Update on Cord Cutting (Cable TV) 2017 - 2020

[statsman]

Things are not looking good for AT&T. ARS Technica reports they continue to lose subscribers https://arstechnica.com/information...mount-as-another-954000-video-customers-flee/

The article mentions HBO as one area AT&T is counting on

We get HBO through Comcast, but can’t “move over to HBO Max” because they have no agreement with any of the major STB/device makers.

Biggest concern now is AT&T is moving away from their Uverse (STB) service. If I understand correctly, AT&T is not offering Uverse to new customers, and they anticipate moving existing AT&T Uverse customers to either Direct TV or their streaming service, AT&T TV (not AT&T TV Now). How long Uverse remains active is unknown.

Looking at their AT&T TV streaming service, several channels disappear from their Uverse service, and the costs are not much different. It looks like they may be offering better On Demand options than before, but that remains to be seen.

DW is not thrilled about this. Three channels we get with AT&T Uverse U300 service are not available in their top tier AT&T TV service. Whether she wants to or not, we may be forced into streaming services for TV, unless she wants Direct TV (doubtful) or switch to our only other option, Suddenlink (really doubtful).

 

[JustVisitingThisPlanet]

The entire traditional PayTV industry is significantly losing customers. Content owners aren't helping by refusing to allow providers to give what many consumers want - themed bundles.

Many who leave for streaming are also not subscribing to streaming "LiveTV" services (YTTV, Sling, etc). That is, the increase in subs for "LiveTV" are hardly offsetting those leaving traditional PayTV. The overall model is dying.

Paying for ads is a 'so last century' model as is paying for many unwatched channels. There's a lot more granular control with SVOD/AVOD services (especially if rotating services) and traditional TV will at best hold onto sports fans as a niche until streaming services mature for sports at a reasonable rate.

 

[explanade]

Biggest concern now is AT&T is moving away from their Uverse (STB) service. If I understand correctly, AT&T is not offering Uverse to new customers, and they anticipate moving existing AT&T Uverse customers to either Direct TV or their streaming service, AT&T TV (not AT&T TV Now). How long Uverse remains active is unknown.

Looking at their AT&T TV streaming service, several channels disappear from their Uverse service, and the costs are not much different. It looks like they may be offering better On Demand options than before, but that remains to be seen.

DW is not thrilled about this. Three channels we get with AT&T Uverse U300 service are not available in their top tier AT&T TV service. Whether she wants to or not, we may be forced into streaming services for TV, unless she wants Direct TV (doubtful) or switch to our only other option, Suddenlink (really doubtful).

If they don't sell Uverse, what is their Internet strategy?

That's going to consistently bring in revenues whereas TV is much more competitive, cutthroat.

 

[Midpack]

Interesting, another headwind for cable/satellite.

 

[UnrealizedPotential]

I have noticed some countries in Europe are big on IPTV. I have not been able to find out anything about it yet. For example , I have not been able to find out what channels are offered for the price as compared with satellite or cable TV. I do see IPTV here in the USA that offer a lot of channels but the legality of it is questionable. IPTV seems to be available on roku and the firestick and other streaming devices. I wonder if it's legal in other countries. I don't have any idea, but I suspect it is simply because it seems so widespread, but again I do not know what channels are on offer for it.

I am not saying all IPTV is possibly illegal. No, not at all. But the ones where they are offering 6000 channels for approximately $25 a month seem questionable at best, and there are plenty of them out there like that.

 

[JoeWras]

Biggest concern now is AT&T is moving away from their Uverse (STB) service. If I understand correctly, AT&T is not offering Uverse to new customers, and they anticipate moving existing AT&T Uverse customers to either Direct TV or their streaming service, AT&T TV (not AT&T TV Now). How long Uverse remains active is unknown.

Correct. I'm a Uverse user and I'm able to negotiate a pretty good deal each year because I also have Spectrum and Google Fiber. That game is coming up next month. It will be interesting to see if they try to force me to AT&T TV for the deal. If so, I'm gone because I don't like their 2 year contract nonsense they are pushing on that service. My likely move would be to Google Fiber and YTTV.

If they don't sell Uverse, what is their Internet strategy?

That's going to consistently bring in revenues whereas TV is much more competitive, cutthroat.

Their marketing team is trying to scrub the name "Uverse" out of existence.

For internet, they sell three things:
- "AT&T DSL": well known technology and limitations
- "AT&T High Speed Internet": This may be VDSL, IPDSL, or even fixed wireless.
- "AT&T Fiber": Fiber to the house. Which is what I have.

The original Uverse used VDSL. Sometimes even bonded pairs.

 

[JustVisitingThisPlanet]

If so, I'm gone because I don't like their 2 year contract nonsense they are pushing on that service. My likely move would be to Google Fiber and YTTV.

What market are you in? I have Google Fiber at my KC condo and there are other Gigabit options as well. Spectrum is only $30 for 400M/30M connection, no caps - tempting. One thing I like about Google Fiber is in KC market they offer free 5M so when I'm at my Florida place, I can easily switch to 5M online when gone for months. Unfortunately they no longer offer 100M in KC, only free 5M or Gigabit.

 

[PaunchyPirate]

Speaking of not paying for ads, I just rescanned the channels on my free OTA and got about 10 new channels I didn't have before (they were added since my previous scan 4 years ago). I even get ABC and Fox now. Before it was all local stuff. Something to consider if I want to cancel cable TV and go to internet only via cable.

Last fall, a lot of stations needed to change the frequency they were broadcasting on due to some government mandate (related to freeing up signal spectrum for something else). The stations needed to invest in new equipment and the side effect was that most stations are now using stronger signals than they were before, so you're able to receive more stations. In my area, I went from getting 17 channels to getting 29, I think.

 

[JoeWras]

What market are you in? I have Google Fiber at my KC condo and there are other Gigabit options as well. Spectrum is only $30 for 400M/30M connection, no caps - tempting. One thing I like about Google Fiber is in KC market they offer free 5M so when I'm at my Florida place, I can easily switch to 5M online when gone for months. Unfortunately they no longer offer 100M in KC, only free 5M or Gigabit.

Triangle area of NC. We are very fortunate.

Not every neighborhood has the triple option, though. Google Fiber is spotty. AT&T fiber has much better coverage. Spectrum Cable is nearly 100% in the area.

When I call to negotiate, they know I have the other two options. There must be an indication on their screen. The retention agent told me he knew.

Google got rid of their 100M option here too. 1G only. I don't know about 5M.

 

[harllee]

Joe, you are very fortunate--I am also in the NC Triangle area but we only have Spectrum at my house, no ATT or Google yet. Google fiber is in some areas of my town but not in my area yet, I can't wait to get it-- I hate Spectrum--it goes out in my neighborhood frequently for no real reason.

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

Triangle area of NC. We are very fortunate.

Not every neighborhood has the triple option, though. Google Fiber is spotty. AT&T fiber has much better coverage. Spectrum Cable is nearly 100% in the area.

When I call to negotiate, they know I have the other two options. There must be an indication on their screen. The retention agent told me he knew.

Google got rid of their 100M option here too. 1G only. I don't know about 5M.

We are in a similar position in that our cable company has fiber/gig service and now the power company has installed fiber/gig as well. We are currently on a 2 year contract w/ the cable company so I am hoping to leverage our choices into getting another decent deal when that expires. It appears that the power company fiber offers 500 Mbps for $55/mo and 1G for $85/mo which is a bit cheaper than the off-plan cable.

Throw that into the mix with the space-base internet that will roll out sooner than later, we could be in a decent position as consumers. Probably not, but we can wish, right?

 

[statsman]

What market are you in? I have Google Fiber at my KC condo and there are other Gigabit options as well. Spectrum is only $30 for 400M/30M connection, no caps - tempting. One thing I like about Google Fiber is in KC market they offer free 5M so when I'm at my Florida place, I can easily switch to 5M online when gone for months. Unfortunately they no longer offer 100M in KC, only free 5M or Gigabit.

We have very little flexibility where we're at, and we are in a suburb about 25-30 miles from downtown Austin. Other than AT&T fiber, we have Suddenlink fiber (and it's brutal customer service). That's it. No cable company. Too far away for Google Fiber that's in Austin. A fair distance from many Austin "local" channels, likely to require an outside antenna.

 

[kcowan]

DQOTD: Not important, just a curiosity, may be unique to Hulu + Live or two different Roku models?

When we have two TV’s streaming the same program, they’re never completely in sync - sometimes off a couple seconds, sometimes nearly 10 seconds. We only watch the same program on two TV’s without realizing it, but they’re a little out of sync every time when we do. Just puzzling.

Streaming is the ultimate on demand service so the stream you get depends on when you initiated it. In Mexico, sometimes streams would stall and I would just go up one channel and back to restart it and always got it where I left off.

 

[Sojourner]

Interesting, another headwind for cable/satellite.

Wow... hard to believe a full 60% of people watching "TV shows" nowadays are not even watching them on a TV screen. I can't imagine routinely, happily watching a Netflix or HBO movie or series on a cramped little laptop, tablet, or phone(!) screen. I only do that when absolutely necessary, like on a long airplane flight. I guess lots of folks these days don't really care that much about a high-quality, immersive, "theater" viewing experience. Why anyone would forgo that in favor of hunching over in front of little laptop or tablet screen is beyond me... unless they can't afford it or don't really care that much about TV/movies/shows to begin with.

 

[JoeWras]

This is where I have to repost my favorite David Lynch (director) quote:

“If you’re playing the movie on a telephone, you will never in a trillion years experience the film.

“You’ll think you have experienced it, but you’ll be cheated. It’s such a sadness, that you think you’ve seen a film, on your <bleeping> telephone.

“Get real.”

The actual youtube is out there, but NSFW due to language.

 

[statsman]

This is where I have to repost my favorite David Lynch (director) quote:
The actual youtube is out there, but NSFW due to language.

I have a similar opinion about listening to well-recorded music on a small portable device or smartphone. It isn't the same. Sadly, most of the "remastered" music released the past couple of decades has been driven by the smaller devices.

 

[RunningBum]

Wow... hard to believe a full 60% of people watching "TV shows" nowadays are not even watching them on a TV screen. I can't imagine routinely, happily watching a Netflix or HBO movie or series on a cramped little laptop, tablet, or phone(!) screen. I only do that when absolutely necessary, like on a long airplane flight. I guess lots of folks these days don't really care that much about a high-quality, immersive, "theater" viewing experience. Why anyone would forgo that in favor of hunching over in front of little laptop or tablet screen is beyond me... unless they can't afford it or don't really care that much about TV/movies/shows to begin with.

I can't imagine watching on a phone at all. Once a person next to me watching a movie on a flight and holding the phone vertically, rather than horizontally where you could at least maximize the screen.

 

[GalaxyBoy]

A question for those who have Britbox.

I use an AppleTV and the Britbox app is simply awful. It doesn't work like other apps in that pressing the menu button, which usually acts as an escape key to back out of a show to the next higher level, instead exits the app entirely. Not sure if I explained that well but the point is that the app sucks and I'm tired of it not behaving like every other AppleTV app.

OTOH, Britbox is also available under the Amazon Prime app. So, I'm wondering if it's easier to use under Amazon Prime? I'd have to cancel my existing subscription directly with Britbox and resubscribe from Amazon, but if it works like everything else in Amazon then I have no problem doing that.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Buckeye]

A question for those who have Britbox.

I use an AppleTV and the Britbox app is simply awful. It doesn't work like other apps in that pressing the menu button, which usually acts as an escape key to back out of a show to the next higher level, instead exits the app entirely. Not sure if I explained that well but the point is that the app sucks and I'm tired of it not behaving like every other AppleTV app.

OTOH, Britbox is also available under the Amazon Prime app. So, I'm wondering if it's easier to use under Amazon Prime? I'd have to cancel my existing subscription directly with Britbox and resubscribe from Amazon, but if it works like everything else in Amazon then I have no problem doing that.

Thanks in advance!

We downloaded Britbox app to our LG TV with direct purchase from Britbox. The controls definitely stink and are not 'normal.' Has taken some getting used to. Make sure you always end your actions by going back to the stop/start icon. 99.9% sure purchasing through Amazon won't change the interface.

 

[Cobra9777]

A question for those who have Britbox.

I use an AppleTV and the Britbox app is simply awful. It doesn't work like other apps in that pressing the menu button, which usually acts as an escape key to back out of a show to the next higher level, instead exits the app entirely. Not sure if I explained that well but the point is that the app sucks and I'm tired of it not behaving like every other AppleTV app.

OTOH, Britbox is also available under the Amazon Prime app. So, I'm wondering if it's easier to use under Amazon Prime? I'd have to cancel my existing subscription directly with Britbox and resubscribe from Amazon, but if it works like everything else in Amazon then I have no problem doing that.

Thanks in advance!

In the past, we subscribed to BritBox via Prime add-on. There is no separate BritBox app when you go that route. It uses the Prime app and simply adds all the BritBox content. It also eliminates a separate log-in and payment since everything goes through your Amazon Prime account. With FireTV, this also integrates BritBox content into our home screen and voice search results.

We had a similar experience with CuriosityStream a few years ago. I subscribed directly with CuriosityStream and downloaded their app. The app was horrible. It did not work correctly with the remote and we kept getting logged out. Later, Amazon offered CuriosityStream as a Prime add-on channel. So we subscribed and everything worked perfectly, since it's really just like adding new content to your existing Prime app.

 

[JoeWras]

Well, tomorrow my Uverse deal expires. Reading around, it looks like my old trick of calling up and talking to retention won't work anymore, as they'll direct me to this "great deal" of ATT TV for only $65 per month which reverts to $110 in the second (required) year.

Nope, I'm not getting into any 2 year contract with fine print. They can pound sand.

Looks like I'm going to YTTV. My only major miss will be The Science Channel, but I'll live.

The next question is provider. I will likely stick with AT&T at their 300Meg plan which includes 1TB cap. I can go uncapped for another $20 and their 1G service. I'd rather not. I've had no problems streaming at 300M.

So, question to you cord cutters: is 1TB typically enough for cord cutting in a 2 person (both retired), non-gamer, non-4k, household??

We had Netflix this month and watched probably an average of 1 1/2 hours per day. Our usage was below 0.4TB. I think 1TB should be fine.

 

[JustVisitingThisPlanet]

^Discovery Plus as a separate service should be coming soon. And alternative streaming services to Science channel... CuriosityStream, Magellan, Smithsonian Channel, PBS Passport. I rotate each of those every month or two. I donated to PBS for a year of Passport but after a year they didn't kill Passport even though I didn't donate again.

For those who stream at 4K often on more than 1 TV then 1TB might not be enough, but otherwise for many it's enough. Sounds like it's good enough for you.

 

[JoeWras]

^Alternative streaming services to Science channel... CuriosityStream, Magellan, Smithsonian Channel, PBS Passport. I rotate each of those every month or two. I donated to PBS for a year of Passport but after a year they didn't kill Passport even though I didn't donate again.

For those who stream at 4K often on more than 1 TV then 1TB might not be enough, but otherwise for many it's enough. Sounds like it's good enough for you.

Thanks. Yeah, just 1 TV at a time, a few hours per day. No 4k.

 

[upupandaway]

Absolutley. We have 4 people with 4K Streaming and gaming and I stay under 1TB a month. We are considered very heavy users.

 

[Midpack]

Well, tomorrow my Uverse deal expires. Reading around, it looks like my old trick of calling up and talking to retention won't work anymore, as they'll direct me to this "great deal" of ATT TV for only $65 per month which reverts to $110 in the second (required) year.

So, question to you cord cutters: is 1TB typically enough for cord cutting in a 2 person (both retired), non-gamer, non-4k, household??

Our usage/situation is almost the same as yours - 2 retired people, non-gamer, occasional 4K and we have AT&T 1GB mbps (just switched from 300MB mbps with the 1TB cap). We cut the cord relying entirely on streaming in Feb 2018, PSV then Hulu Live. We surf and watch more TV than we should, and we're averaging about 500GB/month - our highest month ever was in the 700GB range, so the 1TB cap hasn't been an issue at all.

IIRC most major network TV is still 720p, not a lot of 1080p. There is no 4K broadcast TV, only Netflix, YouTube and the like. So it's hard for households (vs businesses) to exceed 1TB/month even with lots of usage.

And we had the same cable/satellite experience with Comcast then Dish Network. They gave us big discounts for years to keep us, then finally refused to in Jan 2018, at which time we cut the cord...

Best of luck, we have no regrets in cutting the cord. FWIW DW didn't want to fuss with ANY changes and she was very apprehensive, but she got used to PSV and then Hulu Live very easily, she's happy (thank goodness).