another school shooting

[Bigdawg]

Turns out I drive by Great Mills HS every day going to work. DW has a coworker who has kids at that HS. Early reports say 2 dead. Sad that this story keeps repeating itself every month or so.

 

[HGTVfan]

March for Life, Saturday March 24

 

[IMATERP]

Its time to make the parents jointly accountable for their children's actions. That is the only way this will stop.

 

[SheitlQueen]

When I was young, guns were less regulated and much more common. People brought their hunting rifles to school.
If guys had a disagreement, they went out to the school yard and duked it out.

What has changed that shootings at schools and other venues have become the way to settle grievances?

 

[bUU]

What has changed that shootings at schools and other venues have become the way to settle grievances?

More than we can ever hope to encapsulate in an online discussion forum. Society has been changing at faster and faster rates each decade; the overall annual impact of change on society that our children and grandchildren endure today is probably analogous to the amount of change in society we endured over ten years when we were children.

Most of the change had been good; some not. Regardless, change encumbers us with an obligation to make other changes to protect against these new downsides.

 

[EastWest Gal]

When I was young, guns were less regulated and much more common. People brought their hunting rifles to school.
If guys had a disagreement, they went out to the school yard and duked it out.

What has changed that shootings at schools and other venues have become the way to settle grievances?

Why was a hunting rifle needed at SCHOOl?? And duking it out is a stupid way to settle a disagreement.

I grew up in suburban CA. No guns. No one hunted. My dad grew up on a farm. He inherited his dad’s hunting rifle. He stored it 20 feet up on a wall in the garage until he figured out how to get rid of it. It was definitely not about politics.

My great great grandfather was murdered in his 70s.

DS is trying to get a job as a teacher. I fear for his safety.

 

[harley]

Why was a hunting rifle needed at SCHOOl??

A lot of kids went hunting before school, so their guns were in the rack in the truck. No big deal.

And duking it out is a stupid way to settle a disagreement.

It may be stupid, but for whatever reason it seemed to work. Disagreements were settled, and often with no hard feelings. I had a coach that if a couple of kids were really p.o.ed at each other would put a set of boxing gloves on them and they'd work it out. I was involved a couple of times, and it led to less hard feelings than repressing the argument did.

I grew up in suburban CA. No guns. No one hunted. My dad grew up on a farm. He inherited his dad’s hunting rifle. He stored it 20 feet up on a wall in the garage until he figured out how to get rid of it. It was definitely not about politics.

Personal choice. I'm in favor of it. And personal responsibility. I'm in favor of that too.

 

[GrayHare]

What has changed that shootings at schools and other venues have become the way to settle grievances?

I would think there are many factors. Punishment for the bullying victim who fights back (with fists), desensitization of teens to violence, and absentee parents all come to mind quickly, but the list is long.

 

[ERD50]

...

DS is trying to get a job as a teacher. I fear for his safety.

I'd be much more afraid of the car ride (or whatever transportation method he uses, including walking) to get to school (or any other job).

There are about 140,000 schools in USA. So if there were a shooting every month, and say 20 school days/month, that would be a 1 in 2.8 million chance of having a shooting at your school any given day.

And of course, there are many people per school, so the odds of being one that is injured is far, far less than that.

BLS probably has stats, I'd expect teaching to be one of the safer careers. Farmers, lumber, fishing, construction are far more dangerous, and mostly more dangerous than police and fire, which are often considered dangerous careers.

-ERD50

 

[Nemo2]

https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a32858/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414/

They can bring on a bipolar condition in a child who didn't exhibit any symptoms of such a disorder before taking stimulants. They are associated with "new or worse aggressive behavior or hostility." They can cause "new psychotic symptoms (such as hearing voices and believing things that are not true) or new manic symptoms."

6.4 MILLION CHILDREN BETWEEN THE AGES OF FOUR AND SEVENTEEN HAVE BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH ADHD. BY HIGH SCHOOL, NEARLY 20% OF ALL BOYS WILL HAVE BEEN DIAGNOSED WITH ADHD—A 37% INCREASE SINCE 2003.

"We are pathologizing boyhood," says Ned Hallo-well, a psychiatrist who has been diagnosed with ADHD himself and has cowritten two books about it, Driven to Distraction and Delivered from Distraction. "God bless the women's movement—we needed it—but what's happened is, particularly in schools where most of the teachers are women, there's been a general girlification of elementary school, where any kind of disruptive behavior is sinful. What I call the 'moral diagnosis' gets made: You're bad. Now go get a doctor and get on medication so you'll be good. And that's a real perversion of what ought to happen. Most boys are naturally more restless than most girls, and I would say that's good. But schools want these little goody-goodies who sit still and do what they're told—these robots—and that's just not who boys are."

48% OF SUBJECTS OF ONE STUDY WHO TOOK ADHD MEDICATIONS EXPERIENCED SIDE EFFECTS LIKE SLEEP PROBLEMS AND "MOOD DISTURBANCES." IN ANOTHER, 6% OF CHILDREN SUFFERED PSYCHOTIC SYMPTOMS, INCLUDING THOUGHTS OF SUICIDE.

 

[razztazz]

https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a32858/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414/

Sounds like we need to examine old emails from pharmaceutical companies. Bet a bag of donuts they knew all about this before the marketing began

 

[MRG]

Sounds like we need to examine old emails from pharmaceutical companies. Bet a bag of donuts they knew all about this before the marketing began

Ever been around people who do those types of meds?

I knew a couple of people who abused the stuff and they were plumb nuts. Irrational and bizzare behavior, my FIL was a diagnosed, untreated bipolar person, he was way easier to deal with then these folks.

A buddy did that crap, about 15 years ago I told him to call back when he was sober. I'm still waiting.

 

[Nemo2]

Sounds like we need to examine old emails from pharmaceutical companies. Bet a bag of donuts they knew all about this before the marketing began

About 15 years ago, after my late wife died, I was spending the summer at an RV park in Toronto, before heading south for the winter - close by were RV'ing friends whose home base was Toronto, and the woman's daughter sometimes dropped off the grandson for the day.

Normal kid, 6-7-8, I dunno........one day the woman said that her daughter, at the school's urging, was putting the kid on Ritalin....(because he, gasp, was behaving like a regular bored boy in class).

None of my business, but I did ask if they thought this was really necessary........of course they did...the school said so.

Sometime later I asked how it was going....."Oh, he's a lot quieter in class now".

 

[Walt34]

Why was a hunting rifle needed at SCHOOl?? And duking it out is a stupid way to settle a disagreement.

While that didn't happen where I grew up in suburbia, I had relatives in a small town in PA where it was normal to bring a rifle or shotgun to school. The kids (high school age) went hunting before or after school. It was just part of the culture there and no one saw any harm in it. Of course, no one shot up a school then either.

And as harley wrote duking it out in the school yard was a normal way to settle a dispute, and more often than not with no hard feelings later.

 

[Nemo2]

And as harley wrote duking it out in the school yard was a normal way to settle a dispute, and more often than not with no hard feelings later.

Actually, in many cases, a good fight might even bring guys to a better relationship with each other.

 

[MRG]

While that didn't happen where I grew up in suburbia, I had relatives in a small town in PA where it was normal to bring a rifle or shotgun to school. The kids (high school age) went hunting before or after school. It was just part of the culture there and no one saw any harm in it. Of course, no one shot up a school then either.

And as harley wrote duking it out in the school yard was a normal way to settle a dispute, and more often than not with no hard feelings later.

+1

I carried my shotgun in the back seat of my unlocked car. Nobody cared, the vice-principal alway had an invitation to chase birds after school with us.

Frankly the only class I ever did anything for was a Conservative eduction class. We did all kinds of activities, taxidermy comes to mind, that people would not care for today.

 

[bUU]

It may be stupid, but for whatever reason it seemed to work.

I bet it "worked" better for the physically stronger children.

 

[GravitySucks]

https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a32858/drugging-of-the-american-boy-0414/

+1. I Wonder how many of these kids were medicated at the time of the shooting or had a long term relationship with pharmaceuticals.

 

[harley]

I bet it "worked" better for the physically stronger children.

Not necessarily. I lost way more fights than I won. I was pretty small until about 10th grade. But even the unsupervised fights were more wrestling matches than slugfests. No serious injuries.

 

[copyright1997reloaded]

DS is trying to get a job as a teacher. I fear for his safety.

I teach.

Do you think having a sign that says "No guns allowed" will prevent someone from bringing a gun into my classroom and shooting me or the other students?

What it does prevent is myself or other students, some of which are very well trained ex-military and who can legally carry outside of the campus from carrying on campus and perhaps saving my life or the other students lives. It prevents law abiding people from protecting themselves because they know if they are caught with a weapon on campus they will be arrested and will never be allowed to own a weapon ever again in their life.

Wishing your son won't be in harms way because of a law doesn't make it so. This is true whether in school or at just about any other place that is protected with a sign.

 

[pb4uski]

I bet it "worked" better for the physically stronger children.

True to some extent but it also worked for the weaker... I rarely won fights and generally avoided them but where I had little choice I did fight... typically, the other guy respected that I was willing to stand up to them even if they handily won... they would sometimes even intervene on my behalf in future confrontations with others.... just the way it worked where I grew up.

Also, where/when I grew up a lot of people hunted... including me... I frequently had my shotgun or rifle and other hunting gear in my trunk to go hunting after school... kids that had pickups had a gun rack in the back window of the cab.

 

[pb4uski]

Actually, in many cases, a good fight might even bring guys to a better relationship with each other.

True in my experience.

 

[Luck_Club]

Another Theory

My wife and I have considered the impact of fatherless homes, and the possible connection to school shootings. IIRC several of the school shooters were raised in single mother house holds.

More on the pill theory:
There is a netflix special called "take your pills", which explores the rapid increase of adderall among today's youth.

 

[GravitySucks]

Actually, in many cases, a good fight might even bring guys to a better relationship with each other.

I became best friends throughout high school with a guy to whom I lost a fist fight.
It's how boys resolve things. The rules against fighting were not enforced as strongly as now. We had the safety valve of getting the steam off before it blew.

 

[MRG]

I became best friends throughout high school with a guy to whom I lost a fist fight.
It's how boys resolve things. The rules against fighting were not enforced as strongly as now. We had the safety valve of getting the steam off before it blew.

+1

I actually had a manager who used the technique on us, no we didn't fist fight!

I recall a peer and I were not seeing eye to eye in some important issues, suddenly we became joined at the hip on multiple projects and trips. Closure came right after 9/11, we were the first folks from Megacorp to fly after the tragedy. Spent a few days out of town, talking to each other. We both learned a lot.