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Old 11-29-2010, 05:41 PM   #21
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Seems like a noble goal, but is it worth the costs?
Noble? Sorry, but it just seems naive and stupid to this reader. I think it's time we give Mr Assange a full taste of the complete transparency he says he wants. For the rest of his natural life.
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:45 PM   #22
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I think it's time we give Mr Assange a full taste of the complete transparency he says he wants. For the rest of his natural life.
Or his 15 minutes of fame, whichever comes first...
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:53 PM   #23
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As I understand it, the intellligence services of many countries record and archive nearly everyone's secure communication. Once you have clear text copies of documents that were previously encoded then you have what you need to break the code.
The coding algorithms used to encode and decode documents are not some simple cipher that allows you to "break the code" be accessing a clear text copy alongside an encrypted copy.
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Old 11-29-2010, 06:02 PM   #24
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Agreed, not a simple cipher, but having tens of thousands clear text documents to compare with encoded text and some real powerful computers, has to make it easier, to determine the complex formulas and computer code used to encode the documents.

I'm not a cryptologist but I watched one on TV.
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Old 11-29-2010, 06:15 PM   #25
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I saw the word noble used. I would imagine that this guy might be nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize.

As for disdain of foreign leaders, I'm sure their cables are full of good stuff on our leaders and one in particular.

So far, with the head start by those major newspapers who presumably tried to find the most damning or juiciest quotes and report them soonest, I haven't seen anything that causes me to think, "Wow, that should not have been published."
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Old 11-29-2010, 06:37 PM   #26
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Here's an interesting background article on where the cables came from:
BBC News - Siprnet: Where the leaked cables came from
Apparently, none of the e-mails had a "top secret" designation.
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:40 PM   #27
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Assange is a twisted little freak who was irrevocably warped by a bizarre upbringing (35 different schools attended as a kid would twist anyone).

I watched the helicopter video and kept waiting for the provocative part that was supposed to shock me. Seeing people get killed is a shocking experience, but people being killed in a combat zone is not unusual or criminal. And journalists who willingly attach themselves to combatant groups who are engaged in hostile activities in a combat zone risk getting killed just like a combatant.*

This latest wikileaks leaking seemed to be more of the same, except even more boring, until I started reading some of what has been released.

There were at least two instances in which anybody in the subject nation would have been able to name the source of extremely embarrassing information about the country's leaders. And these in countries where such things get one disappeared. Just imagine some poor schmuck, who gave information to us with the promise that his identity and information would remain a secret, is at this very moment learning that there really are experiences worse than death.

Just for that, I would stand in the firing squad for PFC Manning's well-deserved execution.

My memories are dim now, but I recall that while some of the standards on what was classified and what wasn't did not deal solely with national security, but also with the potential for national embarrassment. And that is what a lot of this current leak is all about - it reveals what people say about other people when they think their words will be held in confidence. It involves candid assessments of the character, behavior and motivation of foreign leaders in areas of mutual (or competing) concern.

Neither PFC Manning nor Mr. Assange have done anything wonderful or brave. They're just two warped idiots who need to meet their maker sooner rather than later.

I will admit to snickering a bit when I read that Ahmadinejad got the piss slapped out of him by the top general of the Revolutionary Guards.

*I know two children were seriously injured, if not killed, in that incident. There has never been any explanation given for why those children were there, but they, like the journalists killed, were in a group of armed combatants in a battle. Some adult obviously recklessly endangered them by placing them in that situation.
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:43 PM   #28
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Assange is a twisted little freak who was irrevocably warped by a bizarre upbringing (35 different schools attended as a kid would twist anyone).

I watched the helicopter video and kept waiting for the provocative part that was supposed to shock me. Seeing people get killed is a shocking experience, but people being killed in a combat zone is not unusual or criminal. And journalists who willingly attach themselves to combatant groups who are engaged in hostile activities in a combat zone risk getting killed just like a combatant.

This latest wikileaks leaking seemed to be more of the same, except even more boring, until I started reading some of what has been released.

There were at least two instances in which anybody in the subject nation would have been able to name the source of extremely embarrassing information about the country's leaders. And these in countries where such things get one disappeared. Just imagine some poor schmuck, who gave information to us with the promise that his identity and information would remain a secret, is at this very moment learning that there really are experiences worse than death.

Just for that, I would stand in the firing squad for PFC Manning's well-deserved execution.

My memories are dim now, but I recall that while some of the standards on what was classified and what wasn't did not deal solely with national security, but also with the potential for national embarrassment. And that is what a lot of this current leak is all about - it reveals what people say about other people when they think their words will be held in confidence. It involves candid assessments of the character, behavior and motivation of foreign leaders in areas of mutual (or competing) concern.

Neither PFC Manning nor Mr. Assange have done anything wonderful or brave. They're just two warped idiots who need to meet their maker sooner rather than later.
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Old 11-29-2010, 08:18 PM   #29
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The story is on all newssites. Some of the more interesting links:

An Interview With WikiLeaks’ Julian Assange - Andy Greenberg - Forbes

WikiLeaks US embassy cables: Live updates on how the world reacts - The Guardian
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Old 11-30-2010, 01:12 AM   #30
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Assange is a twisted little freak
I haven't had time to research Assange, but I did look at a picture of him in Forbes. Sheesh...... What a twisted little freak!
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Old 11-30-2010, 05:14 PM   #31
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One thing I find curious about Wikileaks is it claims to have a global focus but seems pretty focused on the US. I would imagine there is some pretty interesting stuff to tell about Russia, China, Venezuela, just to name a few.

I think public scrutiny is useful, but I'm not sure that this qualifies as scrutiny.
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Old 11-30-2010, 05:44 PM   #32
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One thing I find curious about Wikileaks is it claims to have a global focus but seems pretty focused on the US. I would imagine there is some pretty interesting stuff to tell about Russia, China, Venezuela, just to name a few.

I think public scrutiny is useful, but I'm not sure that this qualifies as scrutiny.
Boingboing announces that more international stuff (Russia, etc.) is coming too:
Guardian editor on Wikileaks/Cablegate: "Terrible" disclosures coming - Boing Boing

They also link to an article that is supposed to clarify their motivations:
Julian Assange and the Computer Conspiracy; "To destroy this invisible government" - Boing Boing

These sure are strange days.
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Old 11-30-2010, 07:09 PM   #33
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One thing I find curious about Wikileaks is it claims to have a global focus but seems pretty focused on the US. I would imagine there is some pretty interesting stuff to tell about Russia, China, Venezuela, just to name a few.

I think public scrutiny is useful, but I'm not sure that this qualifies as scrutiny.
Other countries may have better security measures to protect their info. In addition, they would not be lenient to perpetrators.
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Old 11-30-2010, 08:02 PM   #34
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One thing I find curious about Wikileaks is it claims to have a global focus but seems pretty focused on the US. I would imagine there is some pretty interesting stuff to tell about Russia, China, Venezuela, just to name a few.

I think public scrutiny is useful, but I'm not sure that this qualifies as scrutiny.
I really, really, hope he posts something that seriously upsets the Chinese... or the Russians... or some other regime without our Constitution or a sense of humor..
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Old 11-30-2010, 09:36 PM   #35
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UPDATE:

Looks like life just got a little more difficult for this twisted little freak...
Interpol puts Assange on most-wanted list - CNN.com
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Old 12-01-2010, 02:35 AM   #36
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I haven't had time to research Assange, but I did look at a picture of him in Forbes. Sheesh...... What a twisted little freak!
I haven't done any research yet either so i'm reserving judgement.
The way he looks doesn't merit a 'twisted little freak' assessment in my book.

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Old 12-01-2010, 06:18 AM   #37
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Just for that, I would stand in the firing squad for PFC Manning's well-deserved execution.
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Old 12-01-2010, 07:36 AM   #38
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I'm less concerned with Assange and more concerned with the person or persons feeding him classified or semi-classified information. Assange is just a devilish reporter. The real fiends are those who provided him with this information.

I say we give Assange immunity if he divulges all of his sources. Then we give those sources life in prison or the death penalty. Then let's see who else would be so willing to give up secret information to Assange or others like him.

Immunity would only purge him of this sin. After this matter is settled, Assange can be dealt with separately on his other sins, such as his alleged rape case and who knows what other points. People like this have all kinds of skeletons in their closets. Perhaps tax evasion, illegal drugs, etc.
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Old 12-01-2010, 08:16 AM   #39
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Oh please. Death penalty for the sources? For what crime, exactly? My guess is you'd have a hard time even firing many of them.

This is the electronic age. We already have very senior people spouting their mouths off on Twitter, and getting caught out. If you don't want it on the Internet, don't type it into a computer, other than (maybe) something with the highest security classification. The sooner the diplomats learn that, the better. You can't keep something secret when it's being legitimately read by more than 4 or 5 people; when several thousand are authorised to see it, it's going to leak, because there will always be disgruntled staff and there will always be troublemakers to repost it.
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Old 12-01-2010, 08:33 AM   #40
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Oh please. Death penalty for the sources? For what crime, exactly? My guess is you'd have a hard time even firing many of them.
Manning is facing 52 years on the current charges. He is no Daniel Ellsberg, and with the possible exception of the helicopter video released earlier, this material is no Pentagon Papers. Remember that Ellsberg and his co-defendant were prosecuted under the Espionage Act which does carry the death penalty in its range of punishment. And they were never exonerated, the judge declared a mistrial because of the numerous bad acts of the government in the prosecution.

Where I think Manning put his life at risk was instances like this:
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This is not to deny that WikiLeaks has done enormous harm. The leakers or hackers or whoever it was who obtained and published this information have put individual lives at risk. Toby Harnden of the Telegraph notes that one of the released documents names a U.S. informant in the region. The document identifies him as a U.K.-educated engineer from a prominent pre-revolution Isfahan family who once owned a large factory in Iran and is a former national fencing champion of Iran, a former president of the Iran Fencing Association and a former vice president of an Azerbaijan sports association. Harnden aptly asks: How many such persons do you think are out there?
Other than that, this material is interesting gossip. What did we learn as a people that we didn't already know? Karzai is a nutjob and his government is corrupt? The Iranian government is full of religious fanatics who may kick off a religious war? Where is the equivalent of LBJ lying his ass off to the American people about"... a subject of transcendent national interest and significance"?

Manning exposed informants living in totalitarian regimes because he was pissed at the Army.
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