"Your First Million is the Toughest" How long did it take you?

What's that old saying? Don't confuse brains with a bull market.
No, it's always the same.

goal setting, drive, and determination.

No random winnings, no lucky hands, all irrelevant. Index funds and a diverse portfolio are great advice for a passive investor. To an active investor, these have no direct relevance as a good or bad strategy.

If you think humans are incable of identifying a good business, and seeing a good "buy" opportunity when it presents itself, you're kidding yourself. You can probably do this at age 13. It does however take time, and effort, to be on top of things, so you can recognize the opportunity, and take advantage of it, when the time comes. Same story day in, day out, for successful people everywhere.

So, the advice is:
If you want passive investments, diversify and try index funds/mutual finds.
If you want active investments, work hard, stay on top of it, and don't give up.

Suggesting an active investor diversify for no reason, is not good advice IMO.

-Mach
 
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There is no set formula that is going to consistently "beat the market". If there was, everyone would be using it, and it would stop working.

The people who make killings in the market are either very, very lucky; or they have an innate "feel" for things that just cannot be quantified in any formula or plan. Warren Buffet didn't follow someone else's formula... he made his best calls, and he haad that "feel". Thousands and thousands of people have studied him, how he thinks, what he's written, where and how he invested... and have gotten nowhere.

Personally, I'm very likely to stick with my aggregation of mutual funds. I don't know nearly enough about stocks, the businesses various companies are in, and the business models of the specific companies I could invest in. I just don't see how more than a minute fraction of investors could consistently and reliably make money in stocks without being expert in every facet of the businesses they're investing in. My philosophy is, the fund managers are being paid millions of dollars a year to do what they're doing... if they aren't successful, they'll be replaced. I'll trust them and their judgement to handle that particular sector of my investments, and I'll trust that my diversification will protect me if/when their judgement falls short or bad karma strikes. Over the long run, I'll do better than most "active investors". Sure there'll be some who far surpass me, and my hat is off to them. If I knew who they were today, I'd start to piggyback on them. But since I won't know who they are until after the fact, I guess I'll have to be content with a BMW while they zoom by in a Bugatti or something :D
 
There is no set formula that is going to consistently "beat the market". If there was, everyone would be using it, and it would stop working.
We're disussing learning about your investments, or not learning about them. Likewise, if as you say passive investments always returned on average more than active trading, we'd all passively trade and it would stop working. Which of course isn't the case. Passive investors choose passive investments, active investors choose active investments, as they return more on average.

The people who make killings in the market are either very, very lucky; or they have an innate "feel" for things that just cannot be quantified in any formula or plan.

The reality is, that if you work hard at something, you are far more likely to be successful at it than someone who does not. Goes for most everything of course. How did investments become magically excluded from this? (they did not)

Personally, I'm very likely to stick with my aggregation of mutual funds. I don't know nearly enough about stocks, the businesses various companies are in, and the business models of the specific companies I could invest in.
Bingo. Good advice. If you don't know (or care to know) about investments, go passive...mutual funds, index funds, etc. It's a good strategy, and good general advice, I both do this, and suggest this for folks like us as well.

Over the long run, I'll do better than most "active investors".

I doubt it. You'll do better than the worst active investors, but on average as long as they are competent, and your money manager is competent (to say both are competent), active trading in stocks over time will give higher returns. Don't most financial calculators display higher returns when you choose the "riskier" investment strategy over the "conservative" one?

I'm not being argumentative out of any desire other than to undertand investments better, and the human factor of making them.

-Mach
 
My philosophy is, the fund managers are being paid millions of dollars a year to do what they're doing... if they aren't successful, they'll be replaced.

I wish I could be so confident that things work like that. In practice, many portfolio managers are closet indexers who, relatively speaking, will never have a really bad year. They won't do much to earn their millions of dollars a year, either. :(

Over the long run, I'll do better than most "active investors".

Passive investing in low-cost index funds is an alternative that you may wish to consider. Just a thought.
 
Likewise, if as you say passive investments always returned on average more than active trading, we'd all passively trade and it would stop working.

....

You'll do better than the worst active investors, but on average as long as they are competent, and your money manager is competent (to say both are competent), active trading in stocks over time will give higher returns. Don't most financial calculators display higher returns when you choose the "riskier" investment strategy over the "conservative" one?

I'm copping out a bit and not bothering to find the studies. But, I think a lot of people are active investors because they feel that they can do better, but many studies show that they're actually doing much worse. Too many people remember their gains and don't remember their losses. Someone that was up 100% one year and down 50% the next might not remember or realize, then, that they're stuck with the same amount at the end.

That said, I think an disciplined, focused investor can do better than the indexer and the average investor (for all intents, I think we should call average active traders "speculators" instead of "investors"). I also don't think that this flies in the face of Fama and French's efficient market theory. They acknowledge a premia for small stocks and value stocks. Of course, the full explanation, if I understand it, is because there is increased risk associated with that reward.

The best way to reduce risk in this case is through increased knowledge. Let's use an example of a micro stock versus a large stock and substitute analysts for the entire market.

A micro stock might have one part-time analyst. A large stock might have the attention of 20 analysts. We can argue that a stock price is always fairly priced based on all available knowledge and, as such, there's no incentive to try and bet against the market. However, when we look at the micro stock, it seems obvious that it would be easier for one investor to learn about the core business and capitalize on perceived strengths and trends before that knowledge is dissiminated to the broader market.

In essense, that seems to be the core of Buffet's style and one that's been preached regularily. He and Munger treat buying a stock position in a company as no different than buying the whole company... it just works out to a different percentage of ownership on the books. So, if you're always buying companies and never buying stocks, you stick with what you know and gravitate to companies that you 1) understand the best and 2) feel you can fairly price.

In a sense, as an individual investor, you might be in the best position to leverage this kind of mindset. The failing of many active mutual fund investors is that, if they do well (either through having a hot hand at the casino or true understanding), they attract money that might throw them out of their sweet spot. After all, if you're an awesome fund manager with micro cap stocks, you can only take in so much new money before you're forced out of micro cap stocks. As an individual investor, you won't face that issue for quite a long time.

all that said, I'm still happier right now with the bulk of my money in index funds and a little play money for speculation.
 
Sorry, just can't help it...

The First Million Is the Toughest

I would have given you all of my bucks
But this week the market really sucks
And the Wall Street Journal looks gloomy
But if you want, I’ll try to save again
Baby I’ll try to save again but I know

The first million is the toughest, baby I know
The first million is the toughest
‘cause when it comes to being lucky she’s cursed
When it comes to investing she’s worst
But when the market is down I’m first
That’s how I know

The first million is the toughest, baby I know
The first million is the toughest

I still want to be a millionaire
Even though it may turn into a nightmare
Cause the bull may become a bear
But if you want, I’ll try to invest again
But baby, I’ll try to invest again, but I know

The first million is the toughest, baby I know
The first million is the toughest
 
Quite impressive

These numbers are quite impressive. Am I accurate in thinking that the majority of you grew your portfolios to 1MM by being 100% in stocks during the ride?
 
These numbers are quite impressive. Am I accurate in thinking that the majority of you grew your portfolios to 1MM by being 100% in stocks during the ride?

Yes, I'm 100% in equities, not counting real estate, bonds, fixed income, savings, checking, coin & stamp collection, etc.
 
These numbers are quite impressive. Am I accurate in thinking that the majority of you grew your portfolios to 1MM by being 100% in stocks during the ride?
Yep, up until about 4-5 years ago, I was 100% in equities.
 
14 years ago I was 100% equities but every few years got more conservative until now I'm 40/50/10 (2 years away from ER and I plan to stay with this allocation through retirement).

My plan was always to RE at 55 when eligible to get a pension so as the chances of success increased I lowered the volatility of my portfolio. Just so happens I passed the $1M mark in savings 18 months ago.
 
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