, that one of my crowns, one that sits on an implant, is somewhat wiggly. His treatment plan was to replace the entire crown.

I ended up not replacing the crown and traveling for several months and I am now back in the US. I went to a cleaning appointment with a different dentist. Her suggestion for the wiggly crown? To send her an email of the implant brand and dimensions - and if she has the parts, she will fix it and stabilize the crown. If she has to get the parts, she will - and no new crown needed in either case. I am sure there will be a fee for this, but certainly less than a replacement crown.

Second opinions - I dig 'em
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there could be a number of possible reasons why the crown is "wiggly". first off a crown can attached to the abutment either with cement or a screw. if it is cemented on and it comes loose, assuming the crown fits properly, it can be recemented. if it came loose because it doesn't fit properly then a new crown needs to be made. if it is screwed on to the abutment and the screw becomes loose then you can remove the filling in the center of the crown over the screw and tighten the screw and replace the filling. the worst case scenario is if the implant has come loose. then the entire implant needs to be removed, bone grafted and a new implant placed. with the information you have provided there is no way of knowing which of these applies.
 
I just wish every appointment doesn't suck the skin off most of my lips. Is there a requirement to do that to people? Seems excessive.
 
with the information you have provided there is no way of knowing which of these applies.

Of course we won't know until the actual troubleshooting process begins - but I was glad to find a dentist whose first response is to start on the low end (time, expense, etc) and work our way up, if necessary - versus just jumping to an expensive solution that may not even be needed.

Reminded me of the very best dentist I've ever had - Dr. Dan Watt, retired - master tinkerer, never got out the big guns until war was imminent. I credit him with showing me, at a young age, how to maintain healthy gums for life.
 
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Sunnyone, that link is a little scary. I would feel very harassed if they started calling me the next day with pressure to schedule work.
 
My daughter used to go to the same dentist DW and I go to, but when she changed insurance our dentist wasn't in network. So, she went to one of the national franchise chain dental places. You guessed it - she had 6 cavities, root canal and a crown. All urgent. We talked her into going back to our dentist for a second opinion. Sure enough, none of the "spots" needed any immediate work. What a racket!
 
Sunnyone, that link is a little scary.

and that was just one link! they're all over the web, articles encouraging dentists to increase something called the "case acceptance rate"....to increase business. I get that it's a business....just don't want to consider that it's not a legitimate business bordering on scams.
 
PatrickA5 said:
My daughter used to go to the same dentist DW and I go to, but when she changed insurance our dentist wasn't in network. So, she went to one of the national franchise chain dental places. You guessed it - she had 6 cavities, root canal and a crown. All urgent. We talked her into going back to our dentist for a second opinion. Sure enough, none of the "spots" needed any immediate work. What a racket!
Click to expand...

Exactly. That's why I pay out of pocket to see my dentist. It's not worth the $xxx bucks a month for dental insurance for some dentist in a network to tell me I need thousands $$ of dental work. Especially when the insurance only pays a specific portion if it fits in their guidelines of service. I think the insurance is a racket as well.
 
I got a great deal out of a new dentist! I was brought in for a tour, saw seven chairs with room for 4 more. I was shown the digital x-ray and camera equipment, saw the milling machine that cuts crowns with the digital data created with all the latest high tech dental equipment.
Then to top it of I ask about getting a replacement crown on one of two molars that were poorly done with no contact, They are over 10 years old and the gap has always been a problem. The lady dentist told me those crowns are beautiful, well done and in good condition, I would not replace either. However a few years ago I broke a tooth and my regular dentist has been saying I should get a crown put on it. It felt cavernous when I first broke it, but with a little time I lost track of which tooth. This new dentist also recommended I put a crown on that tooth. So, she ground it down, did the digital imaging, the imaging data told the mill how to cut the tooth, the assistant burnished it, the dentist set the color, (they are purple before firing). The assist checked the fit and made a slight contact adjustment, the dentist added adhesive to set it and did a minor closed mouth contact adjustment. Painless procedure, absolutely no pain afterward. It took less than 2 hrs start to finish.
The best, there was no charge for the $1500 crown. :dance:


All I need are 200 more crowns and my daughter and I will be even for the cost of her dental education. :LOL:
 
Time2 said:
I got a great deal out of a new dentist! I was brought in for a tour, saw seven chairs with room for 4 more. I was shown the digital x-ray and camera equipment, saw the milling machine that cuts crowns with the digital data created with all the latest high tech dental equipment.
Then to top it of I ask about getting a replacement crown on one of two molars that were poorly done with no contact, They are over 10 years old and the gap has always been a problem. The lady dentist told me those crowns are beautiful, well done and in good condition, I would not replace either. However a few years ago I broke a tooth and my regular dentist has been saying I should get a crown put on it. It felt cavernous when I first broke it, but with a little time I lost track of which tooth. This new dentist also recommended I put a crown on that tooth. So, she ground it down, did the digital imaging, the imaging data told the mill how to cut the tooth, the assistant burnished it, the dentist set the color, (they are purple before firing). The assist checked the fit and made a slight contact adjustment, the dentist added adhesive to set it and did a minor closed mouth contact adjustment. Painless procedure, absolutely no pain afterward. It took less than 2 hrs start to finish.
The best, there was no charge for the $1500 crown. :dance:


All I need are 200 more crowns and my daughter and I will be even for the cost of her dental education. :LOL:
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Haha! Surprise ending, great story. Still laughing...
 
Koolau said:
I love it!


Now, if I could just get my kids' educations to pay off for ME!
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Ya, I got 0.5% back. :)
Actually did a bit better, my wife got a cleaning also. My son got a cleaning and whitening, but he has dental through work, so his insurance was charged.
 
Time2 said:
I got a great deal out of a new dentist! I was brought in for a tour, saw seven chairs with room for 4 more. I was shown the digital x-ray and camera equipment, saw the milling machine that cuts crowns with the digital data created with all the latest high tech dental equipment.
Then to top it of I ask about getting a replacement crown on one of two molars that were poorly done with no contact, They are over 10 years old and the gap has always been a problem. The lady dentist told me those crowns are beautiful, well done and in good condition, I would not replace either. However a few years ago I broke a tooth and my regular dentist has been saying I should get a crown put on it. It felt cavernous when I first broke it, but with a little time I lost track of which tooth. This new dentist also recommended I put a crown on that tooth. So, she ground it down, did the digital imaging, the imaging data told the mill how to cut the tooth, the assistant burnished it, the dentist set the color, (they are purple before firing). The assist checked the fit and made a slight contact adjustment, the dentist added adhesive to set it and did a minor closed mouth contact adjustment. Painless procedure, absolutely no pain afterward. It took less than 2 hrs start to finish.
The best, there was no charge for the $1500 crown. :dance:


All I need are 200 more crowns and my daughter and I will be even for the cost of her dental education. :LOL:
Click to expand...

Did I miss something? Why was there no charge?
 
I might have said this before good friends of ours in the Netherlands . She just retired as a dentist . We were talking right before she retired ,her office is in her townhouse duplex . Half her home is dentist office and half her husband and her live in . I was complaining having to pay 90.00 to get my teeth cleaned . She rolled her eyes and said she is only allowed to charge 9 eu for teeth cleaning. She said she had to work 4 days a week and do paperwork one day a week and work at the free clinic one Saturday a month.
 
Time2 said:
I got a great deal out of a new dentist! I was brought in for a tour, saw seven chairs with room for 4 more. I was shown the digital x-ray and camera equipment, saw the milling machine that cuts crowns with the digital data created with all the latest high tech dental equipment.
Then to top it of I ask about getting a replacement crown on one of two molars that were poorly done with no contact, They are over 10 years old and the gap has always been a problem. The lady dentist told me those crowns are beautiful, well done and in good condition, I would not replace either. However a few years ago I broke a tooth and my regular dentist has been saying I should get a crown put on it. It felt cavernous when I first broke it, but with a little time I lost track of which tooth. This new dentist also recommended I put a crown on that tooth. So, she ground it down, did the digital imaging, the imaging data told the mill how to cut the tooth, the assistant burnished it, the dentist set the color, (they are purple before firing). The assist checked the fit and made a slight contact adjustment, the dentist added adhesive to set it and did a minor closed mouth contact adjustment. Painless procedure, absolutely no pain afterward. It took less than 2 hrs start to finish.
The best, there was no charge for the $1500 crown. :dance:


All I need are 200 more crowns and my daughter and I will be even for the cost of her dental education. :LOL:
Click to expand...

Calico said:
Did I miss something? Why was there no charge?
Click to expand...


The last line of my post, read carefully should clear it up.


>>All I need are 200 more crowns and my daughter and I will be even for the cost of her dental education. :LOL:<<
 
I was waiting for Time2's punchline. I recalled the posts about dental school ...

My own dentist is a great guy - retired navy officer, provides his phone number for emergencies, does good work and doesn't seem to find all sorts of extra procedures that need doing.
 
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