RIP - Bernie Madoff

[Music Lover]

Offhand I can't think of anyone who will be missed less.

I can

 

[pb4uski]

In his case I thought it was Rot in Peace.

 

[TheRunningMan]

This is one death that should at worst be celebrated and at best be ignored. This man was human garbage...he should be remembered as such.

 

[scrabbler1]

I remember thinking to myself when he was sentenced, "I'll be glad to see him come out of prison in a box." And he will.

 

[travelover]

I remember thinking to myself when he was sentenced, "I'll be glad to see him come out of prison in a box." And he will.

I knew he'd never serve the whole 150 years.

 

[Sunset]

I knew he'd never serve the whole 150 years.

True to his form, over promised and under delivered again.

 

[Redbugdave]

I imagine his term in prison was not like a normal prisoner. He was most likely kept away and shielded from the main population. Special people have to be handled differently since they could be killed by other prisoners. He probably had it easier than most. Our tax money goes towards paying hospitalization for prisoners as well. It can be quite expensive. I think about all the other lives he had ruined.

 

[gattara]

Geez, I didn't realize his wife lost both children. I remember watching an interview years ago and it truly seemed like she didn't know about her husband's activities. I believed her. She lost so much in her life, I just can't imagine.

 

[kcowan]

For every Madoff, there are 1000 scammers who steal people's money every day. They just operate under the radar.

 

[Car-Guy]

For every Madoff, there are 1000 scammers who steal people's money every day. They just operate under the radar.

At least that many but probably many, many 1000's more.

 

[youbet]

If it sounds too good to be true......

There ya go! My take-away from the whole debacle, in addition to the fact that Bernie was a no-good crook, is that people's ugly greed and lust for easy money often leads them to bad outcomes. There are "Bernies" out there everywhere in the world waiting for the next wealth-seeker to come into view.

I truly hope this well publicized example has been useful for everyone as a learning experience.

 

[Music Lover]

For every Madoff, there are 1000 scammers who steal people's money every day. They just operate under the radar.

And how many people knew or suspected he was a scammer but went along anyway hoping to cash in?

 

[scrabbler1]

There ya go! My take-away from the whole debacle, in addition to the fact that Bernie was a no-good crook, is that people's ugly greed and lust for easy money often leads them to bad outcomes. There are "Bernies" out there everywhere in the world waiting for the next wealth-seeker to come into view.

I truly hope this well publicized example has been useful for everyone as a learning experience.

But weren't many of the people who lost money due his fraud investors who invested with third parties who acted as "feeder funds" for his Ponzi scheme? Those investors wouldn't have known about Madoff but lost money anyway, albeit not as much as those who invested directly with him.

 

[youbet]

But weren't many of the people who lost money due his fraud investors who invested with third parties who acted as "feeder funds" for his Ponzi scheme? Those investors wouldn't have known about Madoff but lost money anyway, albeit not as much as those who invested directly with him.

I'm certainly not an expert in the source of all of the monetary inputs to Bernie's scheme. But I do believe the scheme would likely not have been possible without the greed of investors wanting to hear that they'd be guaranteed easy money without understanding how it was being invested. They'd only have to write a check, sit back and make plans on how to spend the profits. Oh boy.........

Is it possible the general public has learned a lesson? I dunno..... I kind of doubt it.

 

[Chuckanut]

One of my fears is that today's low interest rates will bring out more scammers. I remember doing my initial retirement calculations assuming I could earn 4% on long term CD's. Then 3%. I have a few 2% CD's that are coming due this month. The safe rates are painful, but I will not be buying the high yielding Venezuelan Beaver Cheese notes.

 

[youbet]

One of my fears is that today's low interest rates will bring out more scammers. I remember doing my initial retirement calculations assuming I could earn 4% on long term CD's. Then 3%. I have a few 2% CD's that are coming due this month. The safe rates are painful, but I will not be buying the high paying Venezuelan Beaver Cheese bonds notes.

My fear is that today's low interest rates will bring out more greed and desperation and people will take on inappropriate levels of risk and be more likely to deal with scammers.

 

[Buckeye]

I recommend Harry Markopolos' book, "No One Would Listen" which is the story of how Harry tried to warn the world about Madoff years before his Ponzi scheme collapsed.

It's a great read but it will raise your blood pressure knowing Madoff's scam could have been ended years and billions of dollars earlier. It's also told me that lots of the feeder fund managers had to know full well that Madoff was a fraud or they were doing zero due diligence as they collected their commissions and allowed the financial lives of their customers to be destroyed.

 

[audreyh1]

There ya go! My take-away from the whole debacle, in addition to the fact that Bernie was a no-good crook, is that people's ugly greed and lust for easy money often leads them to bad outcomes. There are "Bernies" out there everywhere in the world waiting for the next wealth-seeker to come into view.

I truly hope this well publicized example has been useful for everyone as a learning experience.

I knew too individuals in my life who absolutely couldn’t resist “too good to be true” offers. They always thought they were somehow beating the system. It didn’t seem to matter that they had lost money or hassle before. They would swallow the sales pitch hook line and sinker. I think the salesmen were good at making them feel brilliant and letting them brag a lot.

Fortunately neither had ny financial links to me.

 

[Koolau]

Can you imagine being one of the folks who happened to redeem some of their Madoff millions before BM was "found out" - and now face claw-back? I think that would hurt almost as badly as the folks who woke up with frozen accounts, likely worth zilch.

Hey, I just noticed that Bernie Madoff's initials are BM. Appropriate? You decide.

In any case, I have tried to purge from my lexicon the phrase "burn in hell." If any one deserved it on the basis of the size of his financial crime, BM does. Still, I believe in hell and don't want anyone to experience it - even those that deserve it. Call me old fashioned. I forgave the "FP" who put me in "abusive tax shelters" and cost me a small fortune back in the '80s. I hope BM found some level of forgiveness - he needed more than most of us but YMMV.

 

[jldavid47]

When I read the news I was not sad. And I don't feel one bit guilty about not feeling sad. Weasel.

 

[Markola]

Last night I watched “The Wizard of Lies,” with Robert DiNero and Michelle Pfeiffer. They are both fantastic, of course, as are the rest.

 

[Car-Guy]

Last night I watched “The Wizard of Lies,” with Robert DiNero and Michelle Pfeiffer. They are both fantastic, of course, as are the rest.

Perfect role for Di Nero...

 

[marko]

There ya go! My take-away from the whole debacle, in addition to the fact that Bernie was a no-good crook, is that people's ugly greed and lust for easy money often leads them to bad outcomes.

I truly hope this well publicized example has been useful for everyone as a learning experience.

But let's be fair to Bernie's victims.

IIRC the genius behind his scheme was that he wasn't offering obscene profits--always a red flag. He was claiming a steady 8%; a relatively modest gain, one which many here accomplish regularly, myself included.

He wasn't appealing to unreasonable 'greed' IMO and many of his victims were financially well beyond the need for 'easy money' or get rich quick schemes.

He was a crook yes, and the worst, but his victims --IMO--were not in the category of greedy people looking for unreasonable gains.

"If it looks too good to be true..." didn't apply here and that was the brilliant part of the scam.

 

[Chuckanut]

Can you imagine being one of the folks who happened to redeem some of their Madoff millions before BM was "found out" - and now face claw-back? I think that would hurt almost as badly as the folks who woke up with frozen accounts, likely worth zilch.
<snip>
I forgave the "FP" who put me in "abusive tax shelters" and cost me a small fortune back in the '80s. I hope BM found some level of forgiveness - he needed more than most of us but YMMV.

I wonder about the tax consequences of these claw-backs. State and Federal income tax was undoubtedly paid on some of the fake gains. Ugh!

On the subject of forgiveness... Forgiveness does not necessarily mean no consequences. It's not all about the wronged person. Forgiveness requires the wrong doer to repent, make an effort to not do wrong again, and make reparations if possible. If the wrong doer won't... well, there is no point in being bitter. Like my grandpappy used to say "Being bitter is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die. Living well is the best revenge."

 

[Koolau]

I wonder about the tax consequences of these claw-backs. State and Federal income tax was undoubtedly paid on some of the fake gains. Ugh!

On the subject of forgiveness... Forgiveness does not necessarily mean no consequences. It's not all about the wronged person. Forgiveness requires the wrong doer to repent, make an effort to not do wrong again, and make reparations if possible. If the wrong doer won't... well, there is no point in being bitter. Like my grandpappy used to say "Being bitter is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die. Living well is the best revenge."

I completely agree with the philosophy you have expressed here. I have to deal with how others treat or mistreat me - it is my choice to forgive or dwell on things I can not change. BM faced prison and I hope it sunk in what terrible pain and suffering he had inflicted on his innocent victims. I hope he repented.