How the heck can my older son get financial aid for college??

[lhamo]

If he had money saved up to pay for his first year, that may have worked against him -- I believe the financial aid calculators they use consider a higher proportion of student assets than parental assets when assessing the amount for the individual to contribute. He should fill out the FAFSA as early as possible for next year, especially if he has spent down his savings already -- that will probably means he qualifies for more aid.



Is his academic record strong enough that he could get admitted to a more selective private school as a transfer student? Due to large endowments, they will often have better aid packages (including merit aid) than state schools will provide. He would get a full ride someplace like Harvard or Stanford if he could get in. He may have better chances as an older student who has been independent, too -- puts him in a different pool than the typical high school senior.

 

[albireo13]

Great ideas guys.
I'm going to talk with him and suggest he at least consider other schools, even out of state private ones. Schools that have good programs in Environmental Engineering and Environmental science.


So far his 1st semester is going well. He is doing A/B+ work.


I am hoping he might do better next year. He quit his full time job to go back to school so this years total income will be much lower, on his next FAFSA.

 

[youbet]

We are planning to help him out. We'd like he came out with < $40K in loans. Of course the bulk of the work will be on him paying the bill.

I mentioned earlier that financial aid offices are cautious (suspicious) in dealing with applicants who are still young but claiming to be on their own and financially independent (no mom and dad on the FAFSA). Here's why. You're having him leave you off the FAFSA form yet planning to help him out.

I get it and might likely do the same thing in your shoes. Yet, your statement helped me understand why schools don't look at every "financially independent" applicant with no/few assets or income as someone they should give generous aid to.

I think it must be a slippery slope for the financial aid offices. Where do they draw lines when dealing with applicants claiming to be independent? At some age? At some number of years since they left home? At some level of assets or income? Maybe consider factors such as what they've been doing since they left home?

I don't doubt that your son is truly independent with zero strings tied back to you. But I am starting to understand why financial aid offices might consider him differently in the situation he is claiming vs. if he did include you on his FAFSA and you were totally incomeless and broke. By claiming independent status, he's kind of leaving a "?" out there.

I hope he, you and the school are able to work things out so he gets where he wants to go!

 

[MichaelB]

My son went to college, left to work, then went back and was a student at 26. The financial aid office considered him independent because he was over age 25, had verifiable W-2 income and was not a dependent on our tax return.

I agree that loans are not aid, but interest subsidies are. Universities are the greatest cheerleaders of loans, yet have no skin in the game.

Community college for at least one year is a surefire way to contain the total cost of college. A student in today's world must have a clear view of after college - profession, employment prospects, starting salary - before committing to >$100K of spending on higher education.

 

[DFDubb]

I went to college as a non traditional student. I started a little bit older than your son. I had a lucrative career before, but was burned out and wanted to try a completely new field that required a degree. Like mentioned above, the age is a hindrance. I was planning on paying out of pocket anyways and I did, but met with the Fin Aid office a couple of times. I got about the same level of service, please visit our website and apply for all this stuff you'll never hear back on.

Schools just aren't excited about these students I'm sorry to say. 26 y/o college freshman is just not a sexy statistic.

 

[AprM]

Great ideas guys.
I'm going to talk with him and suggest he at least consider other schools, even out of state private ones. Schools that have good programs in Environmental Engineering and Environmental science.

The Army needs Environmental Science and Engineering Officers (ESEOs). Look for ROTC programs.

 

[RunningBum]

I should have said that I "recognize" that schools consider loans as aid.

Some people also believe the earth is flat. That doesn't make the earth flat.

Not sure what that has to do with anything. You seem to be the one with difficulties grasping the reality of financial college aid. You think he should be getting all kinds of non-loan financial aid. That doesn't mean he will get all kinds of non-loan financial aid.

I just don't understand what it takes to get need-based, non-loan aid. Just frustrated.

You said he'd already gotten $2500 in aid. It's just not as much as you'd like. Why do you think others should pay for his whole education? How much should he be getting, and why?

A fellow I worked with has a son who got full-boat college education at Harvard, from athletic scholarships by being on the rowing team.

Well hey, there's another way how. He's not a good enough athlete? Oh well. Not everyone is going to get everything they want without having to work for it or have a special talent.

This is UNH and in-state tuition alone is ~$19K. Add room and board, fees, etc and it goes up to $33K. Maybe he should move off-campus and rent. Moving back home would be hard since it would be a long drive to the school.

Yep, I lived off campus. Kind of surprised a mid 20s person wouldn't want to.

 

[ocean view]

Here’s another option: Move to Houston. Rice University has announced that in fall of 2019 it will offer free tuition for those earning less than $130k, grants for room and board for those earning less than $65k.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...ion-to-families-earning-less-than-130000/amp/

Given the choice between huge debt and moving to Texas, I’d move...or at least apply

 

[joeea]

he could go to a bank and get a loan no problem.

Terrific. Sounds like you have a solution!

So, if he were to do 4 years at $33K/ea, and given student loans for it all, he'd be rewarded at graduation with starting off $132K in debt ... before his first day at work!!

Alternatively, he could work until he saves up enough money for school. Or go to a less expensive college. Or work during college. Work for a company that reimburses tuition costs. Perhaps get money from some other source (you?).

Yup, that's our nation's definition of student "aid".

Okay.

There are elections next week. Some candidates have positions regarding student loans and the cost of education. Some don't.

 

[HtownRose]

Yes, he should come on down to the Harvard of the South! No idea about Environmental specialty, but many successful engineers have their Rice sheepskin - and yes they use actual sheepskin for the diploma, or at least they used to back when it was Rice Institute. Campus is beautiful & the "MOB" Marching Owl Band is a treat - the rival halftime performance I enjoyed the most (search youtube). And with all the energy megacorps in town there should be opportunities for internships & jobs.

 

[Big_Hitter]

Here’s another option: Move to Houston. Rice University has announced that in fall of 2019 it will offer free tuition for those earning less than $130k, grants for room and board for those earning less than $65k.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fo...ion-to-families-earning-less-than-130000/amp/

Given the choice between huge debt and moving to Texas, I’d move...or at least apply

you just need to get in

DW went to Rice - I applied but my SAT score was too high

 

[Maenad]

What's the ROI on an Env Eng degree? What's the median starting salary, and where are the most jobs? If he's thinking of graduating with over $100K in student loans and will start out making, say, $40K, that's really not a good deal.

I agree with others that he really needs to shop around for a cheaper school, and possibly change his major. MechE is the most versatile from what I've seen, if you don't want to go software.

 

[imoldernu]

This is mentioned in a different thread. All three of my grandchildren received extensive scholarships when their mom researched the hundred of offerings from this site. They figure it saved them more than $500K.

https://www.niche.com/colleges/scholarships/

It may take a few minutes to understand how the search works, but IMHO, worth it.

At my college, 51% of incoming students receive average scholarship grants of over $50,000/year.

https://www.bowdoin.edu/academic-handbook/admission-to-the-college/financial-aid.shtml

Good luck... takes some work and some time to research and file, but based on what I know happened, worth the effort.

 

[Bamaman]

I asked my next door neighbor how his daughter could handle home schooling her 5 children. He said she was a secretary at Harvard University, and she got her Masters in Education for free there.

There are large universities that cover employees' and their children's college tuition as a perk--even for employees working in their teaching hospitals.

 

[Teacher Terry]

My DH is a civil engineer with a emphasis in environmental. His first jobs were environmental but eventually had to switch to civil engineering jobs in other areas because of a lack of work. My youngest son graduated high school at 16 and went to college on a scholarship. Quit after a semester, moved to Colorado and worked until he was 21. Then he went to college and was considered independent. He got some grants and loans. He moved in with us.

 

[SecondCor521]

I mentioned earlier that financial aid offices are cautious (suspicious) in dealing with applicants who are still young but claiming to be on their own and financially independent (no mom and dad on the FAFSA). Here's why. You're having him leave you off the FAFSA form yet planning to help him out.

I get it and might likely do the same thing in your shoes. Yet, your statement helped me understand why schools don't look at every "financially independent" applicant with no/few assets or income as someone they should give generous aid to.

I think it must be a slippery slope for the financial aid offices. Where do they draw lines when dealing with applicants claiming to be independent? At some age? At some number of years since they left home? At some level of assets or income? Maybe consider factors such as what they've been doing since they left home?

I don't doubt that your son is truly independent with zero strings tied back to you. But I am starting to understand why financial aid offices might consider him differently in the situation he is claiming vs. if he did include you on his FAFSA and you were totally incomeless and broke. By claiming independent status, he's kind of leaving a "?" out there.

I hope he, you and the school are able to work things out so he gets where he wants to go!

For federal financial aid that is distributed based on the FAFSA, there are very clear definitions of what it means to be an independent student. It is not, by any stretch, a judgement call or preference of the student or the financial aid office. For obvious reasons, it is hard to be considered an independent student. A few easier ways are to be 24 years or older in the aid year, be married, or be working on a graduate (but not medical) degree.

 

[Walt34]

There are large universities that cover employees' and their children's college tuition as a perk--even for employees working in their teaching hospitals.

One of my nieces worked at Maryland University in College Park, MD for ~10-12 years. One of the bennies was that she could have taken two classes per semester entirely free except for books. She never took up the offer.

 

[youbet]

For federal financial aid that is distributed based on the FAFSA, there are very clear definitions of what it means to be an independent student. It is not, by any stretch, a judgement call or preference of the student or the financial aid office. For obvious reasons, it is hard to be considered an independent student. A few easier ways are to be 24 years or older in the aid year, be married, or be working on a graduate (but not medical) degree.

Thanks for that input.

How do school's have any control of their expenses then? If they have a year in which an extraordinary number of applicants "check all the boxes" for receiving generous need-based financial aid based on FAFSA's where they are "independent" and indigent, do the schools just suck it up and find a way to do it? Or are you saying that's just how they distribute the inflow of federal money and not necessarily money from their endowment?

I admit that it almost seems too good to be true that a 25 year old "independent" who is the child of wealthy parents could qualify for aid while mom and dad still choose to "help out" under the table. (For example, pay back the loan portion of the aid later.) Such a deal!

 

[SecondCor521]

Thanks for that input.

How do school's have any control of their expenses then? If they have a year in which an extraordinary number of applicants "check all the boxes" for receiving generous need-based financial aid based on FAFSA's where they are "independent" and indigent, do they just suck it up and find a way to do it? Or are you saying, that's just how they distribute the inflow of federal money and not necessarily money from their endowment?

The schools have a general idea from prior years' experience of approximately what to expect. Beyond that, I believe they have a budget and hand that out until it's gone. That is why I believe that students are frequently exhorted to file the FAFSA as early as possible - as time passes the school's financial aid budget gets used up and students receive stingier offers.

Also note that almost all schools do not meet all demonstrated need. So if, for instance, a student wants to go to a school that costs $32K per year and the FAFSA says the student can only afford $2K per year, the school is not required to and typically will not give the student $30K of aid. Depending on the school's financial aid budget and how relatively desirable that student is to that school, they might only provide $10K or $20K of aid. This is a process known as "gapping".

Even schools who meet all the demonstrated need of a student may do so by facilitating or including student or parent college loans in the package.

 

[haha]

Possibly the college swindle is worse than the medical swindle. What a crock.

Ha

 

[Katsmeow]

How many hours of college does he have? I would recommend that he do his first 60 hours at community college. Make sure the hours are transferable to where he wants to finish up. DS has a degree in computer science. It did not hurt him at all to do the first half at community college. The core curriculum is the core curriculum and it didn't matter where he did it. It was far less expensive to do at CC. In his case, he lived at home for CC as it was close to us. However, some CC's actually do have dorms (although hard to imagine a 26 year old wanting to live on campus).

When DS eventually went to the state university he lived off campus. The required meal plan for on campus was insanely expensive. Far less expensive to live off campus.

Where we live if you did CC those hours were transferable to state universities and would meet the core curriculum requirement. Also if you knew exactly which state university you wanted to go to you could apply to the state university as a freshman and get admitted even though you were going to go the CC for the first 2 years. This had the benefit of you knowing you were admitted (assuming you kept grades up to what they wanted) and you could use some resources at the university (DS did this but ended up going to a different state university for his last couple of years.

Anyway -- this ended up saving a lot of money...

 

[Winemaker]

If he wants to get into Environmental Engineering, have him find a local/nearby company that does environmental engineering work. If he proves to be a good prospect, that company will "invest" in him. Many employers also offer college refunds up to 80%, that's how I almost got my MBA.

 

[SnowBound]

Great ideas guys.
I'm going to talk with him and suggest he at least consider other schools, even out of state private ones. Schools that have good programs in Environmental Engineering and Environmental science.


So far his 1st semester is going well. He is doing A/B+ work.


I am hoping he might do better next year. He quit his full time job to go back to school so this years total income will be much lower, on his next FAFSA.

Ever think about establishing residency in a state with free tuition? New York offers it. They also have a great Environmental Science college, ESF in Syracuse. They used to be a rising college only, so should have no problem transferring credits.

PS: Taxes are low in NH, so yes higher education is not going to get a lot of state support. NY has "free" SUNY Colleges, but the NY tax rate will blow your mind (& budget).

 

[Lakewood90712]

Good to hear he has chosen a major that should become a career path, either in the private sector or government.

I would disagree with lumping living expenses into college cost. Take that out and you are under 100k at a very good school.

 

[fosterscik]

Thanks for that input.

How do school's have any control of their expenses then? If they have a year in which an extraordinary number of applicants "check all the boxes" for receiving generous need-based financial aid based on FAFSA's where they are "independent" and indigent, do the schools just suck it up and find a way to do it? Or are you saying that's just how they distribute the inflow of federal money and not necessarily money from their endowment?

I admit that it almost seems too good to be true that a 25 year old "independent" who is the child of wealthy parents could qualify for aid while mom and dad still choose to "help out" under the table. (For example, pay back the loan portion of the aid later.) Such a deal!

This is a common misperception about College aid. The FAFSA sets the expected family contribution, but that is all. Very few colleges promise to meet a student's full need. They will offer loans to make up the difference above and beyond the family (or independent student's) contribution set by the FAFSA, but that unfunded gap leads to student debt.