J&J vs Moderna/Pfizer

[Dtail]

My brother got his first Moderna shot today. Fast and efficient process with no side effects so far.

 

[audreyh1]

The CVS online consent form gave links to the vaccine fact sheets among other things, and you were supposed to read it.

 

[ivinsfan]

The CVS online consent form gave links to the vaccine fact sheets among other things, and you were supposed to read it.

The way slots were disappearing online at my local drugstore, I probably would have signed away my firstborn without knowing it! Just kept hitting the accept button.

 

[MarieIG]

I thought this was a really good informing article about the adenovirus-vector vaccines versus the mRNA vaccines and the current challenges with blood clots. It goes through some history too which is useful for context.
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/04/mrna-vaccines-johnson-blood-clots/618594/

If I had a young daughter on BC (not that she would listen) I would steer her away from the J&J toward the Moderna or Pfizer.

 

[MarieIG]

Exactly... and only one resulted in death, and they aren't sure how much of a factor the J&J vaccine was.

Not to minimize her death, of course it's tragic... but to stop a vaccine in the middle of a pandemic for six instances out of 6.8 million?

I read between 0.3%-1.0% of women taking birth control pills develop blood clots... I don't think they'll take them off the market anytime soon.

But this does make me wonder, how many young women (already at risk for blood clots due to BC) are increasing their risk for blood clots overall due to the viral vector vaccines?

Did these only come to light because cerebral venous sinus thrombosis so unusual?

Should those with increased risk of clotting or clotting disorders be steered away from J&J towards Pfizer or Moderna?

 

[JoeWras]

I was just speaking with a sibling who won't get any shot. As I told her about my Moderna vaccine, I joked that I felt like I was part of a mind control army and was starting to do things against my will.

Silence at the other end of the line.

I thought she hung up on me... Turns out at just the wrong time my earphones came partially disconnected from the phone. So I never knew if she laughed or not. At least she wasn't so mad at me that we disconnected each other. Still, she has seen "the proof" and insists she won't get any vax.

We changed the subject to home improvement and had a loving discussion in our united feelings about the rising costs of construction or repair today.

 

[wolf]

Those 6 cases are out of 7 million.

BUT, all were women? 18 to I think 44. Very strange. And are other's
also having "blood clots", but the clots are "small" so not causing issues yet?
More study needed. Hope the "financial, greed" aspect, does not influence the
correct medical decision.

IMHO, because we have the "other" 2 vaccines, which so far, seem to be pretty safe. I would not take or recommend the J&J vaccine.

I would just wait, until, more of the P & M vaccine is available. Also,
younger people, have a much better outcome if they do catch covid.

 

[harllee]

Regarding the J&J vaccine and blood clots that affect younger women. I am sure this is being looked at--did those women take birth control pills now or in the past? Birth control pills sometimes cause blood clots.

 

[tmm99]

Regarding the J&J vaccine and blood clots that affect younger women. I am sure this is being looked at--did those women take birth control pills now or in the past? Birth control pills sometimes cause blood clots.

I heard something about that on the news pretty early on, so I went and researched and found this link. This is more detailed than what I heard on the news as the news segment just said thyroid disease, so I didn't know if it was hypo or hyperthyroid.
https://www.law360.com/articles/1375415/cdc-panel-punts-on-j-j-coronavirus-vaccine-pause

All six instances occurred in white women, none of whom had known clotting disorders. None of the women were pregnant and only one was taking oral contraceptives, Shimabukuro said. One woman had asthma, one had high blood pressure, one had hypothyroidism and three are considered obese, he added.

 

[iloveyoga]

I get my second shot of Pfizer tomorrow! Can't wait. I never thought I would be excited for a shot.

 

[gayl]

I heard something about that on the news pretty early on, so I went and researched and found this link. This is more detailed than what I heard on the news as the news segment just said thyroid disease, so I didn't know if it was hypo or hyperthyroid.
https://www.law360.com/articles/1375415/cdc-panel-punts-on-j-j-coronavirus-vaccine-pause

It says 3 are obese (BMI >30) but are the other 3 overweight (BMI 25-30)? Apparently this only affects women so why not men? Still unanswered questions

 

[audreyh1]

I get my second shot of Pfizer tomorrow! Can't wait. I never thought I would be excited for a shot.

Same here!

 

[mistermike40]

I received an email today stating my J&J vaccine (scheduled for next week) is now Pfizer. I would still much prefer the J&J, so I'll probably wait a week or two and see if they reinstate it.

 

[tmm99]

It says 3 are obese (BMI >30) but are the other 3 overweight (BMI 25-30)? Apparently this only affects women so why not men? Still unanswered questions

Nothing has been answered or understood. These are just observations.

Only a few get this blood-clotting problem out of hundreds of thousands of people, so the fact that some of those people are obese has no meaning IMHO.

If J&J is like AstraZeneca (both using viral vector technology), I have a feeling some men will get the same blood-clotting issue with J&J as well, although at a lower percentage than women.

 

[Gumby]

A question that occurs to me is: how many will have died of COVID 19 because the J&J vaccine distribution has been halted? Will it be more or less than the one person who died from blood clots, which may or may not be attributable to the vaccine? Sometimes, I think we miss the forest for the trees.

 

[Brat]

The blood clot issue is different than the typical blood clot issue. It requires different treatment.

Because it appears that all the folks adversely impacted were women of childbearing age my guess is that it is related to estrogen.

 

[Winemaker]

My 85.5 yo DM took the 2nd Pfizer shot last Thursday, no side effects other than sore arm for first day. DSister, had severe fever for 2 days after receiving her second Pfizer shot.

 

[JoeWras]

Nothing has been answered or understood. These are just observations.

Only a few get this blood-clotting problem out of hundreds of thousands of people, so the fact that some of those people are obese has no meaning IMHO.

If J&J is like AstraZeneca (both using viral vector technology), I have a feeling some men will get the same blood-clotting issue with J&J as well, although at a lower percentage than women.

I'm just guessing here... This blood clot thing is theorized to be a result of the immune system over-reacting and destroying platelets, of which the resulting debris clots into a "gunk" (a term I read from an actual doctor).

Diseases like thrombotic thrombocytopenic purpura and other auto-immune disorders have a higher incidence in women. So... Perhaps that's what we are seeing. As Brat says above, women have different hormones and enzymes which may have an effect.

 

[gayl]

Nothing has been answered or understood. These are just observations.

Only a few get this blood-clotting problem out of hundreds of thousands of people, so the fact that some of those people are obese has no meaning IMHO.

If J&J is like AstraZeneca (both using viral vector technology), I have a feeling some men will get the same blood-clotting issue with J&J as well, although at a lower percentage than women.

6 out of 6.8 million. How many would have gotten / perhaps died without the shot? (Asks someone who didn't want but did get it)

 

[tmm99]

I'm just guessing here... This blood clot thing is theorized to be a result of the immune system over-reacting and destroying platelets, of which the resulting debris clots into a "gunk" (a term I read from an actual doctor).

Diseases like thrombotic thrombocytopenic purpura and other auto-immune disorders have a higher incidence in women. So... Perhaps that's what we are seeing. As Brat says above, women have different hormones and enzymes which may have an effect.

Right, immune system over-reacting. I dont think it has anything to do with obesity or BC or any characteristics of those particular people. It only happens to a few in hundreds of thousands of people so it would be hard pressed to find the cause IMHO. I personally think percentage-wise, it is a very good safety record.

 

[Brat]

Evidently, no males or older women have suffered an adverse reaction. I think it is reasonable to limit use to those groups while medical science is figuring this out.

 

[tmm99]

Evidently, no males or older women have suffered an adverse reaction. I think it is reasonable to limit use to those groups while medical science is figuring this out.

I don't think we should limit the use of this vaccine to any group of people IMHO. The rate of incidents is so low. There are currently so many drugs on the market that cause serious problems at much higher frequencies. This vaccine could be a life-saver for some countries and people in remote areas.

 

[MarieIG]

This includes a discussion with regard to limiting the J&J vaccine, in the US, where other vaccines are available. I thought the guest (a hematologist) was quite informative.

Doctor discusses the risk/benefit analysis. BTW, I don't always appreciate the host . . .

 

[audreyh1]

I'll probably watch it, but those guys look pretty scary!!!!

 

[tmm99]

I'll probably watch it, but those guys look pretty scary!!!!

Those eyes!!