Electric Vehicles - Models Discussion

[JoeWras]

Looks great. No longer a rolling duck.

 

[aja8888]

The new Tesla Model 3 (Highland) is out. It’s not shown on the US website, but it’s on the European sites -stills and video. I assume it will appear on US site today. Quite a few changes, front and back fascia, stalkless, new steering wheel, new seats, ventilated front seats, rear passenger screen, noise reduction and lower Cd, slightly higher range, new dash & center console, ambient lights in cabin, etc.

https://www.tesla.com/es_es/model3

This is very nice. I'm impressed with Tesla as they keep improving things. These new upgrades will make aa lot of Model 3 owners want to trade in their older 3.

 

[aja8888]

200 miles on my Bolt EUV

Some impressions:

1. I've never had a quieter car. Simply silent.

2. Very quick (not Tesla quick) and responsive.

3. Amazing electronics.

4. Range is pretty good and gets enhanced with regeneration.

5. Roomy inside. Good for the family, and back seat room is enormous (too much, in my opinion). Excellent visibility from all angles.

6. One pedal driving took me an hour or less to master.

7. I have the "Sun & Sound" package (Bose with panoramic sunroof). The Bose sound system is fantastic.

8. My 44 year old daughter has her sights on it.....not right now though!

9. The safety features are pretty nice and sometimes surprise me (ex. pedestrian in camera range warning).

10. The adaptive cruise control is neat.

A neighbor who drives a "Y' a block away stopped by yesterday to look at it. We took it for a spin. He said his wife is begging him for one of these for her daily jaunts. I said there are still a few out there unclaimed for 2023, but you may have trouble finding one. He wants the tax credit and a happy wife. I said check my dealer as I had one on hold for November delivery until this one showed up.

 

[RetMD21]

A neighbor who drives a "Y' a block away stopped by yesterday to look at it. We took it for a spin. He said his wife is begging him for one of these for her daily jaunts. I said there are still a few out there unclaimed for 2023, but you may have trouble finding one. He wants the tax credit and a happy wife. I said check my dealer as I had one on hold for November delivery until this one showed up.

I'm told that GM is keeping them in the distribution center and only releasing them to dealers who have a customer. I think they are trying to avoid something like the RAV4 fiasco

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

Welp, my old Honda lost its timing chain, so it's toast. I'll definitely be stepping up my timeline to buy an EV. Right now the Kia EV6 is at the top of my list, as it got better reviews than the Nero. I could get a Bolt EUV with trimmings for less, but I'm mostly worried about reliability and charging time if I want to take a longer trip.


Anyone have experience with the EV6? I know it's new, I'm going to try to test drive one, maybe this weekend.

 

[aja8888]

I'm told that GM is keeping them in the distribution center and only releasing them to dealers who have a customer. I think they are trying to avoid something like the RAV4 fiasco

Funny my Dealer is trying to get them (for buyers with money down) and was told if one wasn't placed on order by 7/28, there are none in the pipeline available that have no commitment. Production of this year's Bolt is scheduled to stop in early November.

 

[explanade]

The new Tesla Model 3 (Highland) is out. It’s not shown on the US website, but it’s on the European sites -stills and video. I assume it will appear on US site today. Quite a few changes, front and back fascia, stalkless, new steering wheel, new seats, ventilated front seats, rear passenger screen, noise reduction and lower Cd, slightly higher range, new dash & center console, ambient lights in cabin, etc.

https://www.tesla.com/es_es/model3

Looks like cosmetic changes mostly.

Will they ever update the chassis?

 

[Midpack]

Looks like cosmetic changes mostly.

Will they ever update the chassis?

There are at least 20 changes, by no means all cosmetic.

And it's rumored the new M3 has front and rear gigacastings, that's a huge change. Almost no one uses a "chassis" anymore...

 

[explanade]

Platform then.

At this point it seems changes are driven by lowering costs, not much of a desire to keep sales at a certain volume or increase sales, which is the typical reason that auto manufacturers refresh model lines.

 

[TriumphTR3fan]

There are at least 20 changes, by no means all cosmetic.

And it's rumored the new M3 has front and rear gigacastings, that's a huge change. Almost no one uses a "chassis" anymore...

Here is a link to a well known YouTube channel, Tesla Daily. He talks about all of the changes including range increase, noise reduction, a rear passenger screen & ventilated front seats. Some changes undoubtedly result in manufacturing cost reductions, some are to refresh the product.

 

[Midpack]

Platform then.

At this point it seems changes are driven by lowering costs, not much of a desire to keep sales at a certain volume or increase sales, which is the typical reason that auto manufacturers refresh model lines.

Tesla is definitely trying to increase volume as their top priority,why else would they reduce prices as they have several times this year? To hold or further reduce prices they have to reduce costs as they do want to remain profitable to fund more growth - but they are definitely not trying to maximize profits at present.

They are working on an even less expensive car for production at Giga Mexico, but that’s years away.

 

[Chuckanut]

I like to think of it as maximizing long term profits.

Musk thinks several steps ahead of the competition. That’s why Tesla has its marvelous charging network. And SpaceX lands and reuses booster rockets. Short term failure is an option if you learn from it.

 

[53anddone]

I think I am on board for this when it comes out next year. Already have an ID.4 so am looking forward to being fully transitioned. This is the Acura ZDX - made in the USA with a GM battery.

 

[eytonxav]

I think I am on board for this when it comes out next year. Already have an ID.4 so am looking forward to being fully transitioned. This is the Acura ZDX - made in the USA with a GM battery.

This also caught my eye. We previously owned an RDX which DW especially liked.

 

[explanade]

That ZDX is suppose to start around $60k which sounds way more than the ICE version of that Acura SUV of comparable size class.

 

[53anddone]

That ZDX is suppose to start around $60k which sounds way more than the ICE version of that Acura SUV of comparable size class.

I'll be comparing the price to other EVs such as the Audi Etrons. I think the Acura is made in the US with a US battery so should get the $7500 off plus another $1500 from state incentives - which would hopefully put the price into the mid 50s for the base model.

Who knows where the prices of Cars (and EVs in particular) are going in 2024. I think the key will be flexibility.

 

[RetMD21]

Funny my Dealer is trying to get them (for buyers with money down) and was told if one wasn't placed on order by 7/28, there are none in the pipeline available that have no commitment. Production of this year's Bolt is scheduled to stop in early November.

Word is that it was extended to december

https://insideevs.com/news/681577/gm-said-extend-2023-chevy-bolt-ev-euv-production-into-december/

 

[JoeWras]

I thought this was a good article/web broadcast. From WSJ tech reporter Joanna Stern.

She compares a:
- Tesla Model Y
- Ford Mach-E
- Hyundai IONIQ 5

Her comparison is from a non-auto journalist point of view. An everyday person point of view about range, features, charging and so on, who has zero experience with EVs before.

Spoiler: she liked the Y and Mach-E, with her preference being the Mach-E. IONIQ had a few things against it.

I thought the observation by her EV journalist friend about the high rate of change on EVs was good. I.e. things are changing really, really fast and the EV of three years from now will be different and even better.

Free link:

Buying the Best EV Under $60,000: I Tested the Ford Mustang Mach-E, Tesla Model Y, Hyundai Ioniq 5 and Others

 

[Midpack]

With apologies to those who are not interested in the Tesla Model 3 update (Highland). And this is not a complete list...

The new model is not available in the US yet, rollout dates 2nd quote below, evidently parts of Europe & Middle East are first in line.

Here is a list of everything new in the refreshed Model 3:

• Range has increases ~12%
• 50% of the parts in the car are new
• Redesigned interior with new door cards
• More premium interior materials. The fabric is softer to the touch and sewn with a more refined process to present a better overall texture
• Two new colors: Ultra Red & Stealth Gray
• No more stalks. New steering wheel contains the turns signals, light controls, horn, new camera button, wiper controls and mic control
• New dash design with textured/woven material
• Multicolor ambient LED interior lighting extending from dash to rear seat doors
• Updated center console with real metal handles, giving a more premium feel.
• 30% decrease in wind and ambient noise, 25% improvement in impact noise and 20% improvement in road noise
• Acoustic glass on rear windows and back window (was only on front windows before). "360º acoustic glass"
• More sound insulation for a quieter ride
• Uptick in hood to let wind go over more quietly
• Upgraded suspension for a more premium ride. New springs & dampers. New geometry on front suspension. New bushings. New way they mount the sub frame to the chassis
• Stiffer body
• More premium sounding door "thunk"
• Two motors close the trunk now vs one before, resulting in a quieter automatic close
• Tires have more cushioning for improved ride
• Center touchscreen now brighter, has smaller bezels, higher contrast & is more responsive
• More comfortable rear seats
• Redesigned lower rear bumper
• All seats are now perforated
• No fog lights anymore
• Front seats are now ventilated, in additional to heated
• 8" touchscreen for rear passengers in the back to control climate & enjoy entertainment. You can connect two headsets at the same time.
• New Model 3 is the most aerodynamic Tesla ever. Drag coefficient is 0.219 Cd
• Upgraded 2.0 ventilation system. You can now separately turn off the passenger side air
• Slimmer and sleeker headlight and taillight design
• New speaker bar in the roof
• New 17 speaker sound system (up from 14 before). It now includes 2 subwoofers, and 2 amplifiers. More punchy.
• 65W USB-C charger in center console so you can charge a laptop.
• Improved bluetooth
• Upgraded microphones. Now one on each passenger side. New mics make phone calls clearer and "smooth"
• Improved Wifi connectivity
• improved connectivity to phone so car will recognize your phone from farther away
• Two new wheel designs that optimize battery life
• Front bumper camera (maybe?)
• New Tesla lettering replaces rear Tesla logo badge
• Car is 8% more efficient thanks to better aerodynamics
• Car is lighter than before
• Working on new Performance Model 3

I'm sure there are more things new about this vehicle that we will learn later.

Europe: October
Middle East: October
China: Q4 2023
Australia & New Zealand: January 2024 - March 2024
Malaysia: late 2023
Japan: December 2023 - March 2024
UK and Ireland: not yet available
Canada: not yet available
US: Not yet available
Singapore: not yet available
Korea: Not yet available

 

[RetMD21]

A salesman in Michigan told me Thursday that I could get one of these no problem:

 

[JoeWras]

Tesla no stalks. I know they like minimalism. But man.

Sure, I'll have to try to to see I like it. Right now, I don't like it. My opinion.

Now I'm waiting for someone to sarcastically say they miss the stalk to control spark advance. Ha ha, I get it.

Screenshot of new 3 Europe web site.

 

[Midpack]

Tesla no stalks. I know they like minimalism. But man.

Sure, I'll have to try to to see I like it. Right now, I don't like it. My opinion.

Now I'm waiting for someone to sarcastically say they miss the stalk to control spark advance. Ha ha, I get it.

Screenshot of new 3 Europe web site.

They removed the stalks on the Model S & X quite a while ago - so there are thousands of owners using stalkless already. While some people don't like the change, most actual owners I know love it after giving it a few days - even those who didn't like the idea beforehand. One a Model X owner in TX who rented a Model Y on a trip, and hated having to bother with stalks again. She says the car "knows" whether you want D or R more often than not, but the driver can override if he/she wants to. It's a simple swipe up or down on the left edge of the display, with a button backup on the console (S & X) or control panel by rear view (new 3).

It's too bad people who make up their minds without even trying new things (not saying you have), but there are plenty of them. DW and I are looking forward to trying it out, and expect to find it just fine. We reminded ourselves you almost never switch gears while driving an automatic transmission anyway - it stays in D most of the time while driving, and it's not hard to pay attention when you need R or P.

Frankly I am a little more anxious about have the turn signals on the left spoke of the wheel...should be fine 90+% of the time, but it could be a PITA when the wheel is turned and you want to change signals - e.g. while turning left and need to signal upcoming right. But Model S & X owners have been using them for quite a while.

 

[JoeWras]

They removed the stalks on the Model S & X quite a while ago - so there are thousands of owners using stalkless already. While some people don't like the change, most actual owners I know love it after giving it a few days - even those who didn't like the idea beforehand. One a Model X owner in TX who rented a Model Y on a trip, and hated having to bother with stalks again. She says the car "knows" whether you want D or R more often than not, but the driver can override if he/she wants to. It's a simple swipe up or down on the left edge of the display, with a button backup on the console (S & X) or control panel by rear view (new 3).

It's too bad people who make up their minds without even trying new things (not saying you have), but there are plenty of them. DW and I are looking forward to trying it out, and expect to find it just fine. We reminded ourselves you almost never switch gears while driving an automatic transmission anyway - it stays in D most of the time while driving, and it's not hard to pay attention when you need R or P.

Frankly I am a little more anxious about have the turn signals on the left spoke of the wheel...should be fine 90+% of the time, but it could be a PITA when the wheel is turned and you want to change signals - e.g. while turning left and need to signal upcoming right. But Model S & X owners have been using them for quite a while.

I don't care about the tranny. I'm talking turn signal stalks.

Auto trannies have been, or easy could be, fly by wire for years. The "shifter" always seemed like an anachronism anyway. Something to make slushboxers think they were driving a manual. How many TV ads do you see of hot models "shifting" auto trannies. Too many. Ridiculous.

I blame Chrysler corporation for this, as I do many automobile maladies.

In the 1950s, during the obsession with the push button future (it's here!), Chrysler had push button selectors on some models. In a bit of irony, this became "outdated" in the 60s as we moved on to rockets or something. But all I remember about it is my parents and their friends bitching about how they broke. For whatever reason, a lever of some sort was the standard thereafter.

 

[yakers]

Delete

 

[yakers]

Just saw this (and many other EVs) in Oslo Norway, could not get a test ride, it’s a Neo