Feelings of failure upon approaching semi-retirement

[Meadbh]

I consider my ability to quit work at an early age one of my greatest accomplishments! I don't get nearly as much satisfaction out of the fact that I earned a PhD in chemistry and was published in major peer-reviewed journals.

I used to be a researcher, and was surrounded by hardcore academics who lived for their next grant, paper, presentation or citation. As a physician, research was an interesting component of my work but it was never a major driver for me.

 

[David1961]

I consider my ability to quit work at an early age one of my greatest accomplishments!

+1

 

[scrabbler1]

I consider my ability to quit work at an early age one of my greatest accomplishments!

Definitely!

 

[DatumPoint5]

Per the OP's original comments
"I've done all I'm ever going to do, it's all downhill from here, that's all you'll achieve."
I would suggest reading the adult section of Wkipedia's Late Bloomer post.
Late bloomer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"A late blooming adult is a person who does not discover their talents and abilities until later than normally expected. In certain cases retirement may lead to this discovery."

Also, just two of many links on Google from a search with the phrase "people who found success later in life"....

10 People Who Found Their Calling Later in Life | Listosaur | Hungry for Knowledge
5 Famous People Who Succeeded Long After They Should've Quit | Cracked.com

etc, etc.....

None of us know what we may "stumble into" as life progresses. We accomplished what we could accomplish with whatever job/career/time/resources we had. Now, we move forward in life, carefully, thoughtfully planning and plotting our next moves. Who knows, you or any one of us can end up becoming the next Harland Sanders, who, at 65, struggling to make ends meet, developed what came to be known as the Kentucky Fried Chicken empire?!?!?

As Yogi Berra once said "It ain't over, till it's over"...........

 

[clifp]

A good discussion, interesting that even among us early retirees there is so much ambivalence. I suspect among the many who achieve FI but don't elect to retire the feeling is even stronger.

In my case, I was quite satisfied with my modest role in helping an important company, bring computing to the masses. It has been depressing at times realizing that was almost certainly my peak professional accomplishment and I continue to be disappointed not finding. a second act..

ER Eddie, I got a lot of positive feedback from this post last year. The key point was this.
Your best months or maybe years working will probably be better working than retirement.
On the other hand, your worse month or year being retired is absolutely going to be much better than your worse month or year working.

Once you come to terms with this it will be easier.

 

[Shawn]

I've been in One More Year (OMY) syndrome for the last 4-5 years. I gave up a "perfect" opportunity to retire last year when my employer offered a buyout package to all employees. I declined, but why? The prospect of early retirement has been my focus for the last 10-15 years. My financial assets are ~300 times my annual expenses. I hate my job. So it's both surprising and puzzling that I have not been able to retire.

With me, I do not believe it is shame or esteem, although I definitely understand these feelings. And isn't it interesting how these feelings seem to show up out of nowhere. They may not be logical, but they're still difficult to address.

My own reluctance to retire seems to come from inevitable feelings of loss. And this has little to do with lost identity. I do not identify with my job. Rather, there are feelings of lost financial opportunity. No more paycheck and pension growth (combined equaling about $400K/yr). It doesn't matter that I already have more than enough. This is still a lot to give up. Mostly, though, there are feelings of a lost career. Where I am today in my career is the cumulation of decades of work. Since high school, every gain has built upon another. When I retire, there is no turning back. I'll lose this pile of "career accomplishment" built up over the last 35-40 years. Yes, there are the financial rewards from this effort but it is still difficult to turn my back and walk away. It is as if the decades of work will have been for naught.

 

[Meadbh]

I've been in One More Year (OMY) syndrome for the last 4-5 years. I gave up a "perfect" opportunity to retire last year when my employer offered a buyout package to all employees. I declined, but why? The prospect of early retirement has been my focus for the last 10-15 years. My financial assets are ~300 times my annual expenses. I hate my job. So it's both surprising and puzzling why I have not been able to retire.

With me, I do not believe it is shame or esteem, although I definitely can understand these feelings. And isn't it strange how these feelings seem to show up out of nowhere. They may not be logical, but they're still difficult to address.

My own reluctance to retire seems to come from inevitable feelings of loss. And this has little to do with lost identity. I do not identify with my job. Rather, there will be feelings of lost financial opportunity. No more paycheck and pension growth (combined equaling about $400K/yr). It doesn't matter that I already have more than enough. This is still a lot to give up. Mostly, though, there will be feelings of a lost career. Where I am today in my career is the cumulation of decades of work. Since high school, every gain has built upon another. When I retire, there will be no turning back. I'll be losing this pile of "career accomplishment" built up over the last 35-40 years. Yes, there are the financial rewards from this effort but it is still difficult to turn my back and walk away. It will be as if the decades of work have been for naught.

By any objective measure, this looks like a resoundingly successful career. Hardly "for naught". I think your anxiety about future "lost" opportunities says more about your psychology than it does about rationality. Your achievements at work are still worthwhile achievements even after you retire or die. If a net worth of 300 times expenses does not make you feel financially secure, I don't think a net worth of 400 times expenses will either. Your pursuit of financial nirvana has a huge opportunity cost in time. Perhaps your real fear is how to use that time in a fulfilling way. Some people need professional help making that adjustment.

 

[Gumby]

To appropriate a famous phrase from Martin Luther, but put it to slightly different use -- "Here I stand. I can do no other."

Here I stand. I am the sum total of my words and my deeds, all the good and all the bad. I am all the accomplishments and the failures, the relationships forged and those lost, the things I have done and said and those things I have not. I simply cannot change the half century that has gone into creating my present life. What I can do is accept it, learn from it, lift my chin up and move forward into the future. I can do no other.

 

[Islandtraveler]

For me, I just never made a lot of money, $20K-$25K max/year. Most years less than that. So put a big capital L on my forehead.

I did end up having a NW over $1M. Got lucky with investments, necessity being its mother.

 

[Letj]

To appropriate a famous phrase from Martin Luther, but put it to slightly different use -- "Here I stand. I can do no other."

Here I stand. I am the sum total of my words and my deeds, all the good and all the bad. I am all the accomplishments and the failures, the relationships forged and those lost, the things I have done and said and those things I have not. I simply cannot change the half century that has gone into creating my present life. What I can do is accept it, learn from it, lift my chin up and move forward into the future. I can do no other.

That is so beautifully said Gumby. It's how we should all think about the one life we have to live.

 

[Islandtraveler]

Hey, I know quite a few people that have incomes 10x yours. They cannot retire. Who is the loser? You won dude!! congrats.

 

[Islandtraveler]

That post was suppose to accompany the quote from mikefixac. Maybe when I ER I will figure this thing out!

 

[imoldernu]

Written before the position was eliminated...

Charley, a new retiree-greeter at Wal-Mart, just couldn't seem to get to work on time. Everyday he was 5, 10, 15 minutes late.

But he was a good worker, really tidy, clean-shaven, sharp-minded and a real credit to the company and obviously demonstrating their "Older Person Friendly" policies.

One day the boss called him into the office for a talk.

"Charley, I have to tell you, I like your work ethic, you do a bang-up job when you finally get here; but your being late so often is quite bothersome."

"Yes, I know boss, and I am working on it."

"Well good, you are a team player. That's what I like to hear."

"Yes sir, I understand your concern and I will try harder."

"Seemingly puzzled, the manager went on to comment, I know you're retired from the Armed Forces. What did they say to you there if you showed up in the morning late so often?"

The old man looked down at the floor, then smiled. He chuckled quietly, then said with a grin, "They usually saluted and said 'Good morning, Admiral, can I get your coffee, sir?'"

 

[Shawn]

On any objective measure, this looks like a resoundingly successful career. Hardly "for naught". I think your anxiety about future "lost" opportunities says more about your psychology than it does about rationality. Your achievements at work are still worthwhile achievements even after you retire or die. If a net worth of 300 times expenses does not make you feel financially secure, I don't think a net worth of 400 times expenses will either. Your pursuit of financial nirvana has a huge opportunity cost in time. Perhaps your real fear is how to use that time in a fulfilling way. Some people need professional help making that adjustment.

I accept that the feelings are not rational - or better said, that they are not logical. Emotions tend to be rational even when they are not logical. But the feelings are quite common. Many people are hesitant to give up something built with a lifetime of effort (i.e., a career).

Spending fulfilling time in retirement is not even a minor concern. For me, much of the time will be spent doing more of what I already do ... athletic and outdoor activities (and preparing for such activities). It takes 5-6 months to hike the Pacific Crest Trail from Mexico to Canada, for example.

You are correct. Having 400 times expenses is not going to make one feel more financially secure than having 300 times expenses. But that is not the issue. I already feel financially secure. The issue is lost financial opportunity.

Would a typical early retiree go back to work for 1 day if their former boss offered them 1 million dollars? Of course they would. Almost anyone would. Even people with more than enough would not give up an opportunity to make that much money for only one day of time. Otherwise, they would regret the decision for the rest of their lives. While the example is absurd - it's never going to happen - the point is that even people with enough money do not hesitate to make more when the terms are right. Perhaps people shouldn't do this. But they do.

The difficulty is knowing when the terms are right. If I retire today at age 54 with a decent probability of living another ~40 years, my DB pension will provide me with about $85K/yr (COLA'ed). It goes up by over $1K/yr for every additional month of work. So if I work another 3 months - not that much time - I'll receive an additional $4K/yr for the rest of my life. If I work another 5 years - a sizable but not absurd amount of time - my lifetime COLA'ed pension will be about $170K/yr.

These differences are not trivial. The financial opportunity is huge. It's not easy to give up. It does not matter that the money is not needed. And I can give the money to others and feel good it. Yes, something may happen to my health and I may want those extra 3 months or 5 years back. But it's not a simple decision. It comes with both logic and emotions.

 

[Meadbh]

Would a typical early retiree go back to work for 1 day if their former boss offered them 1 million dollars? Of course they would.

That is a highly unlikely situation.

These differences are not trivial. The financial opportunity is huge. It's not easy to give up. It does not matter that the money is not needed. And I can give the money to others and feel good it. Yes, something may happen to my health and I may want those extra 3 months or 5 years back. But it's not a simple decision. It comes with both logic and emotions.

I agree that the financial differences are not trivial. At some point, which you clearly have not reached, the incremental benefits of continuing to work will reach a break even point with the drudgery of work. The alternative is that you will die, become disabled, or be asked to leave. So while you say you hate your job, you do not hate it sufficiently to overcome your love of the money it earns you (aka greed). Therefore you should continue to work and reevaluate the situation on a regular basis.

 

[chris66]

ER Eddie, I got a lot of positive feedback from this post last year. The key point was this.
Your best months or maybe years working will probably be better working than retirement.
On the other hand, your worse month or year being retired is absolutely going to be much better than your worse month or year working.

Once you come to terms with this it will be easier.

The linked post was very insightful. Thanks.

 

[brewer12345]

But still, it is hard realizing as you have said, whatever I have achieved in my working life, is all I will ever achieve.

I have struggled with this, very much so. I also find that it is bound up with a better appreciation of my own mortality than I have ever had. I always knew that everyone only gets so much time, but stepping away from the career really underlined it. I turned 40 the same year I stepped out of the cube, so that is likely a confounding issue.

 

[FIREd]

Retirement certainly does not have to put an end to personal achievements. Since I left the workforce, I've learned new skills, pushed myself physically, developed artistic talents, etc... Plenty of achievements to be proud of. If the idea of continued personal growth beyond retirement is inconceivable, then perhaps one should not retire.

 

[Redbugdave]

I have gone through it, too. And have come to terms with it. I think a lot of it has to do with the way we are programmed. All the energy it took to land that final job, (schooling, contacts, etc), then you get a good job, and work your tail off trying to do good. And over the years, you work your way up the food chain. Then once you are at the top of your game, you step off the edge and you're done. It's all over. And it's really not about the money. My shepherd has a strong drive to chase things, (most dogs do). It's like that dog will not ever chase a ball again. Even though that's what he has been trained to do all his life.

It really has to do with coming to terms with your true inner values. Some of them have changed. You become more self realized that there's a whole nother world out there.

For me personally...my regret was not following what I was really good at...instead taking another career that to me was stable and predictable...but mediocre in my eyes. It was a good job...but not necessarily for me.

Have any of you felt that you were put on this earth to do something special with your skills and life, or contribute something really good to the world, but got side tracked along the way? That's the way I have felt all these years. I am now working on fixing that and getting on that road I should have been on decades ago. Retirement has now allowed me to focus on my core values without having to have the need for money cloud the way. I feel like I have now been given a second chance in my life...and this time, I'm not going to screw it up. It's about personal achievement.

I know this is getting side tracked...but as a good parent you need to communicate to your kids how important it is to be in the field, (or job), where they are happiest and not something that's just secure.

 

[travelover]

........ My shepherd has a strong drive to chase things, (most dogs do). It's like that dog will not ever chase a ball again. Even though that's what he has been trained to do all his life. .........

I took a lesson from my greyhound. Her kind was bred for over a thousand years to chase and she trained hard to run the race. Now we are both retired and happy to take a nap as we feel like it.

 

[David1961]

The difficulty is knowing when the terms are right. .

+1. When your BS bucket is full, you will know it. I agree with Meadbh that you should continue working and periodically reevaluate your situation.

 

[MRG]

Absolutely I can relate. My case was different, but the feeling 100% right on. In my case there was a SR. management change 5 years prior. Not being all that great at jr. high school politics, I found myself on the wrong side of a battle I didn't know was occuring.
Not technically a demotion, but I went from a technical leader to a much lesser position. I was ashamed, I'd done all that was asked and more. A new bunch of leadership took over, bright - eyed, condemning all that had been done prior.
I was close to FI, built my plans to RE. Took a few years to gain the confidence, that I could RE. Finally after discussing it with close friends, family, and one last meeting with Fidelity, I gave myself permission to let go. I'm so glad I did, my wife's health has improved. I'm able to work on mine.

I still have lunch with some w*ork friends. Occasionally I see some of the new leadership.
They ask how I'm doing. I just smile say great. They look older, tired. The once shiny eyes, bleary from the last 80 hour week. I haven't figured out what my passion is yet, but I will.

BTW - The Megacorp I worked for is never going to change humanity, end wars or injustice, feed the hungry, cure the sick........

Best wishes,
MRG

 

[TimSF]

Interesting topic. To my way of thinking, eventually we all will leave our careers, glorious or not, and be quickly forgotten. It is simply a question of how and when. I wanted to choose the how and the when.
The poet Thomas Gray put a decidedly morbid note on it: "The boast of heraldry, the pomp of power, and all that beauty all that wealth 'ere gave, await alike the inevitable hour-- The paths of glory lead but to the grave."

 

[travelover]

Interesting topic. To my way of thinking, eventually we all will leave our careers, glorious or not, and be quickly forgotten...........

This was really brought home to me when I cleaned out a cubical of a fellow engineer that had left the company. All those meticulously indexed notebooks, stacks of CDs with data, photographs, reports and graphs - into the dumpster. During the several years afterward I never had a soul ask about any of it. I did my own dumpster purge before I left to save anyone else the trouble.

 

[calmloki]

As a mechanical engineer, my standard answer was always to tell people that I was a mechanic. It was fun to see them stammer, then condescend to me.

One evening some years ago I was in a hot spring at Two Bunch Palms. Others there were talking about their postions in the movie/tv industry. When someone inquired of my job I said I fixed toilets for a living - pretty true as a landlord. I didn't expound.

Rarely worked for wages or salary, so maintaining self image was pretty much my own job and not dependent on title. That said, not being in direct management and trying to downsize rather than increase our real estate holdings is difficult at times - a certain lack of purpose..