Bogus Citation by Automatic Toll Road in CA

[NW-Bound]

Yesterday, I received a dunning letter from a toll road company in California. They want me to pay $2.92 with a one month deadline, or a penalty of $100 will be added on.

This is the new car I bought in Jan 2021, and has not been driven to CA. The letter says I can go on their Web site to dispute. So, I went there, and saw that there were a total of 3 citations issued to my license plate. What a crock!

So, I submitted a dispute saying the car has never been to CA. Have not heard back from them.

I think their camera vision system that read car license plates messed up, and misread some other plates as mine. Then, they tapped into a national registry, and tracked the registration to my name and home in AZ.

This shows why people are concerned about the use of computers for surveillance and to identify people by facial features. If the computer cannot read a license plate reliably, how do you trust it to recognize people's face? Or is it possible that different states happen to assign the same random 6-letter license plate to more than one car?

I wonder how often incidences like this happen.

 

[Koolau]

Reminds me of the controversies surrounding red-light cameras. Many were proven to be scams by the contractors who ran them for various municipalities. Often, apparently, the times before violation were shortened so that more folks were "caught" than should have been.

I've noticed too that there are several possible situations which could lead to a violation when none should be recorded. For instance: There is a light, close to our condo which - late at night - allows me to turn left on an arrow. The intersection is huge. If I'm the only car waiting for said arrow, the time it takes to make the actual turn (from a dead stop) is not enough to get through before I would be violated. This wouldn't happen (primarily in the day time) because with several cars actuating the transducers, everyone is already rolling when the light realizes that the last car has entered the intersection (or the light times out.) But a single car, starting from a standstill would never get through without Mario Andretti at the wheel of a more "enthusiastic" vehicle than my Toyota.

I can think of any number of times when I would be in an intersection, completing a turn when some yahoo doing twice the speed limit - coming from the opposite direction would make me rethink completion of the left turn - leaving me in the intersection to receive a violation. If a LEO saw this "infraction" he would do one of three things. First, he would NOT violate me - he would ignore the situation. Two, he might go after the speeder (1 chance in 500 of that.) Three, complete HIS turn COMPLETELY on a red light right behind me. YMMV

 

[NW-Bound]

^^^^

It is against the law to enter an intersection on a red light. If your car is already in the intersection, there's no penalty if you clear the intersection late due to waiting for a red-light runner. He himself may be entering the intersection on a yellow light, and that's not against traffic rules either.

 

[Koolau]

^^^^

It is against the law to enter an intersection on a red light. If your car is already in the intersection, there's no penalty if you clear the intersection late due to waiting for a red-light runner. He himself may be entering the intersection on a yellow light, and that's not against traffic rules either.

I'm sure you are correct as far as "entering" on red. That is clearly verboten. The issues I've seen (and don't have documentation) was not clearing the intersection before the light turned red. THAT time between green to yellow to red was what was being altered by contractors according to what I read. I could be wrong - I was once so YMMV.

 

[ivinsfan]

This happened to us with a bogus "unpaid" parking ticket in Minneapolis. Got the second notice by mail. Happened in January. Problem is it's the plate of our farm runner pickup which sits in our machine from Nov to March. Contested online saying prove it and two days later, oh nevermind. They do it the lazy way and it's up to you to complain.

 

[Popeye]

My brother bought a car last month and had it delivered from out of state. It was a one vehicle carrier truck. A couple weeks later he got a notice for a toll based off of the out of state temp tag from the turnpike people. Somehow they read the tag on the car getting the piggyback ride instead of the carrier. Lol!

He did seem to get it straightened out with a call.

 

[CardsFan]

Was in FL late April to mid-May and they have gone completely SunPass, or toll-by-plate. No toll attendants any where (Covid related I am assuming). So far, we have received one bill for one bridge for two trips. We crossed that bridge at least 6 or 8 times. And nothing so far for the other tollways.

Anyway, the bill had a clear photo of our license plate. Seems that should be required.

 

[Aerides]

Was in FL late April to mid-May and they have gone completely SunPass, or toll-by-plate. No toll attendants any where (Covid related I am assuming).

FL has been working on going this way for years now, starting in the early aughts. Toll-by-plate works well enough, but sunpass is usually a discount.

 

[CardsFan]

FL has been working on going this way for years now, starting in the early aughts. Toll-by-plate works well enough, but sunpass is usually a discount.

Oh, I know they were headed that direction, but I think Covid sped up the process. The two bridges we crossed (Cape Coral to Ft. Meyers, and Ft. Meyers to Sanibel Island) were manned the year before, and the signage was all temporary. Did not look like a planned closing of the manned booths.

BTW, we saw the same thing around Chicago in December, everything was toll by plate. No manned booths (and they were manned the last time we went through them pre-Covid. At least in FL they send you a bill. In Chicago you need to log on and pay on line, or set up an account for continued use. If you forget, then they send a bill, with a nice fine attached.

 

[MichaelB]

Oh, I know they were headed that direction, but I think Covid sped up the process. The two bridges we crossed (Cape Coral to Ft. Meyers, and Ft. Meyers to Sanibel Island) were manned the year before, and the signage was all temporary. Did not look like a planned closing of the manned booths.

As Aerides said, they’ve been phasing out for years on a pretty regular schedule. One of the drivers was a long awaited agreement with EZPass for mutual compatibility, even if it means a new device is required for SunPass users.

BTW, we saw the same thing around Chicago in December, everything was toll by plate. No manned booths (and they were manned the last time we went through them pre-Covid. At least in FL they send you a bill. In Chicago you need to log on and pay on line, or set up an account for continued use. If you forget, then they send a bill, with a nice fine attached.

Illinois toll signs clearly read “pay online”. A hassle for less internet savvy folks, but shouldn’t be a surprise. Lots more toll stations on some of the tollways in the Chicago area, so a default letter would generate lots of mail.

Might not be a bad idea, generating a bit more business for USPS.

 

[meierlde]

FL has been working on going this way for years now, starting in the early aughts. Toll-by-plate works well enough, but sunpass is usually a discount.

Note if driving to fl you can pick up a $10 sunpass tag at rest stops near tghe states borders on i 75 and I 95.

 

[ocean view]

I was in the same situation a couple of years ago. The toll charge was from the San Diego area, I live in N. California. I called the customer service number and they looked up the toll image. They could see that the car in the picture wasn’t the make and model of my car (which they had access to based on the plate #). They immediately reversed the billing and sent a statement soon after to confirm the correction. It was quick and easy to resolve.

Did you try calling? With multiple tolls, maybe your plate got added to someone’s toll tag in error?

 

[Amethyst]

The Virginia toll road authority dunned me over and over for a high-occupancy-lane violation committed, in 2010, by the driver of a car whose license plate was the same as a car I bought in 1985.

I had to sign an affidavit that it wasn't my car, and provide proof from the Maryland MVA that I had sold the car with that license number back in 1990.

It was much more trouble and time wasted than it sounds, because I had to go through levels of people to find out what to do.

When I asked the toll authority people why the citation hadn't gone to the guilty party, they shrugged (verbally). "Computer error."

Yesterday, I received a dunning letter from a toll road company in California. They want me to pay $2.92 with a one month deadline, or a penalty of $100 will be added on.

This is the new car I bought in Jan 2021, and has not been driven to CA. The letter says I can go on their Web site to dispute. So, I went there, and saw that there were a total of 3 citations issued to my license plate. What a crock!

So, I submitted a dispute saying the car has never been to CA. Have not heard back from them.

I think their camera vision system that read car license plates messed up, and misread some other plates as mine. Then, they tapped into a national registry, and tracked the registration to my name and home in AZ.

This shows why people are concerned about the use of computers for surveillance and to identify people by facial features. If the computer cannot read a license plate reliably, how do you trust it to recognize people's face? Or is it possible that different states happen to assign the same random 6-letter license plate to more than one car?

I wonder how often incidences like this happen.

 

[NW-Bound]

When I asked the toll authority people why the citation hadn't gone to the guilty party, they shrugged (verbally). "Computer error."

“To err is human but to really foul things up you need a computer.” - Paul R. Ehrlich

Unlike the irate computer user in the following video, I don't get mad at a computer because it's an inanimate object. I get mad at the people who build such a stupid system and allow it to run our life.

 

[Koolau]

We need a set of laws which puts the burden of proof on the authority which is willing to fine you or create a warrant for your arrest in their state. Never should you have to prove you didn't do something. It should be the state/municipality's responsibility to prove that you did something wrong. I'm sure it's too lucrative a (legal) scam to add a layer of protection to citizens. I can imagine a LOT of similar issues in our near future. YMMV

 

[njhowie]

Yesterday, I received a dunning letter from a toll road company in California. They want me to pay $2.92 with a one month deadline, or a penalty of $100 will be added on.

This is the new car I bought in Jan 2021, and has not been driven to CA. The letter says I can go on their Web site to dispute. So, I went there, and saw that there were a total of 3 citations issued to my license plate. What a crock!

So, I submitted a dispute saying the car has never been to CA. Have not heard back from them.

I think their camera vision system that read car license plates messed up, and misread some other plates as mine. Then, they tapped into a national registry, and tracked the registration to my name and home in AZ.

This shows why people are concerned about the use of computers for surveillance and to identify people by facial features. If the computer cannot read a license plate reliably, how do you trust it to recognize people's face? Or is it possible that different states happen to assign the same random 6-letter license plate to more than one car?

I wonder how often incidences like this happen.

Generally, if you are caught by a camera, the website, or letter you receive in the mail should also provide the photo - and it would be obvious that it's not your car. Did they not provide the photo either with the letter or on their website?


If they give you any hassle, demand that they provide the photos they have.

 

[scrabbler1]

I remember some scandals in New York City where corrupt parking agents would, to meet a quota, would create parking tickets using info they previously recorded from cars (i.e. make/model/plate). The shocked and blindsided owners of these illegally ticketed cars often paid the fines because it was cheaper to do so than to take time off from work to protest in court.

But enough owners protested and the court system and PVB figured out the racket and went after the corrupt agents.

More recently, and here on Long Island, they activated those school zone speed camera which generated lots of tickets even though it was in AUGUST (when schools are closed) and without proper signage and signals that those camera were in use. The whole program was under a cloud for a while until things got straightened out.

I got nailed by one of those cameras last August in NYC. They were allowed by the state, for some reason, to have those cameras active in AUGUST and at 6:59 AM on a Tuesday morning. Never mind the school itself was closed due to the pandemic and the fact that it was the middle of the summer. To me, that's nothing more than a money grab. I paid the $50. If I am in that area again (northeast Queens), I have a different route planned to avoid the pickpocketing camera.

 

[disneysteve]

I had an issue last fall with EZ Pass NY. I got a violation notice. It had a clear photo of the license plate and listed the license number. It wasn't mine (not even close to mine). Somehow the system mistakenly linked that plate to my name. I have no idea how that happened. I returned the notice with a note explaining that. About a month later I got a second notice with a fee tacked on. I again sent it back with a more strongly worded. note that they had the wrong person and to check the registration for that plate again. That was in November and I never heard from them again so I assume somebody actually read the note and got it straightened out.


One time years ago I got a parking ticket from Pittsburgh. Of course, I wasn't anywhere near Pittsburgh at the time and the description of the vehicle didn't match mine. I was in school at the time and had to have the Dean write a letter confirming that I was a student in attendance on the day in question 350 miles away.