What can we learn from the Bob Ross estate saga?

GrayHare

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Anyone who hopes to bequeath significant assets might do well to watch the 2021 Netflix documentary about Bob Ross, known for the Joy of Painting TV series. Even if this documentary is flawed, viewers can learn from Bob's mistakes (not happy ones, this time) about what not to do, as well as how greed and mismanagement can ruin best intentions.

Apparently, via trust Bob left most of his empire in the control of his half brother, who soon after Bob's 1995 death handed over those assets to a company that now sells art items under the Bob Ross name.

The reason for this transfer was a lawsuit, few details of which are given. Though the trust allocated 51% to Bob's half brother, and 49% to Bob's son, whatever compensation the half brother received from the company was apparently not shared with Bob's son.

Bob's son, who it appears was not a trustee, is presented as not finding out what happened until some 20 years later.

The documentary breezes through important details (though you can pause on the agreement paperwork displayed) while busy vilifying the company that acquired Bob's empire.

IMO, the lack of evidence presented against this company makes this vilification feel a bit unfair. Did they exploit an unsavvy artist? In old video clips, Bob instead seems quite intelligent, not to mention as gracious as he appeared on Joy of Painting.

To me, the half brother, who declined to appear in the documentary, looks more to blame for Bob's son getting shorted. And, Bob complicated inheritance matters by marrying his nurse a few months before he died. Bob's son mentions not getting along with his father, only reconciling somewhat before Bob's death. It occurred to me maybe Bob actually didn't want his son to inherit his legacy. Bob, of course, is not around to let us know.

Items like a will are not mentioned in the documentary, so presumably the trust held most/all of Bob's assets. The takeaway is that no matter how we plan, what happens to our assets after we pass is not 100% certain. IMO, if Bob wanted him to share in the estate, Bob's son should have been named a trustee, and maybe a trust protector appointed.

The documentary left me feeling somewhat sad for what had been the Joy of Painting.
 
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(btw, apologies for the block of text, the board merges my separate paragraphs into one)
 
(btw, apologies for the block of text, the board merges my separate paragraphs into one)

I broke it up a bit where it looks like you intended with the extra spaces.
 
In old video clips, Bob instead seems quite intelligent..........Bob complicated inheritance matters by marrying his nurse a few months before he died.

There seems to be an oxymoron there.
 
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I never heard of him until earlier this year until I got an iPad Mini with an Apple Pencil I tried my hand at digital drawing. The first tutorial I followed resulted in a landscape that prompted friends to start calling me Bob Ross.
 

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donheff, that is a beautiful piece of work you did. I don't have anything to add to the topic. I can say, I didn't get to see Bob on TV much but when I did, he had my attention.
 
Just to mash up topics a bit.. with the how much TV thread. Bob Ross sounds like the perfect peaceful thing to have on in the background during the day. Maybe I can find some streaming Bob Ross and upgrade my poll response of 1hr a day! I think I'd be tempted to relax too much listening to him talking about happy trees... as I procrastinate my workout on here now!
 
The documentary left me feeling somewhat sad for what had been the Joy of Painting.

I watched this a few months ago. I remember feeling the same, sad and also a bit puzzled. As is sometimes the case in life, we'll never know the full truth of the situation, why each person did what he/she did.
 
...Maybe I can find some streaming Bob Ross and upgrade my poll response of 1hr a day! I think I'd be tempted to relax too much listening to him talking about happy trees... as I procrastinate my workout on here now!
Many streaming services offer a Bob Ross Channel - I get one one on my Samsung TV on Samsung's "TV Plus" group of channels.
 
Of Bob marrying his nurse shortly before he died, the documentary said he did so "for his family" or words to that effect, but I don't see how that could be true. The documentary reports that after Bob died, his new wife either sold or gave away recorded evidence of Bob's wishes for his estate. That material went to the company that markets under Bob's name, who supposedly then destroyed that material. This sort of stuff makes me glad I don't have mega millions for people to fight over.
 
Bob Ross enjoys a lot of popularity with Millenials, many of whom I'm sure don't even realize he died since he was so young, and since the show was in reruns for years, and is on Prime now. He became a meme in the last few years.

His image is plastered on so many tchotchkes and knick knacks... the money must still be rolling in.

Sadly, artists and creatives often fail on the business side of things.
 
After seeing this documentary, I have a few generic trust questions. The sense I got from the show is if a trust has only one trustee, that trustee controls the trust with little oversight from others or obligation to others. Question 1) If a trust when formed is allocated 51%./49% among two beneficiaries/owners, but only one of the beneficiaries is a trustee of that trust, is that trustee obligated to inform the other beneficiary of trust activity? It seems like that did not happen for the Bob Ross trust. 2) I'm fuzzy on the role of a trust protector. Had one existed (such as for the Bob Ross trust), would the protector have been obligated to review trustee activities to ensure the non-trustee beneficiaries were appropriately compensated per trust directives?
 
@donheff, happy little trees and beautiful mountains.


I read a lengthy article on the subject some time ago. I haven't seen the documentary. But if you have an asset in the trust and sell it, shouldn't 49% of those proceeds have gone to the son? Of course selling the rights away has meant no one profited after that point.


I remember when I bought my company and originally the owner wanted to only sell 49%. I realized that would create a lot of problems and thankfully he did, too. So I made him an offer he liked and own it outright.



Lesson: make sure all of your wishes are clear.


cd :O)
 
I question stories like the one mentioned here. Rarely is a story one sided and rarely is a story told accurately - even by the people involved, let alone by a 3rd party. I have discovered by personal experience that even a "news" story is typically more about the story than the facts. I wan't aware of Bob Ross, so I'll take no position on the story itself as YMMV.
 
You paint a pretty grim picture.
 
You paint a pretty grim picture.

My personal picture WAS grim. Well, the TELLING of it was grim. The actual story turned out okay after a couple of years of travail.

If you've ever seen a news story that happens to intersect with your personal expertise, you might feel the same way but YMMV.
 
I believe this called the Dunning-Krueger effect. I, too, have read newspaper or other reports about situations I was a part of or had expert knowledge and realized 50-75% of the facts and/or conclusions were incorrect. That's why it's important to realize that effect when you are reading about something in which you do not have expertise. A healthy skepticism is many times heartily recommended....
 
For whatever it might be worth, I had a Trust made recently, and the lawyer mentioned a few things that did not apply on my case, it might be valuable to some of you reading.

Remember that in your work 401k, bank accounts, etc, where you type in your “beneficiary” that name actually superceeds ANY other document, even a will or trust. The lawyer said a few times a year a client will come in that their spouse forgot to change this when they were remarried to them. Nothing can be done to fix this. It simply cannot be undone after death of the policy holder.

If you have remarried, or want to make sure a family member does not get your stuff by contesting your will trust, etc. Make a specific bequeath to them of $1. It is not a snub, it means you were not intending to give them more.
 
I never heard of him until earlier this year until I got an iPad Mini with an Apple Pencil I tried my hand at digital drawing. The first tutorial I followed resulted in a landscape that prompted friends to start calling me Bob Ross.



That’s very good!
 
You paint a pretty grim picture.


My personal picture WAS grim. Well, the TELLING of it was grim. The actual story turned out okay after a couple of years of travail.

If you've ever seen a news story that happens to intersect with your personal expertise, you might feel the same way but YMMV.
I guess I shouldn't make jokes that need to be explained.
 
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I believe this called the Dunning-Krueger effect. I, too, have read newspaper or other reports about situations I was a part of or had expert knowledge and realized 50-75% of the facts and/or conclusions were incorrect. That's why it's important to realize that effect when you are reading about something in which you do not have expertise. A healthy skepticism is many times heartily recommended....

Well said! The amazing thing is that an account can be factually correct and still leave inaccurate conclusions. Returning you now...
 
He had a trust, but no will? What kind of lawyer lets that get past them?

Anyone who hopes to bequeath significant assets might do well to watch the 2021 Netflix documentary about Bob Ross, known for the Joy of Painting TV series. Even if this documentary is flawed, viewers can learn from Bob's mistakes (not happy ones, this time) about what not to do, as well as how greed and mismanagement can ruin best intentions.

Apparently, via trust Bob left most of his empire in the control of his half brother, who soon after Bob's 1995 death handed over those assets to a company that now sells art items under the Bob Ross name.

The reason for this transfer was a lawsuit, few details of which are given. Though the trust allocated 51% to Bob's half brother, and 49% to Bob's son, whatever compensation the half brother received from the company was apparently not shared with Bob's son.

Bob's son, who it appears was not a trustee, is presented as not finding out what happened until some 20 years later.

The documentary breezes through important details (though you can pause on the agreement paperwork displayed) while busy vilifying the company that acquired Bob's empire.

IMO, the lack of evidence presented against this company makes this vilification feel a bit unfair. Did they exploit an unsavvy artist? In old video clips, Bob instead seems quite intelligent, not to mention as gracious as he appeared on Joy of Painting.

To me, the half brother, who declined to appear in the documentary, looks more to blame for Bob's son getting shorted. And, Bob complicated inheritance matters by marrying his nurse a few months before he died. Bob's son mentions not getting along with his father, only reconciling somewhat before Bob's death. It occurred to me maybe Bob actually didn't want his son to inherit his legacy. Bob, of course, is not around to let us know.

Items like a will are not mentioned in the documentary, so presumably the trust held most/all of Bob's assets. The takeaway is that no matter how we plan, what happens to our assets after we pass is not 100% certain. IMO, if Bob wanted him to share in the estate, Bob's son should have been named a trustee, and maybe a trust protector appointed.

The documentary left me feeling somewhat sad for what had been the Joy of Painting.
 
Someone manages to build an “empire”, then they die, and the whole thing becomes a toxic waste site among squabbling, less-talented and less-capable descendants. Prince, James J. Hill, Marcus Aurelius, most inherited monarchies in European history…. Energy dissolves into entropy. It’s fool’s gold to think otherwise.
 
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