DW doesn’t have much of a clue what it takes!

Tetto

Recycles dryer sheets
Joined
Dec 18, 2016
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New England
My DW, it seems, doesn’t have a firm grasp on how much $$ it takes to check out early. Every time I show her the numbers she goes off on “why are we still working”? I try to explain we have to have a larger stash to ride out the years, we’re still to young to have access to the bulk of the cash in the 401k. It’s a more recent struggle for me to teach her! It’s a good problem to have I suppose, anyone else have a SO who lives care free without much stress.....
 
My DW, it seems, doesn’t have a firm grasp on how much $$ it takes to check out early. Every time I show her the numbers she goes off on “why are we still working”? I try to explain we have to have a larger stash to ride out the years, we’re still to young to have access to the bulk of the cash in the 401k. It’s a more recent struggle for me to teach her! It’s a good problem to have I suppose, anyone else have a SO who lives care free without much stress.....

Sometimes one spouse takes care of almost all the retirement planning and/or budgeting and/or investing, and the other spouse's eyes glaze over. Just see what happens if you mention SORR.

That does not mean spouse #2 is a bad person, they may have other wonderful qualities.

That reminds me, I had better see if I can download more 1099s this weekend for my tax folder . . . :cool:
 
If you provide details, we can provide some feedback as to who is worrying too much or too little.
 
My DW isn’t interested in the details, she expects me to handle our investing, taxes, financial planning and spending-budget tracking - fortunately I enjoy doing it. She handles bank checking and credit card rewards. I wish she understood more, but I don’t badger her about it. I tell her we have more than we’re likely to need, and that’s all she wants to know. Fortunately we’ve both been naturally frugal all along, so there’s little (historical) chance our plan will fail...
 
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I have always managed the finances and the investments from a record keeping perspective. DW has equal input on spending and investment allocations, etc.
 
DW is happy if we have "enough." She believes me if I say we have enough. Other than that, she's better at penny pinching on every day stuff than I am. I guess that's "division of labor." YMMV
 
Sometimes one spouse takes care of almost all the retirement planning and/or budgeting and/or investing, and the other spouse's eyes glaze over. Just see what happens if you mention SORR.

That does not mean spouse #2 is a bad person, they may have other wonderful qualities.

That reminds me, I had better see if I can download more 1099s this weekend for my tax folder . . . :cool:

Of course she’s not a bad person! I get a kick as she’s planning all of these trips to England before we even hit our number! I suppose I’m a bit of a PIA in her eyes when I push back against those $10k trips before we’re ready.
 
Are you so sure that it isn't you? What is your success rate with FICalc or FIRACalc?

Could be me...I am a PIA sometimes....but Firecalc success rate with our spending with what we have right now, if I had access to the funds (I’m 55) is 100% to age 93.
 
Sometimes one spouse takes care of almost all the retirement planning and/or budgeting and/or investing, and the other spouse's eyes glaze over. Just see what happens if you mention SORR.

That does not mean spouse #2 is a bad person, they may have other wonderful qualities.

That reminds me, I had better see if I can download more 1099s this weekend for my tax folder . . . :cool:

Not only is she not a bad person, DW is smarter than I am in most situations. BUT she has no interest in finances at the macro level. BUT when it comes to finding value on an individual item, she leaves me in the dust. THAT'S why we work so well together. The time or two she's tried to step into my role (allocate HER own Roth, for instance) she's regretted it. When I step into her role, I blow it big time. A marriage made in heaven. Just hope we go to heaven at the same time or the one who remains may be in trouble (I know I will be!) YMMV
 
You can get penalty free access to 401k funds with 72t withdrawals. There are potential pitfalls. The generic term is SEPP Substantially Equal Periodic Payments. That provides one way to retire now and be able withdraw from your 401k.

You can learn more of the rules if you search and read up on 72t, if interested.
 
DW is smarter than I am in most situations.

My wife is smarter than me in every situation.......except one, that is....I conned her into marrying me. :dance:
 
Could be me...I am a PIA sometimes....but Firecalc success rate with our spending with what we have right now, if I had access to the funds (I’m 55) is 100% to age 93.

You could check with your employer 401K , as there is the 55 rule.
I'm vague on it as never used it.
However, as I understand, it allows you access to your 401K early without penalty.

If you stated how much $$$ is in:
taxable accounts, 401K, IRA, ROTHs, then you would get concrete answers.
 
Could be me...I am a PIA sometimes....but Firecalc success rate with our spending with what we have right now, if I had access to the funds (I’m 55) is 100% to age 93.

Could be you, but having some caution is not unusual. For me, we needed to be at More than 100%, with an inflated budget. So I worked a few more years, at a job I rather enjoyed. The market was more than kind, both before retirement and after. So, I retired at 60, 5 years ago, and can now (per Firecalc) spend twice our largest ever year for spend.

If access to deferred funds is your issue, consider investing more after tax or in Roth for the next few years.

Good luck.
 
My DH retired in 2015 at 57. He could not have access to the 401K till 59.5. We had lots of megacorp stock and had it for over a year. We did an NUA and away we went. Paid all the capital gains taxes. We lived off of that for the last 5 year until he started social security at 62 in Jan. 2020. Away we went. Plan seems to be working for the last 6 years.
 
Could be me...I am a PIA sometimes....but Firecalc success rate with our spending with what we have right now, if I had access to the funds (I’m 55) is 100% to age 93.

Well, it could be you. Not enough information. Some factors that might be important:

1. Have you looked at your spending and how it might change as you retire and age? Now -- 10 years after DH retired and I semi-retired we spend roughly 1/3 what we spent at your age. Why? Part of it is that our kids are now completely grown. Part of it is that even apart from kids a lot of our lifestyle has changed. We got rid of the 4500 SF house that had 2 double garages and a guest house. We now live in a house about half that size and on a lot instead of over 2 acres. So living expenses are far less. We are on Medicare. Health care costs are far less than they were pre-Medicare. And, so on. While there are some people who spend more in the early years of retirement especially, most people end up spending less money as they age. So you might look at your spending and see how it would change during various stages of retirement.

2. Do you have any money outside of retirement vehicles that could get you to 59 1/2? (There may other options as others have mentioned). But it may be important if you have enough money outside retirement vehicles to get to that age.

3. Are you considering SS? I ask because a shocking number of people just don't include it at all. While I think it is nice to be able to retire without considering it, most people will get SS and it forms an important part of their retirement budget.

4. How much risk do you want to have? It sounds like you want 100%. When DH and I were approaching this, he was OK with anything above 80%. I was OK with 95% (still am).

Another way to look at it is to prioritize certain spending. That is, when I was OK with 95% if I looked only at necessary spending plus some discretionary we were at 100%. It was only 95% if I went by desired level of spending. Many people will want 100% for a sort of basic OKish level of spending and might be perfectly happy to have 93% for all the bells and whistles.

5. How much is time worth to you in terms of future spending? 10 years ago if DH and I had continued working another several years there is no question we could spend more money than we spend now. We knew that. But, we were willing to trade some of that future spending to have the extra time of retiring then. Maybe you and your wife need to talk about this idea of getting to 100% for your current level of spending and see if it is worth to both of you to do that. Maybe your wife, for example, would say I am willing to trade $20k a year of future spending in order to be able to retire now. But, maybe she would not want to do that. Same for you.

From what you have said 93% with current mid-50s level of spending, I would personally probably agree with your wife. But -- and this is a big but -- there has to be a viable way to get to 59 1/2. If there isn't then I would chance my mind. Also, how long with it take to get to a percentage you are comfortable with? There is a big difference between waiting one more year and waiting 5 more years.
 
You could check with your employer 401K , as there is the 55 rule.
I'm vague on it as never used it.
However, as I understand, it allows you access to your 401K early without penalty.

If you stated how much $$$ is in:
taxable accounts, 401K, IRA, ROTHs, then you would get concrete answers.

Apparently my company rules don’t allow for early access. I can get at it at 59.5 which is ok by me. I’m gonna pad the stash hard for the next 7 years. We’ve got between us about $1.3 million in 401k and another $200k in brokerage and savings. House has about $40k left on mortgage. No other debt at all.
 
Well, it could be you. Not enough information. Some factors that might be important:

1. Have you looked at your spending and how it might change as you retire and age? Now -- 10 years after DH retired and I semi-retired we spend roughly 1/3 what we spent at your age. Why? Part of it is that our kids are now completely grown. Part of it is that even apart from kids a lot of our lifestyle has changed. We got rid of the 4500 SF house that had 2 double garages and a guest house. We now live in a house about half that size and on a lot instead of over 2 acres. So living expenses are far less. We are on Medicare. Health care costs are far less than they were pre-Medicare. And, so on. While there are some people who spend more in the early years of retirement especially, most people end up spending less money as they age. So you might look at your spending and see how it would change during various stages of retirement.

2. Do you have any money outside of retirement vehicles that could get you to 59 1/2? (There may other options as others have mentioned). But it may be important if you have enough money outside retirement vehicles to get to that age.

3. Are you considering SS? I ask because a shocking number of people just don't include it at all. While I think it is nice to be able to retire without considering it, most people will get SS and it forms an important part of their retirement budget.

4. How much risk do you want to have? It sounds like you want 100%. When DH and I were approaching this, he was OK with anything above 80%. I was OK with 95% (still am).

Another way to look at it is to prioritize certain spending. That is, when I was OK with 95% if I looked only at necessary spending plus some discretionary we were at 100%. It was only 95% if I went by desired level of spending. Many people will want 100% for a sort of basic OKish level of spending and might be perfectly happy to have 93% for all the bells and whistles.

5. How much is time worth to you in terms of future spending? 10 years ago if DH and I had continued working another several years there is no question we could spend more money than we spend now. We knew that. But, we were willing to trade some of that future spending to have the extra time of retiring then. Maybe you and your wife need to talk about this idea of getting to 100% for your current level of spending and see if it is worth to both of you to do that. Maybe your wife, for example, would say I am willing to trade $20k a year of future spending in order to be able to retire now. But, maybe she would not want to do that. Same for you.

From what you have said 93% with current mid-50s level of spending, I would personally probably agree with your wife. But -- and this is a big but -- there has to be a viable way to get to 59 1/2. If there isn't then I would chance my mind. Also, how long with it take to get to a percentage you are comfortable with? There is a big difference between waiting one more year and waiting 5 more years.

Thank you for that nice write up. You are correct in that I’m striving for 100% as I’m very conservative financially. I’m trying to set us up for as stress free a retirement as I can. She is a reasonable person and I think I may have gave you guys the wrong impression....she deserves to travel and have all the things she wants, but as I said I’m conservative and that has a tendency to override common sense. However, we are slamming cash into our savings account, maxed on 401’s plus catchup (me only- she doesn’t make too much) and have our eye on the ball. She’s 3.5 years older than me and will retire first at 62, then I go four years later, if I survive Megacorp.... one thing we have against us is we live in CT. While we do live it here, weather is nice year round, but it’s horribly expensive to live in. Still don’t know what we’re going to do on that front: should I stay or should I go now?
 
one thing we have against us is we live in CT. While we do live it here, weather is nice year round, but it’s horribly expensive to live in. Still don’t know what we’re going to do on that front: should I stay or should I go now?

Well, if you are working in the area then you might want to wait before moving if you think you might move to another area after retirement. A lot of people do move to less expensive areas when they retire. And, it isn't just expense. Many people move to another area because they can. That is, they are no longer tied down by the job.

We actually moved twice which probably wasn't idea. We moved from that huge house (mentioned in my prior post) to a smaller house but in the same metropolitan area (although about 50 miles away). It was less expensive than the first house though just due to being a smaller house. But we wanted to stay in the same area because we had still had kids in high school and college and didn't want to move out of the area. And, I was semi-retired working very part-time for my old full time employer.

Then a couple of years ago we moved again to a different area about 250 miles away. It wasn't cheaper (house was more expensive) but we wanted to be in another area.

However, we live in Texas so nothing near as expensive as where you live. We considered moving a lot of different places including in other states and we just ruled out anything in areas that are very expensive. That isn't where we wanted our money to go. But, if we had family/friends that were in the expensive areas I might feel differently.

But -- if you were to move to a more moderately priced area after retirement then you would undoubtedly have more money available.....
 
Could be me...I am a PIA sometimes....but Firecalc success rate with our spending with what we have right now, if I had access to the funds (I’m 55) is 100% to age 93.
Sounds like she might have a point then. How does your 95% success rate of safe spending (using the Investigate tab) compare to your target spending?
 
Could be me...I am a PIA sometimes....but Firecalc success rate with our spending with what we have right now, if I had access to the funds (I’m 55) is 100% to age 93.

It's definitely you! Own up and take responsibility and you can change!

1) Look into what others already mentioned about the "substantially equal periodic payments" rule to tap 401 without penalty starting now.

2) Or, consider working just two more years at current job, a trick to enable you to change attitude in just two years, but make some compromise toward wife's "let's do it now" schedule.

3) Or, can you arrange to work maybe part-time at current employer for some period of time over next two to five years? Would allow easing into retirement activities with wife, cover your survival living expenses in that interim, still allow you to add to retirement pots, and give more time for retirement pots to compound and grow.

You are in a good place with lots of options. So just make sure you don't PO the wife too much, and end up in a sadder place. Happy wife, happy life. :dance:
 
... It’s a more recent struggle for me to teach her!

Consider the possibility that you are not the best teacher for your DW in this area. Just because one is good at achieving early retirement does not mean one can teach it :).

There are definitely financial areas that a book or write up or a webinar does a better job of explaining things to DW than I can. Before I retired I brought her along on a few "planning for retirement" seminars, Some items became clearer to her than I could explain it. Sometimes things make more of an impact when a third party says it than when a spouse does.
 
Consider the possibility that you are not the best teacher for your DW in this area. Just because one is good at achieving early retirement does not mean one can teach it :).

There are definitely financial areas that a book or write up or a webinar does a better job of explaining things to DW than I can. Before I retired I brought her along on a few "planning for retirement" seminars, Some items became clearer to her than I could explain it. Sometimes things make more of an impact when a third party says it than when a spouse does.

She's actually got all the hallmarks of a LBYM person and coming from a family who never really had much, she gets giddy at what we've been able to accomplish. I just need to reality check the urges! If I was to die tomorrow, I have no worries that she'd be fine for the rest of her life; she's pretty tight overall with money. But London has some supernatural pull for her and she can't get enough...
 
I'd say, go ahead and let her book a trip to England. Take an annual vacation trip. You don't need to retire before starting nice vacations. You can have your cake and eat it, too!
 
My DW isn’t interested in the details, she expects me to handle our investing, taxes, financial planning and spending-budget tracking - fortunately I enjoy doing it. She handles bank checking and credit card rewards. I wish she understood more, but I don’t badger her about it. I tell her we have more than we’re likely to need, and that’s all she wants to know. Fortunately we’ve both been naturally frugal all along, so there’s little (historical) chance our plan will fail...

That's the exact same split of financial duties that we have. My DW understands the investments OK, just less interested in that.
 
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