YouTube cancels DISLIKE count - Arggghhhh!

[ExFlyBoy5]

Back to the topic at hand ... I still see the dislike button when I'm in YouTube, so not universally implemented. At least not yet.

They aren't doing away with the button, just the count.

Based on what we learned, we're making the dislike counts private across YouTube, but the dislike button is not going away. This change will start gradually rolling out today.

https://blog.youtube/news-and-events/update-to-youtube/

 

[ERD50]

They aren't doing away with the button, just the count.



https://blog.youtube/news-and-events/update-to-youtube/

Yes, but that's a lot like "Does a tree in a forest make a sound when it falls if there is no one to hear it"?

-ERD50

 

[dmpi]

I think it have to do with advertisers. Even the best videos get some down-votes. Getting rid of the down-vote count makes it easier to sell to advertisers.

 

[statsman]

Next up - removal of comments that in the past likely would have generated a Dislike.

 

[ERD50]

Next up - removal of comments that in the past likely would have generated a Dislike.

I just noticed - there also is no Dislike count on the comments either, only a like count.

I guess the world is all unicorns and puppies now. All negativism has been swept away. What a wonderful world! <<<< satire


Before all this, I experienced first hand what I believe to be manipulation of comments by YouTube. In another forum, I learned of a potentially interesting YouTube video, so I started watching it. It wasn't directly political, but it touched on a political issue. It was presented by someone with impressive credentials, and appeared to be well done.

It was pretty long and detailed, really took attention to follow, so I watched over a period of a few days. I noticed the "views" had climbed to over 250,000, yet, not a single comment (and comments were *not* turned off by the creator, as is sometimes done).

I watch a lot of YouTube, and it seemed really, really odd to have zero comments for that many views, especially on a controversial topic. So I posted a comment, simply to comment on the lack of comments. It shows up! Well, I still can't believe that I'm the only one, and the view count is climbing.

I go back to the forum that discussed this, and other people are also talking about the lack of comments, and a few of us say that we each posted comments, and we see them - but we aren't seeing each other's! Hmmmm.

So I sign out and/or go to a 'private' window, and (surprise!), I no longer see my own comment. Double-Hmmmm.

Could this be a glitch of some sort? Well, I've never seen this anywhere else. It was now getting a lot of attention on multiple sites. The view count is approaching one million. And at the million views point, new comments start showing up. My theory is, YouTube no longer thought they could get away with suppressing comments on that video. I think they were hoping views would slow down with no comments, but it was probably the opposite.

I know, 'never assign devious action which can be explained by stupidity' (something like that*), but this just seemed too odd and too many things added up. I do think it was manipulation by YouTube.

edit/add: The correct version, with attribution: " Hanlon's razor is an adage or rule of thumb that states "never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." "

-ERD50

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

Yes, but that's a lot like "Does a tree in a forest make a sound when it falls if there is no one to hear it"?

-ERD50

It's a little early for me, so not sure of the analogy.

Biggest issue I see with the deletion of the count is that it makes it very easy to see when a video is worthless (specifically a how-to video) in a quick manner. I would also guess that these videos weren't subject to the "dislike attacks" referenced in the YT blog post. But, we all know that all of these social media companies change, change, and change again.

I just noticed - there also is no Dislike count on the comments either, only a like count.

-ERD50

Isn't that the subject of the thread?

 

[ERD50]

Quote:
Originally Posted by ERD50 View Post
Yes, but that's a lot like "Does a tree in a forest make a sound when it falls if there is no one to hear it"?

-ERD50

It's a little early for me, so not sure of the analogy.

Does clicking 'Dislike' have an effect if it doesn't produce an action (display a count/make a sound)?

Originally Posted by ERD50 View Post
I just noticed - there also is no Dislike count on the comments either, only a like count.

Isn't that the subject of the thread?

No, I (the OP) was only referring to the dislike count for the video itself ("DISLIKE button below and to the right of the video, "). At the time, I hadn't noticed that dislike counts were also removed from the comments. Someone can like/dislike an individual comment, not just the video itself. The 'like' count shows for comments, but the 'dislike' count does not (now, it used to).

-ERD50

 

[JoeWras]

I watch a lot of YouTube, and it seemed really, really odd to have zero comments for that many views, especially on a controversial topic. So I posted a comment, simply to comment on the lack of comments. It shows up! Well, I still can't believe that I'm the only one, and the view count is climbing.

Weird. I have comments on videos with less than 1,000 views. You are right, a million and no comments is impossible.

 

[JoeWras]

From the creator's console, I can see my dislike ratio, but no longer the count. This is what my latest video looks like. And hey, it is only a few days old. I may have a hit on my hands!

 

[ERD50]

From the creator's console, I can see my dislike ratio, but no longer the count. This is what my latest video looks like. And hey, it is only a few days old. I may have a hit on my hands!

So they will make you do the math to get the dislike count!

(5 ∕ 0.83333333) − 5 ≈ 1

or more generally (Likes/ratio) - Likes = Dislikes

I guess they felt it could be too shocking to just present the Dislike count to a creator, this will save the easily offended with having to come face to face with it. There's probably a good correlation between sensitive types and weak math skills.

Even the heading isn't correct, 83.3% isn't Likes vs Dislikes, it is the % of likes vs the total. Likes vs Dislikes would be a ratio of 5:1.

What is this world coming to?

-ERD50

 

[Gumby]

I make no assumptions about whether a video is worthwhile or not based on either likes or dislikes. A lot of incredibly stupid things are wildly popular in our society generally, let alone on YouTube.

 

[JoeWras]

So they will make you do the math to get the dislike count!

(5 ∕ 0.83333333) − 5 ≈ 1

or more generally (Likes/ratio) - Likes = Dislikes

I guess they felt it could be too shocking to just present the Dislike count to a creator, this will save the easily offended with having to come face to face with it. There's probably a good correlation between sensitive types and weak math skills.

Even the heading isn't correct, 83.3% isn't Likes vs Dislikes, it is the % of likes vs the total. Likes vs Dislikes would be a ratio of 5:1.

What is this world coming to?

-ERD50

Ha ha. But we got a problem with the math challenged. I'm shocked that I only have 83.3% likes. That's bad! I also have one video with 50% likes. Noooo!!!!

Nevermind it only has 2 votes.

 

[Time2]

After the elimination of the Dislike count, I clicked on Dislike and it incremented the Like count!

 

[ERD50]

I make no assumptions about whether a video is worthwhile or not based on either likes or dislikes. A lot of incredibly stupid things are wildly popular in our society generally, let alone on YouTube.

While this is (sadly) true, when you get to the more technical type of YouTube presentations, and/or serious DIY, there tends to be much less of that kind of 'popularity contest' mentality. The kind of people who are actually going to watch a video on something like "Power Supply Knowledge - Tech Talk At The Lab! Mr Carlson's Lab" are unlikely to be the kind to stupidly click like or dislike or even come across such a video. Those serious types do it to inform others. Those serious videos have a much higher signal-to-noise ratio among the viewers and commenters. At least IME.

In a similar vein, I follow and occasional post to a very technical forum. This forum has a like/thanks button for each post, and it shows the poster who 'liked' it. Because of the nature of the forum, it isn't used as a popularity thing, it is meant for, and used to indicate you appreciated the insight, and/or the above average work that went into the post.

It works well there, and while this is a pretty well behaved crowd here, I don;t think it would work so well, it would tend to be a pile on "I agree!", and it would just be a battle of 'agree' with something like pay-off vs don't pay-off the mortgage.

-ERD50

 

[JohnRM]

Youtube is what it is.

I pay $10 a month for an ad-free youtube. So much entertaining content, I would just eliminate cable if it was up to me, very little worth watching on TV.

Personally I can't even recall a time when I down voted a youtube video, if I don't like it I click elsewhere, and they are pretty good now at presenting what I like somehow. Lots of thumbs up from me.

What I would like to see is an easy way to keep track of all my subcriptions.

Perhaps if they eliminated all the thumbs scores and gave the video a numeric score that added all the thumbs-up and then subtracted all the negs. Then if it got into negative territory, limit the views, or let viewers have a setting where they only see videos with a score over a certain number.

Then only allow people a certain ratio of ups and downs to eliminate harassment there?

 

[ERD50]

... Perhaps if they eliminated all the thumbs scores and gave the video a numeric score that added all the thumbs-up and then subtracted all the negs. Then if it got into negative territory, limit the views, or let viewers have a setting where they only see videos with a score over a certain number. ...

I've seen that elsewhere, I don't like it.

If you see a +1, you have no idea if that is a sole voter (so it has no statistical relevance), or if it is 1,001 likes and 1,000 dislikes.

It's like the 4.8 star Amazon reviews. If it is only 5 reviewers, I ignore it. If it is hundreds of reviews, it has more meaning.

... Personally I can't even recall a time when I down voted a youtube video, if I don't like it I click elsewhere, and they are pretty good now at presenting what I like somehow. Lots of thumbs up from me.
...
Then only allow people a certain ratio of ups and downs to eliminate harassment there?

Like I said, this is more relevant to technical or DIY videos. I appreciate someone down-voting for bad/dangerous content. And I do it as a 'public service' for others.

I don't consider a down vote 'harassment'. Other than some sort of 'bot' detector that's just auto-robot down-voting, how do you tell? I think YouTube management thinks they are the arbitrator of what is harassment', but I don't want them judging that for me. Find the bots and fake accounts, put up more stringent requirements to avoid fraud, but don't judge for me.

...

What I would like to see is an easy way to keep track of all my subscriptions.

Don't you see them on the left side bar? You may have to refresh the page if it's been open a while, they seem to disconnect or something after a while.

-ERD50

 

[JohnRM]

Lots of subs

What I would like to see is an easy way to keep track of all my subscriptions.
---End Quote---
Don't you see them on the left side bar? You may have to refresh the page if it's been open a while, they seem to disconnect or something after a while.

-ERD50
***************
I see the list of channels I subscribe to there, but it's just a jumble. I think I'll use a start.me page to sort them, Music videos, travel, pickers, Will it start, etc. These are just categories off the top of my head.

Lately I have been watching this dude that gets old cars from the 60's and 70's that have been sitting in a field for decades, and get them running, at least well enough to drive it home. It is always satisfying to hear them start up. It's kind of worrisome when he drives them 600 miles home though.

 

[Graybeard]

@johnrm see the 3 horizontal lines in the upper left corner? Click on that. There is a link to Home, Explore, Subscriptions. Clicking on Subscriptions it'll show the videos for those channels' subscriptions. Below the next few links it shows each of my subscriptions by the name of the channel.

 

[ERD50]

After the elimination of the Dislike count, I clicked on Dislike and it incremented the Like count!

I just tried that on a live video that only had 38 likes, so was easy to see the change. My dislike did *not* increment the Like count. Then I did hit Like, and it did increment the Like count.

I'm gong to guess that someone else hit Like the same time you hit Dislike, and you saw their click cause the increment?

-ERD50

 

[Time2]

I just tried that on a live video that only had 38 likes, so was easy to see the change. My dislike did *not* increment the Like count. Then I did hit Like, and it did increment the Like count.

I'm gong to guess that someone else hit Like the same time you hit Dislike, and you saw their click cause the increment?

-ERD50

Yes, when I tried to show my son, a dislike click did not increment the like.
Just a fluke that one time.

 

[gamboolman]

As many others have said, I wish there was a viable alternative to Youtube. But there's just not - at least best I can tell.

I don't like them taking away the Dislikes Count either.

 

[Davidhelp]

You can use this Add-on to get back the dislikes setting. I use Firefox.

Return YouTube Dislike
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/fi...&utm_content=addons-manager-user-profile-link


Chrome users:
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/return-youtube-dislike/gebbhagfogifgggkldgodflihgfeippi


It also works for Vivaldi web browser which uses chrome extensions.

 

[ERD50]

You can use this Add-on to get back the dislikes setting. I use Firefox.

Return YouTube Dislike
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/fi...&utm_content=addons-manager-user-profile-link


Chrome users:
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/return-youtube-dislike/gebbhagfogifgggkldgodflihgfeippi


It also works for Vivaldi web browser which uses chrome extensions.

As I mentioned in my OP, that extension won't work for long:

.... There is a temporary work-around extension, but it won't work for long. In a few weeks YouTube is cancelling the API that returns that value. ...

-ERD50

https://support.google.com/youtube/thread/134791097/update-to-youtube-dislike-counts?hl=en

Developers: If you’re using the YouTube API for dislikes, you will no longer have access to public dislike data beginning on December 13th.

I think I read that some of the developers for those extensions were trying to make estimates based on past patterns, but that sounds bogus to me.

edit/add: From one of those links, FAQ - What happens after YouTube discontinues API support?

The backend will switch to using a combination of archived dislike stats, estimates extrapolated from extension user data, and estimates based on view/like ratios for videos whose dislikes weren't archived as well as outdated dislike count archives.

IMO, better to have no data than that sort of 'pretend' data.

-ERD50