Worries

[Eagle43]

Since I am 62, need to make it to the end of the chart! Slowly, one day at a time. And enjoy the ride.

 

[Jay_Gatsby]

As far as the money:  I worry that I will worry too much about it, denying myself things and experiences, then have lots of money when I'm old and have people trying to manipulate me or worse (think Agatha Christie novels!) to get it.

I don't necessarily worry about the latter, but I certainly worry about the former. It's hard not to think that you're denying yourself some great experiences (and therefore great memories in your old age) just to save money above and beyond what you'll need for your retirement. We're constantly bombarded by advertisements and media messages about all of the "fun" we could be having on vacation, at restaurants, with the latest gadget, etc...

I think that many people on this board save far more than they'll ever need in retirement -- even early retirement. While having a couple of million at retirement is nice, if you've been frugal all your life, how can you possibly spend up to even a safe withdrawal rate of 4% (i.e. $80k a year pre-tax)? Chances are, you've been spending half that for 20 years, so even taking inflation into account, you'll still have a sizeable estate.

 

[haha]

I don't necessarily worry about the latter, but I certainly worry about the former.  It's hard not to think that you're denying yourself some great experiences (and therefore great memories in your old age) just to save money above and beyond what you'll need for your retirement.  We're constantly bombarded by advertisements and media messages about all of the "fun" we could be having on vacation, at restaurants, with the latest gadget, etc...

I think you said a mouthful here. Worrying about missing experience is a manufactured worry- created by advertising. If you are engaged in life, and at least some of the time choose passion over safety you will feel good about things.

When my dad got old, I am pretty sure his main pleasant memories were of being a young father and a young man dealing with life. And maybe he also had some fond memories of an occasional detour from the main road.

Ha

 

[shiny]

I was just being a bit dramatic with the Agatha Christie thing, even though the rich, childless aunt does often end up being the victim! But, I sometimes feel I'm denying myself things even without advertisers tying to suck me in. For now it feels worth it, we are almost to the goal. But once we meet the goal I really hope to relax and enjoy whatever it is I want to do within the SWR, but that is the main worry, that I'll needlessly obsess about it.

 

[Billy]

Hi Ha-Ha..

I think Reinventing ourselves is important - and not just when we retire.  8)


I'm sure you feel the same way -- we don't wanna get stale or get in a rut. Try something new, even if it's just walking on the other side of the sidewalk for a change. Then tomorrow do something REALLY brave like eat some vegetables that you normally don't!    

All this simply gets the mental juices going and before you know it, we are more mentally flexible.. It's really important...  8)  Life's too short.

A friend of ours was hit by a tour bus the other week... out cold for 10 minutes...  He's ok, but he's re-thinking a lotta stuff!

Akaisha
Author, The Adventurer's Guide to Early Retirement

 

[MJ]

Hi Ha-Ha..
A friend of ours was hit by a tour bus the other week... out cold for 10 minutes... He's ok, but he's re-thinking a lotta stuff!

I hope he wasn't riding a bicycle. I'm glad he recovered.

MJ

 

[Marshac]

I can send you cuttings of a variety produces great fruit, is almost impossible kill. Ranks right up there with Morning Glory, English Ivy and Scotch Broom.    

Those Himalayan blackberries are the WORST. They are not native to the PNW, but love the weather... the canes will grow up to 1' per day in the summer. Nice big blackberries, although you really pay for them in blood. To get rid of them, you pretty much have to hack the canes back down to ground level, and then paint the "stump" with super-concentrated roundup.

 

[Nords]

To get rid of them, you pretty much have to hack the canes back down to ground level, and then paint the "stump" with super-concentrated roundup.

Haole koa trees.

More than once, too. They come back two or three times despite the application of the concentrated stuff at $40/quart...

 

[Billy]

MJ:

I hope he wasn't riding a bicycle. I'm glad he recovered.

Naw, he was doing the dangerous activity of walking around in Bangkok...  It shook him up, though...  and unfortunately, he wanted to bring in his insurance carrier from the States...     and then got caught up in a bureaucratic nightmare.    That was worse, I think, than being hit.   

Akaisha
Author, The Adventurer's Guide to Early Retirement

 

[MJ]

hi Akaisha,

I cosider myself a fairly careful bicyclist in traffic challenged NYC so after I arrived in Bangkok, I quickly adjusted to the opposite and the hectic traffic flow.
As you know, looking in the wrong direction for a split second can be very hazardeous in Thai congested cities.

 

[Martha]

Haole koa trees.

More than once, too. They come back two or three times despite the application of the concentrated stuff at $40/quart...

Those Himalayan blackberries are the WORST. They are not native to the PNW, but love the weather... the canes will grow up to 1' per day in the summer. Nice big blackberries, although you really pay for them in blood. To get rid of them, you pretty much have to hack the canes back down to ground level, and then paint the "stump" with super-concentrated roundup.

Sometimes using superconcentrated Roundup doesn't work because the plant won't take the high concentrations into its roots. Generally a lower concentration works better, even if you have to apply a couple of times.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

They should make one of those hardhats with two beer cans and tubing things for plant roots and roundup.

 

[BUM]

Sometimes when I'm really busy and want to catch up on my reading I do what my college english prof suggested. Read the first and last chapters completely and skim the rest.

It doesn't work here dammit. Martha wants to know about ER worries and I end up 5 screens later with beer can hats for plants!?

And not for nuttin' I was the one who said my FIL said "Money will be the least of your worries..."

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

It doesn't work here dammit. Martha wants to know about ER worries and I end up 5 screens later with beer can hats for plants!?

Dont try this at home without adult supervision, we are professionals...

 

[mathjak107]

as long as its my money that goes first ,hey i can deal with that.....

 

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

The best way I have found to kill Himalayan blackberries is to pull the damned things out by the roots. They grow in soft ground. Use heavy rubber gloves, them thorns bite. Can't pull morning glories out that way--the roots are soft and break and now you have two.

I worry about being debt-free before I stop working. College is a drain. (I know, I know. But I figure they need a good start at least.)

I am also concerned that DW may have trouble cutting back on possessions when we have to downsize. I am used to living out of a suitcase, but she really enjoys the house and all her stuff. I am hoping for a soft landing of some kind. This is a serious issue. (I just read the blog of the RV fulltimer who retired at 55 and lives on $1k/mo and how he went through his own downsizing.)

Also worry about the health insurance issue, but not so much as before. Once one leaves the Land of the Rich and the Home of the Slave, that gets simpler.

 

[Billy]

Ed the Gypsy

I am also concerned that DW may have trouble cutting back on possessions when we have to downsize.  I am used to living out of a suitcase, but she really enjoys the house and all her stuff.  I am hoping for a soft landing of some kind.  This is a serious issue. 

Are you saying it's a serious issue for her or for you? or her possible unhappiness is a serious issue for the both of you?

Another way to look at the 'downsizing' is that it isn't. It will be 'right sizing.'   

Life is full of choices and trade offs... we can't escape it in any way, and much of how we get through changes is how we describe them to ourselves.

Do you know what I mean?

Akaisha
Author, The Adventurer's Guide to Early Retirement

 

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

Hi, Akaisha,

Her possible unhappiness may become a serious issue for both of us.

My difficulty is that I am trying to plan for survival, not a long vacation. I don't have a million dollars but I don't want to work forever, to die in my cubicle, much less far from my family (as I am today). But things may turn out that way.

I have a sales job to do on her and if I am not successful, we will be in desperate straits when we are older. She doesn't understand yet that we are facing limited choices and some of them are not very pleasant. We can't hold on to a big house full of stuff while living somewhere else. If I could afford to do that, our future would be a lot simpler, but it ain't possible.

When we were younger, we lived many places and travelled quite a bit without a lot of baggage, so I am hopeful.

I know exactly what you mean, but it will be hard in my household.

Ed

 

[shiny]

I have a sales job to do on her and if I am not successful, we will be in desperate straits when we are older. She doesn't understand yet that we are facing limited choices and some of them are not very pleasant. We can't hold on to a big house full of stuff while living somewhere else. If I could afford to do that, our future would be a lot simpler, but it ain't possible.

Ed, that is a bit worrisome. DH and I both say we want to downscale and travel for a while and it is still hard to do, so it may be traumatic for someone who doesn't want to let go. We are slowly getting rid of things and its not too bad, but when it really comes down to the bare essentials I know it will be hard even though I want to do it!

 

[Billy]

ED:

Her possible unhappiness may become a serious issue for both of us. My difficulty is that I am trying to plan for survival, not a long vacation.  I have a sales job to do on her and if I am not successful, we will be in desperate straits when we are older. She doesn't understand yet...We can't hold on to a big house full of stuff while living somewhere else. When we were younger, we lived many places and travelled quite a bit without a lot of baggage, so I am hopeful.

Shiny:

Ed, that is a bit worrisome. DH and I both say we want to downscale and travel for a while and it is still hard to do, so it may be traumatic for someone who doesn't want to let go. We are slowly getting rid of things and its not too bad, but when it really comes down to the bare essentials I know it will be hard even though I want to do it!

Hi Guys,... I can't say I have the answers here, but I can give you my insight... 8)

When Billy first brought up the idea of ER to me 16 years ago, I was 36. Also, I wasn't ready, I was scared and so I became angry. It was an idea/concept that I didn't understand and that is why I resisted it.

Now, the reason I didn't understand it, is because: 

1) It threatened the way I was viewing how life 'should' be lived   
2) I didn't know what I would replace my current working lifestyle with.. (how would I fill my time?) 
3) I would have to leave family, all my stuff, I loved my house... etc. etc. etc. 
4) I was flat-out scared, didn't know anyone else who was doing that, and didn't believe it would work.

Any of this sound familiar?

If I were to give any advice at all, I would suggest the following:

1) Try not to attack her value system, or tell her that her perceptions are 'screwed up'.  :

--In other words, be a friend to her, realize she is scared. If you love her, this shouldn't be a problem, and it will take patience. However, you are both in this together, so expect her to help in creating the life you both want. Expect her to participate and contribute.

2.) Offer solutions or replacements to what you are "taking away". 

--This is really important, Guys... to just "take away" home, stuff, family, friends, a job or activities that she is identified with will only create resistance and more anger and fear.  Both you and your wife must concentrate on what will replace that which you are leaving behind. What will you do with your time, How will you contact family and or friends, perhaps a temporary storage option may be helpful for some 'stuff', etc...

3.) Get it clear in your mind what is important to the both of you.    

--Make a list of what is important and prioritize it. No fair putting everything as #1. This has to be done. Then you find out what is common between you, and you work on the rest.

4)  Let go and cry, let go and cry...

-- Let her cry. I know this is tough on guys, but girls gotta do it.     

Some of my favorite possessions I gave to my sisters or best girlfriends... that way I wasn't "really" losing it. My Grandmother's china is still in storage at a friend's... But basically, once I got started, (and was allowed to cry) I let it go.

Does this help at all? Did I leave something important out? Are you dealing with something else I didn't mention?

sigh... Guys and Gals..  we're different!    Its a good thing! (Honest!  8))

Akaisha
Author, The Adventurer's Guide to Early Retirement

 

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

I think we can make it work if we take it in steps. I guess if we do look at it as a long vacation, the transition may be easier. If we rent out or sell the house and put valued items in storage, then go off for a year, it would be a first step. As long as the first step don't bust the piggy bank, we can see where it goes from there. Avoids trauma up front.

We shall see, won't we?

 

[Nords]

I think we can make it work if we take it in steps.  I guess if we do look at it as a long vacation, the transition may be easier.  If we rent out or sell the house and put valued items in storage, then go off for a year, it would be a first step.  As long as the first step don't bust the piggy bank, we can see where it goes from there.  Avoids trauma up front.

We shall see, won't we?

When you come back after that first year it'll be one heckuva garage sale!

 

[Billy]

Nords:

When you come back after that first year it'll be one heckuva garage sale!

I have to laugh and agree here.. when we first ER'd we had 2 weekends of estate sales, then two weekends of flea markets. Then it was the Goodwill, and then the storage shed.       How much stuff did we have?

After  living 6 months on Nevis in the Caribbean, we came back to the storage shed and said "Huh?"    and got rid of more stuff!   

I can honestly say I never want to own that much stuff again... whew!     

Akaisha
Author, The Adventurer's Guide to Early Retirement