Tip the Owner?

[jollystomper]

Well, sometimes it's optional.

We were in a restaurant last week and our party had 12 people at the table. At the end of the meal, I was presented with the bill that had a "20% Large Party Gratuity" already figured in on the total amount. Then I was given the option to add even more on top of that after I gave them my credit card. This was on a bill of between four and five hundred dollars. And the service was slow and inaccurate. Maybe since they knew they were going to get a minimum 20% tip no matter what, they didn't care.

For a large party I can sort of understand including the gratuity on the bill. Many places mention that on the menu. But when we ate in Mahattan in June, our party of four had an 18% gratuity added to our bill (no mention on the menu), and were told "you can add more if you like". No thanks. The service was good, but there were only 4 tables being used out of maybe 20. I was planning to tip 20% if they had not included it.

 

[ERD50]

Originally Posted by ERD50 View Post
I'd welcome it.

Provide the service and charge me accordingly. Tipping is asking me to evaluate their employees performance - that's the manager's job.

Plus, I have absolutely no idea what the staff is making. They could be making big bucks on those tips, or barely above minimum wage. I have no insight to that, so why am I making salary decisions for them? It makes zero sense.

In my career, I had to do performance reviews and was a part of that salary review process. But I had access to information that I don't have at the restaurants. Don't ask me to do that when all I want is a meal.

-ERD50

How would the manager know as much about your specific experience as you the diner do? Being a server involves a process and soft skills, the manager only knows about the latter by exception - they don't have performance metrics like you probably had in performance reviews. ...

It's the manager's job to know how their employees are performing. There's plenty of other jobs where the employee interacts with the customer and 'soft skills', but tipping is not the custom.

Performance metrics? No, often we didn't really have good metrics. I had maintenance support staff reporting to me, I'd sometimes be able to observe how they interacted with the production staff to see how problems were fixed, and I'd get feedback from the production supervisors from time to time if someone did an exceptional good or bad job. There were some 'soft skills' for the maintenance person in dealing with the production supervisor whose line was down. Keeping him/her informed of the problem, giving them feedback on the status, and generally being respectful and helpful. Seems pretty similar to a manager and the wait staff.

[... As said elsewhere, go to restaurants with stated no tip policies if you prefer. And it's not correct to assume all servers object to the current tipping structure, there are multiple data points from no tip restaurants that show otherwise, many reverted back to tipping.

I have gone to no-tip restaurants, and very much preferred it. Service was fine.

I understand the no-tip policy isn't catching on, but I don't think that invalidates any of my observations. Just like McDonald's being more popular than a fine dining establishment invalidates the observation of the difference in quality of food at each.

I didn't say anything about what the servers prefer, I guess that was directed at someone else?

-ERD50

 

[ivinsfan]

Many here constantly object to being asked to tip servers for a variety of reasons, if that’s not you, apologies. I was a server a long time ago, and tips rocked even back when 15% was a great tip. Most servers don’t object to tipping, it’s some consumers and academics.

You want to pay less. No tip policies won’t do that. Again, what hasn’t gotten more expensive- it’s not just restaurant servers.

Ok the post after mine was someone promoting no tip higher priced meals. I don't have a problem tipping since there's no point trying to swim upstream...our last meal out , in a small town eatery the waitress got distracted and forgot to turn in our food order for 40 minutes. She was so embarrassed we left a 25% tip to show we weren't annoyed.

 

[GenXguy]

So if you’re not planning to tip, you have no business in a restaurant - period.

I think you're always going to have some people stiffing the servers. But if tips are voluntary, I don't see that we can stop people from doing it. I actually worked as a waiter for a while a few decades ago when it only paid about $2/hr here. Back then, it wasn't uncommon for a couple to leave a $1 tip for lunch.

Servers are paid a much lower hourly base rate

Depends where you're at. They're paid over 3 times as much per hour in my state than that base rate, and some states/locations are even higher, so the waiters/waitresses aren't reliant as much on tips.

pretty much no one I know thinks 15% is acceptable the low bar is 20% and higher for great service.

I used to hear 10% to 15% for tipping for decent to good service, and these days I always hear 15% to 20% for tipping. It doesn't surprise me that someone wants to knock it up even higher so that we are covering more of the business's labor expenses.

So the meals have gone up due to high inflation, the tip % has gone up resulting in inflation on top of inflation, and the sales taxes have gone up as well, really driving up those out of pocket costs. Indeed, it's getting very expensive for the consumer.

 

[Montecfo]

I think you're always going to have some people stiffing the servers. But if tips are voluntary, I don't see that we can stop people from doing it. I actually worked as a waiter for a while a few decades ago when it only paid about $2/hr here. Back then, it wasn't uncommon for a couple to leave a $1 tip for lunch.

Depends where you're at. They're paid over 3 times as much per hour in my state than that base rate, and some states/locations are even higher, so the waiters/waitresses aren't reliant as much on tips.



I used to hear 10% to 15% for tipping for decent to good service, and these days I always hear 15% to 20% for tipping. It doesn't surprise me that someone wants to knock it up even higher so that we are covering more of the business's labor expenses.

So the meals have gone up due to high inflation, the tip % has gone up resulting in inflation on top of inflation, and the sales taxes have gone up as well, really driving up those out of pocket costs. Indeed, it's getting very expensive for the consumer.

Tip percent going up really makes no sense. It is a percentage.

 

[ivinsfan]

Tip percent going up really makes no sense. It is a percentage.

No.. the number or % that is consider a good tip has been rising I don't you think you are going find many that 10 or 15 % is a good tip...I'll wage 20% is considered standard and for great service higher,..


Most places with prefigure tips start at 18%.

 

[GenXguy]

No.. the number or % that is consider a good tip has been rising I don't you think you are going find many that 10 or 15 % is a good tip...I'll wage 20% is considered standard and for great service higher,..

Yeah, people receiving those tips want them as high as possible, whether or not it makes any sense. Instead of just keeping up with inflation due to meal price increases, they're getting ahead of it. That's the part that doesn't make sense. It's a double whammy on consumers, and that's even before factoring that sales taxes have gone up.

Who's setting these ever increasing "expected" tip percentages? At this rate, they'll be saying you should tip 30% minimum before long. Will everyone be suckers and fall for that as well?

 

[Midpack]

No surprise Boomers are the worst tippers based on the whining of some here.

Lots of other good info on tipping in the link https://www.discover.com/credit-cards/card-smarts/the-tipping-culture/

 

[rk911]

Our crowd went out at a local cafe to have lunch. For some reason the owner was our waiter. He did a good job of waiting. Normally you do not tip an owner as his compensation is in the return he makes on his investment (the operation of the eatery). DW paid our bill with a CC and I later looked to find that she left a 20% tip. I also noticed that we were charged about $1.50 for using a CC.

She was never advised by owner of the CC fee, but that's another story. My Q is, should one tip an owner who waits your table? Seems like double dipping to me.

Let the tippers and anti-tippers proceed.

we would've tipped regardless and the CC fee is irrelevent to us. our favorite pizza place started adding a CC during the pandemic. he had to lay off a LOT of his employees so i would give him a cash tip when i picked up our pizza.

 

[Stormy Kromer]

I tip everyone. Sometimes too much.

Last time I flew I slid the pilot a $20. He said "thanks'.

Owner or not, it doesn't matter. If the person helped you, you tip them.

 

[rk911]

A view many servers share…

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/restaurant-tipping-vs-higher-wage_b_5377166

for us going out to eat is less of an "experience" and more "we're hungry!". but then the "fanciest" place we frequent is Olive Garden. i generally tip $20 to the server, always in cash. i tip my barber as well even though he owns the shop.

 

[Badger]

+1

Makes sense to me.

Often at the small "mom'n'pop" Italian or Chinese or other ethnic restaurants that we go to, the server is either the owner or a family member because the family is all that works there. I never would have thought of not tipping if the owner was my server.

Likewise, I would tip the owner of a larger restaurant as well, if he was my server that day.

As for the credit card charge, well, that happens sometimes. We always pay cash so credit card fees are not an issue for us.

+1 I wouldn't have known if my server was the owner or not anyway.

I always use cash at any restaurant since I don't want my card out of my hands.

Cheers!

 

[jollystomper]

No surprise Boomers are the worst tippers based on the whining of some here.

Lots of other good info on tipping in the link https://www.discover.com/credit-cards/card-smarts/the-tipping-culture/

This survey and study comes to a different conclusion:

https://www.finder.com/america-best-and-worst-tippers

Which generation tips best?

You might see a group of 35- to 54-year-olds and assume that because they’re at the peak of their earning potential, they’re more likely to leave you a fat tip. It turns out, however, this group on average isn’t quite as generous. Of those who leave more than 18%, about 63% are between the ages of 45 to 54 and roughly 62% are ages 35 to 44.

This demographic is also most likely to leave you with bupkis, with a little more than 9% of 35- to 44-year-olds and 8% of 45- to 55-year-olds leaving no tip at all.

The best tippers? Those between the ages of 25 and 34. This age group leaves 18% or more on a check nearly 67% of the time. The next closest age group are those ages 55 to 64, which tip 18% or more some 65% of the time.

If you were to hedge your bets to avoid no tip at all, you’re better off taking the table of 55- to 64-year-olds, as only about 6% say they don’t ever leave a tip, versus 8% of 25- and 34-year-olds.

 

[Chuckanut]

The tipped minimum wage has not been raised a single penny in 31 years. Just adjusting for inflation, the $2.13 it was last raised to in 1991 would be about $4.63 today, so the wage has lost over half its value due to inflation.

If you could find 80 hours of work a week at the current tipped minimum wage and didn't take any time off, you would earn less than $1,000 a month, and less than $9,000 for the whole year.

So if you refuse to tip, then as Kork13 implied, you should not be eating out at table service restaurants.

I tip whoever served me in a full service restaurant. I consider it part of the bill. If I cant afford to tip I can't afford to eat there. Like many I resent having to tip, and prefer for them to roll up the price of service in the menu price. But, I won't stiff a worker to make that point.

Here's another reminder that the tipping wage varies by state. In my state there is no tipping wage. Servers get the same minimum wage as everybody else, plus tips. Or more if they are earning more than minimum wage, which is getting very common these days.

 

[swakyaby]

So if you refuse to tip, then as Kork13 implied, you should not be eating out at table service restaurants.

My opinion is based on my experience as a waiter many years ago in a full-service restaurant. I was paid minimum wage and depended on tip income to make a decent weekly income. But the state assumed a certain amount of tip income, and if you didn’t report a certain amount for taxes, then you were taxed based on 8% of the establishment’s gross food receipts. If a customer decided not to leave a tip for whatever reason, I still had to pay taxes on the assumed tip. I wished such customers would not come into the establishment.

 

[Music Lover]

+1 I wouldn't have known if my server was the owner or not anyway.

I always use cash at any restaurant since I don't want my card out of my hands.

Cheers!

I don't know why portable card machines are so rare in the US. I can't think of a single restaurant in Canada that doesn't use them. Yet when we travel to the US almost every time that we use a credit card we're expected to hand it to the server and let them disappear with it for several minutes.

 

[pb4uski]

+1

+2

 

[ivinsfan]

No surprise Boomers are the worst tippers based on the whining of some here.

Lots of other good info on tipping in the link https://www.discover.com/credit-cards/card-smarts/the-tipping-culture/

If my server is actually rude I'm not tipping.. how does that make someone a whiner....the flirting part is kind of weird.. I mean who flirts with baby boomers..?

 

[Music Lover]

the flirting part is kind of weird.. I mean who flirts with baby boomers..?

The beverage cart girl at the golf course does if she wants bigger tips. Some overweight 60-year old men can be fooled into thinking that the 22-year old cutie driving the cart thinks that they're special.

 

[GenXguy]

If my server is actually rude I'm not tipping.. how does that make someone a whiner....the flirting part is kind of weird.. I mean who flirts with baby boomers..?

Someone who is trying to get a big tip.... or maybe more.

 

[ERD50]

No surprise Boomers are the worst tippers based on the whining of some here.

Lots of other good info on tipping in the link https://www.discover.com/credit-cards/card-smarts/the-tipping-culture/

If my server is actually rude I'm not tipping.. how does that make someone a whiner....the flirting part is kind of weird.. I mean who flirts with baby boomers..?

Yes, the info that Midpack supplied does not support his conclusion that "Boomers are the worst tippers".

That graphic lists tipping for certain specifics, I didn't see an actual breakout on average tips per age. Those specific scenarios aren't going to cover much overall. C'mon man, how representative are those of the total? Not very, I'd say.

I guess people will see what they want to see, or whatever matches their preconceived notions. Data is important, but only if it is relevant data.

-ERD50

 

[ivinsfan]

Yes, the info that Midpack supplied does not support his conclusion that "Boomers are the worst tippers".

That graphic lists tipping for certain specifics, I didn't see an actual breakout on average tips per age. Those specific scenarios aren't going to cover much overall. C'mon man, how representative are those of the total? Not very, I'd say.

I guess people will see what they want to see, or whatever matches their preconceived notions. Data is important, but only if it is relevant data.

-ERD50

You know what I got from that info...that it's really hard to be a good server... for instance not having the reservation honored or getting the proper table has NOTHING to do with your server.

 

[ERD50]

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivinsfan View Post
the flirting part is kind of weird.. I mean who flirts with baby boomers..?

The beverage cart girl at the golf course does if she wants bigger tips. Some overweight 60-year old men can be fooled into thinking that the 22-year old cutie driving the cart thinks that they're special.

Heck, even if the 60 year old man is under no illusion at all that the girl thinks thinks they are special, and he knows they are only doing it in the hopes of a bigger tip, the old guy might still appreciate the smile and a little bit of alluring eye contact. No harm in that, is there?

Maybe the young, attractive server knows she's brightening the old guy's day just a bit, why not spread a little sunshine?

-ERD50

 

[ivinsfan]

Heck, even if the 60 year old man is under no illusion at all that the girl thinks thinks they are special, and he knows they are only doing it in the hopes of a bigger tip, the old guy might still appreciate the smile and a little bit of alluring eye contact. No harm in that, is there?

Maybe the young, attractive server knows she's brightening the old guy's day just a bit, why not spread a little sunshine?

-ERD50

Only harmful if the guy's wife is the one figuring the tip...

 

[Midpack]

Yes, the info that Midpack supplied does not support his conclusion that "Boomers are the worst tippers".

That graphic lists tipping for certain specifics, I didn't see an actual breakout on average tips per age. Those specific scenarios aren't going to cover much overall. C'mon man, how representative are those of the total? Not very, I'd say.

I guess people will see what they want to see, or whatever matches their preconceived notions. Data is important, but only if it is relevant data.

-ERD50

Yep, thank goodness no one here ever presents personal opinions or anecdotal information, including yourself, as conclusions. Good to know you will point that out arbitrarily...knock yourself out.