Beating Index SP500

[Out-to-Lunch]

Anyone here actually beat SP500 return in the last 3 years? .. If so if you don't mind sharing your knowledge and choices of holding..

I am happy to pay a Financial Advisor or an Agency such as Edward Jones, Vanguard, or Fidelity if they can prove that the last 3 years they managed portfolios that actually beat the SP500.

My experience talking to these people folks are about "balance and diversify", invest not to lose... after said and done, it seems like they were suggesting us to similar index like SP500 + some less risky bonds and want 1% fee.

I have 100% of my investment in SP500 for now. I hope to retire in 2,3 years. Kids are finishing up college.

Please recommend me an agency that can have deliever such promise. Maybe I live in the fantasy land.

Enuff

May I ask why you feel you need to beat the S&P500 in order to meet your financial needs?

 

[NW-Bound]

I have been an active investor since the late 90s. The 2000 dotcom mania taught me a few lessons.

One is that nobody can beat the market every single year. You can't when the market goes crazy on a bubble mania. To beat the market, you would have to be crazier, by buying on margin!

Secondly, it takes some discipline to fight FOMO. And playing contrarian is tough when other people make money hand over fist, and you are in your corner holding the shares that people shun.

 

[DjBrown]

My experience talking to these people folks are about "balance and diversify", invest not to lose... after said and done, it seems like they were suggesting us to similar index like SP500 + some less risky bonds and want 1% fee.

I have a buddy who insisted to put 20-30% into individual Municipal Bonds. So he found advisor who for 1% did just that.

How much is now my buddy making? Assuming generous 3% yield and 7% inflation he is making -4% and paying 1% fee for for a privilege.

 

[RobbieB]

Sounds about right. Also why I have an 80-20 AA. The munis are just my rock in case something bad happens with equities.

 

[kgtest]

Anyone here actually beat SP500 return in the last 3 years? .. If so if you don't mind sharing your knowledge and choices of holding..

I am happy to pay a Financial Advisor or an Agency such as Edward Jones, Vanguard, or Fidelity if they can prove that the last 3 years they managed portfolios that actually beat the SP500.

My experience talking to these people folks are about "balance and diversify", invest not to lose... after said and done, it seems like they were suggesting us to similar index like SP500 + some less risky bonds and want 1% fee.

I have 100% of my investment in SP500 for now. I hope to retire in 2,3 years. Kids are finishing up college.

Please recommend me an agency that can have deliever such promise. Maybe I live in the fantasy land.

Enuff

I've had some decent luck beating the S&P. Unfortunately I came up just short this past year. I do it with 20% AAPL, 50% MGK, and the other 30% split between VOT and VBK. That' is how I was very, very close to beating it last year, and have beat it in the past with that mix.

 

[NW-Bound]

My entire portfolio is up 0.80% today, against the S&P at 0.28%, Dow at 0.11%, and Nasdaq at 0.23%.

I am only 70% in stock, and diversified with 115 stocks, plus some MFs. But my concentration sectors happen to do well today. Metal and mining are up, such as X, FCX, STLD, BHP, MOS, etc... Also semiconductors, such as AMAT, TSM, LRCX, KLAC, etc...

The losers today include biotech, pharma, agriculture, energy. It just happens that my hot sectors outwin my losing sectors today.

What will happen tomorrow? I dunno.

I am down -0.80% today, beating the S&P at -1.42%, the Nasdaq at -2.51%. The Dow is the winner at -0.49%.

Hey, I beat the market two days in a row, this time by losing less.

Some of my stocks manage to go up on this bad day, such as Sysco, Conagra, Tyson, Louisiana Pacific, etc...

What will happen tomorrow? Maybe I will lose more than the market for a change.

 

[Rustward]

May I ask why you feel you need to beat the S&P500 in order to meet your financial needs?

^ This . . . This is a very good question.

 

[WhenIsItTime]

May I ask why you feel you need to beat the S&P500 in order to meet your financial needs?

^ This . . . This is a very good question.

Don't let bias change the question. NEED wasn't mentioned.

'I am happy to pay a Financial Advisor or an Agency such as Edward Jones, Vanguard, or Fidelity if they can prove that the last 3 years they managed portfolios that actually beat the SP500'

I'm happy with the index myself, but was hoping we'd get to know outliers. Maybe they are over on reddit.

 

[corn18]

Don't let bias change the question. NEED wasn't mentioned.

'I am happy to pay a Financial Advisor or an Agency such as Edward Jones, Vanguard, or Fidelity if they can prove that the last 3 years they managed portfolios that actually beat the SP500'

I'm happy with the index myself, but was hoping we'd get to know outliers. Maybe they are over on reddit.

My friends hired a guy that beat the crap out of the S&P500 the first two years. And last year he lost money. But they are still up way more than the S&P500. I can post the list of stocks he bought if you are interested. But I would not go with him. He got his butt kicked last year and I want to see how he recovers after a downturn.

 

[OldShooter]

I am literally just reading off what etrade said. I don't think I have much in the way of dividends in these, but that's really not the point. Also, I'm not trying to pretend I can and/or should try to do better on my own, or that I would do more than run away from any FA who tried to make me any promises about beating the markets (lol). Initial investment here is less than 10k, 5 stocks. Just a play account.

I just thought it was a fun way to answer the OP and raised my hand. Jeesh.

Sorry, no intent to annoy. What I wanted to highlight was that "beat the S&P 500" must be interpreted to beat the total return. This tends to get deliberately ignored by the hucksters.

 

[OldShooter]

May I ask why you feel you need to beat the S&P500 in order to meet your financial needs?

^ This . . . This is a very good question.

With respect, I think you are not getting the concept of a benchmark. It really has nothing to do with what an investors financial needs might be.

Other common benchmarks include the height/weight charts for children. Parents and pediatricians use these to assess a child's development compared to its peers. Using an investment benchmark is the same thing, but IMO arguably more important, because of the many ways a portfolio is routinely battered and bashed by events and by active management.

Personally, I don't like the S&P because it is a sector benchmark -- limited to large-cap US funds. I like the All Country World Index; basically all the stocks in the world. I also have a personal benchmark that I started on 1/1/2015 with $65K in a total US index fund and $35K in a total international index fund. Total couch potato; all dividends and interest reinvested and just watch the numbers roll. By watching benchmarks I can see sector ebbs and flows as well as active management fails.

So, I'll defend the OP. The S&P may not be the best benchmark but it is pretty good. The OP's optimism is understandable too, though those hopes will be dashed. We have all been there. In my adult-ed investing class we talk about the two fundamental myths of the hucksters:

Myth 1: There are people with investment skills that enable them to consistently beat the stock market’s average performance.

Myth 2: It is possible to identify such people in advance and it is possible for retail investors to hire them.
​

 

[kgtest]

Consistently beating the markets is hard to do. To put the OPs request into context...some of Wall Street's greats legends have it that they would "beat the market for 7 years" and then retire.

My guess is because they know beating the market for 10, 15 or even longer is likely near impossible. Sure there might be a unicorn situation but to consistently beat the markets year after year, just isn't reality for 99.5% of investors.

 

[marko]

Maybe its me, but with a 15%+ average over 10 years, why even try?

Monty Hall says: "you can have 15% doing nothing or, behind door #2 you can do a lot of work and maybe do better or maybe get zonked!"

"Take the money and run" has been a motto that has served me well my whole life.

 

[WhenIsItTime]

My friends hired a guy that beat the crap out of the S&P500 the first two years. And last year he lost money. But they are still up way more than the S&P500. I can post the list of stocks he bought if you are interested. But I would not go with him. He got his butt kicked last year and I want to see how he recovers after a downturn.

Sounds like Motley Fool Stock Advisors. Good '20, bad '21.

I'm not looking for a hired picker. I have no problem with those who try and even root for them. Arguably, I do so with a portion of my AA. I hang out on this forum to restrain my desire to play with individual stocks. Please post his horses for '22 if you find out what they are. It is fun to watch.

 

[Enuff2Eat]

no hope

thanks all for your suggestions and comments...

so paying fee + taxes consequence alone is not worth it. Beating SP500 is a pipe dream. Even I am lucky to pick the right stock like Tesla in the last 3 years, nobody is foolish enough to put their entire portfolio into 1 or 2 stocks.

These advisors always come with print out view graphs and charts that seems so attractive. Also with an incredible convince sale pitch that make me want to sign the dotted line...

With that being said, I am boring and accept my boringness.. for now, just stick to SP500 index even it looks bad lately.

Enuff

 

[Stormy Kromer]

My FA hasn't. Not even close.

I have most of my investments at Vanguard now but I kept a ROTH with my old FA just as check up on how I'm doing on my own. He has me in a sleeve of individual stocks, about 70 plus a couple of International Funds and about 4% in Real Estate and cash. Looks very complicated and I think that's on purpose.

I have my investments 80% VG tax managed total stock market and 20% VG total international. I'm beating the pants off him the last 10 years, and its been every single year.

The S&P has beaten both of us.

 

[Enuff2Eat]

My FA hasn't. Not even close.

I have most of my investments at Vanguard now but I kept a ROTH with my old FA just as check up on how I'm doing on my own. He has me in a sleeve of individual stocks, about 70 plus a couple of International Funds and about 4% in Real Estate and cash. Looks very complicated and I think that's on purpose.

I have my investments 80% VG tax managed total stock market and 20% VG total international. I'm beating the pants off him the last 10 years, and its been every single year.

The S&P has beaten both of us.

Why are you so shy of saying goodbye to him? what about fee? Maybe I am lucky that I haven't sign any dotted line.

 

[Enuff2Eat]

^ This . . . This is a very good question.

Greedy, FOMO. catchup ...maybe. I don't really know.

Just wonder if FA is worth the money. They kept on calling. It seems like some people are making a "killing" so I thought the pro can do better for me as compared to index.

Enuff

 

[RunningBum]

Just wonder if FA is worth the money. They kept on calling. It seems like some people are making a "killing" so I thought the pro can do better for me as compared to index.

You should go to Vegas. I hear some stories about people winning money there, and very few stories about losses.

FAs are calling to try to get some of your money. They are first and foremost sales people.

 

[Stormy Kromer]

You are right and I know it. OMY and I am out of there.

The reason for the semi loyalty is he helped me out of a habit of bad do it yourself investing habits that weren't working 25 years ago. He helped show me the way out, but now I can do better myself.

 

[DrRoy]

Nobody can make that promise.

And if they do, they're lying.

+1.

Don't waste your money on the fees.

 

[teejayevans]

Motley Fool advertise they’ve done this. I personally wouldn’t do it this way.

 

[Badger]

I never cared for the Motley Fool or paid attention to any of their articles, blogs etc. Years ago I read a few and was not impressed.


Cheers!

 

[Freedom56]

Our condo investment in South Florida from the end of 2011 during the trough of the last Florida real estate market crash has outperformed the the S&P 500 by a longshot. The condo is up 688% since we bought it but only up 20% since 2008 when it was built and originally sold. We paid $72 per sq ft. but a unit similar to ours sold 8 months ago for $495 but does not have water views like we do. The original owner paid $410 per sq ft in 2008. There are two pending sales under contract right now and both were listed at over $600 per sq ft. The demand is extremely high for newer upscale condos in South Florida with very little inventory.

 

[Fermion]

Right now my bank account rate is beating the S&P500