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Old 03-15-2007, 12:35 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Retire Soon
I maintain that Iraq is the worst mistake the U.S. has ever made, militarily. We attacked a country with absolutely no provocation. This is not what the U.S. is about. We have higher ideals and are simply better than that. We received unprecedented sympathy internationally after 911 and than squandered all of it by attacking a country without cause or justification. We already had our hands tied with the Taliban in Afghanistan, and had absolutely no business starting a war with a country we incorrectly perceived as belonging to "The Axis of Evil." Where are all of these "weapons of mass destruction?" Our resources should have been directed at fighing terrorism and not placing ourselves in the middle of a religious civil war. The only thing we've gotten out of the Iraq war is lower worldwide prestige. Our homeland is substantially less safe and secure because of this ineptitude.
Never mind the fact that Saddam never lived up to promises he made when he came begging the coalition to stop beating up on him. His SAM sites were constantly being bombed and destroyed by British and American fighters during the so called peace time. They were being blown up only because they were locking onto the aircraft, not because they were there. I personally observed planes go out fully loaded and return empty. These missions were not covered on the news because they happened so often and our pilots were not injured. But remember Saddam was a peace loving dictator who's only fault was he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. I mean he didn't tell his SAM sites to lock onto the fighters they just did it because they could. :

For much as a mess Iraq currently is, it gives the terrorists a place to kill outside our nation. Oh yeah, I read an article the other day that said Baghdad is relatively quite now, due to the surge and all of our troops are not in country yet. The democrats were correct again (NOT) the surge won't accomplish anything except get more American's killed. Granted it is still early, but it does look promising.
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Old 03-15-2007, 12:45 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by tryan
Retire Soon,

We can agree to disagree. But we went into Iraq with 22 other nations. Hardly a solo effort.
Oh my goodness - that is funny - was that off the Whitehouse press release?

the coalition of the "willing" check this out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multina..._force_in_Iraq
Only a handful of these countries sent more than one thousand, the rest from the 20's on up! come on... :

Even Moldova has shrunk their forces from 24 at the time of the invasion to the 11 they have there now! :
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Old 03-15-2007, 01:05 PM   #23
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Yup, 14 nations with more than 100 troops.
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Old 03-15-2007, 01:23 PM   #24
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... I am hijacking this thread ... ummmm, anybody got matches?!?
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Old 03-15-2007, 01:25 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by newguy888


Sam

It was not the Iraqis who blew up the embassies. 9/11 Uh Saudis and Sheik muhammed? Uh FIND Bin Laden and Al zwahiri. They were the brains of 9/11 Not Muhammed. But the Bush guys will now trot out this story line that he spilled his guts about 9/11.

Yea right , After the pentagon cheif talks about gays and the Attorny General is in up to his eyes in sewer water.
I did not say it was the Iraqis that blew up the embassies. I said the capture of Khalid Sheik Mohammed was a victory for us in the fight against Islamic extremism. You have continually sung the "we should be killing/capturing these animals" song, Khalid Sheifk Mohammed is definitely one of the worst. Do you think Usama and Zawahiri flew those planes into the towers? No, they had lots of underlings, planners, logistics guys. We're killing or capturing many of them, both in Iraq and elsewhere. You should appreciate that and maybe concede that progress is being made-or is it simply about these two guys? (BTW, look back at earlier press accounts and you'll see that the "top three" were frequently mentioned: Khalid Sheik Mohammed was #3).

The military/law enforcement aspect is just one tool in this fight. The bigger problem--defeating the extremist ideology that rejects pluralism, individual rights, and rationalism in favor of a medieval Koranic theocracy--will take many years and will involve broader tools of engagement.
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Old 03-15-2007, 01:29 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by lets-retire
For much as a mess Iraq currently is, it gives the terrorists a place to kill outside our nation.
And to be killed. The sump from which we can elimiante the sewage.
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Old 03-15-2007, 01:36 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Reid
... I am hijacking this thread ... ummmm, anybody got matches?!?
Unfortunately no. How about some dynamite?
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Old 03-15-2007, 01:41 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by brewer12345
Unfortunately no. How about some dynamite?
Umm, you might want to check out his shoes.
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Old 03-15-2007, 01:42 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by wab
Umm, you might want to check out his shoes.
So long as we shake off our 2005 Republican talking points troll for a while.
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Old 03-15-2007, 02:58 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tryan
Yup, 14 nations with more than 100 troops.
: : :
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Old 03-15-2007, 03:46 PM   #31
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Come'on Wab gimme a match ... brewer's got the dynamite - mine is soaked in sweat.
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Old 03-15-2007, 03:52 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by Richard Reid
Come'on Wab gimme a match ... brewer's got the dynamite - mine is soaked in sweat.
Here you go...

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Old 03-15-2007, 03:56 PM   #33
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Wab, Wab, I told you not to reveal that video to the infidels.

No virgins waiting for YOU!
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Old 03-15-2007, 05:45 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Retire Soon
I maintain that Iraq is the worst mistake the U.S. has ever made, militarily. We attacked a country with absolutely no provocation. This is not what the U.S. is about.
I still say the invasion of Canada in 1812 was dumber. I cannot say that that was not what the US was about, because expansionism was exactly what the US was all about back then.
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Old 03-15-2007, 06:12 PM   #35
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I thought I started this thread but, I don't recognize it any more.
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Old 03-15-2007, 06:21 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by dex
I thought I started this thread but, I don't recognize it any more.
Hey, it stayed on track for over one full page.
The trolls are the problem. A troll is, apparently by one poster's definition, somebody he doesn't agree with. Get the pitchforks and torches!
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Old 03-15-2007, 10:39 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by tryan
Anybody who thinks these animals will be pacified if we leave Iraq needs to read the attached.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17617986/
I'm not sure why you quoted my post in your reply; I wasn't advocating pulling out of Iraq in order to pacify anymore. In fact, I wasn't even advocating pulling out. I'm saying that I think Americans do have the will to fight a long war if they thought the war was worth fighting, but in the case of Iraq, a lot of people don't think we should be fighting that war. The motives were questionable from the beginning.
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Old 03-16-2007, 07:33 AM   #38
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Hey, it stayed on track for over one full page.
The trolls are the problem. A troll is, apparently by one poster's definition, somebody he doesn't agree with. Get the pitchforks and torches!
Hey, asshole, you are the one trashing threads with the same BS over and over and over... Take it elsewhere if you want to spew that crap.
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Old 03-16-2007, 08:06 AM   #39
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I'm saying that I think Americans do have the will to fight a long war if they thought the war was worth fighting, but in the case of Iraq, a lot of people don't think we should be fighting that war.
... just trying help build the will.

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Old 03-16-2007, 08:53 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by brewer12345
Hey, asshole, you are the one trashing threads with the same BS over and over and over... Take it elsewhere if you want to spew that crap.
Oh, you were talking about ME! Who would have guessed? Look back--I eneterd the fray at least 10 posts after this thread jumped the track. Nobody who goes off track and is in yor politcal camp is "spewing crap." but those who you disagree with are "trolls" and "assholes." If you can't/won't engage in reasoned argument, then you'd help the cause by just skipping the ad hominem attacks and staying silent.
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