So disappointed with my Honda experience

[GrayHare]

FWIW a friend had a Honda with one bad injector that made all sorts of nonsense warnings light up. The shop wamted to replace all the injectors but when he declined they replaced just one. The engine ran fine after that.

 

[cyber888]

I remember owning my first Honda Civic hatchback that was back in 1991. I bought brand new. It run pretty well. I never bought a Honda again. But I was proud of that car.

 

[38Chevy454]

I assume your car is drive by wire, meaning the throttle is connected by wire to the engine. No mechanical linkage. Most newer cars are drive by wire. It sounds like your throttle body (on engine, receives the signal) or your throttle pedal assembly (creates signal), is not working; or may be a wire connection problem. The engine idles, but no response from the pedal.

No way all four injectors failed at the same time. One failed injector makes a miss, but the engine should still run, albeit rough. Your diagnosis seems to be wrong and wasting money.

 

[CRLLS]

Tires and batteries aside, as you have said, it seems the problem lies with the dealer's service department. I wouldn't discount all Hondas for a single service department's poor diagnosis and customer service. I personally have never owned a Honda. I got turned off many years ago with Hondas when a dealer wanted premium over sticker price when everyone other brand was discounting. I considered a Honda 2 years ago but the car I was interested in was not on any dealer's site. Cars are mechanical and electrical devices. As such, they do fail. Sometimes due to poor designs, sometimes just because. It is the responsibility of the dealership's service department to properly diagnose, repair and keep the customer a satisfied customer.

Dealers are not the only option to have your car repaired. If you are otherwise pleased with the car, battery and tires aside, try an independent repair shop experieinced in Hondas.

If you choose to look for another car, I suggest looking for a different dealer that is not in the same auto group that your Honda dealer is part of. Many times, a single owner operates different brand dealerships.

 

[Midpack]

Not discounting the OPs issue, but we’ve had 5 Hondas and all have been trouble free. One had 164K miles when sold, and we have a 2019 Accord Hybrid now. That said, the Japanese carmakers aren’t doing quite as well selling as they used to, so they may be under more financial pressure nowadays. I feel the same about Volvo, they screwed me once, never again - but I won’t derail this thread with that story.

 

[Onda]

That 1.5 turbo is a dud. Fueling the oil, tiny little engine. My wife’s 2.4 Vtec on our 2007 CRV runs like an absolute top. 230,000 w/AWD and she purrs.

Honda had problems with those small overworked engines with Turbo.

If you have 2012 with 1.8L Vtec that powers up small light Civic, that engine will last 500k+ miles trouble free without any problems. I expect 2023 2.0L naturally aspirated Honda engine will do the same.

 

[DrRoy]

I think you just had bad luck and just got a lemon. We had a 2018 CRV and loved it.

 

[JoeWras]

I have a Honda Odyssey with 209k miles. It's a decent vehicle but I need to attend to things, so I read a lot of Honda forums.

The net of my reading reveals:
- Honda is still good, but surprising issues are popping up in the last 10 years
- Recent owners who do have problems are swearing off the brand which was unheard of years ago
- Things seemed to change around 2010. Pre 2010 owners should know the recent experience of reliability is a bit degraded
- Toyota seems to be winning the reliability race
- Honda dealers are almost uniformly vilified country-wide due to their arrogance and habit of upselling

Would I buy a Honda today? Yes, but I'd consider Toyota first.

 

[njhowie]

I'd stay far away from Pep Boys. The chances of them properly diagnosing it is somewhere between slim to none. Nothing but horror stories from there. I'll save the stories for another time.

I suppose it depends on the local franchise. No real issues here over the years and have used their towing service a few times...when it was significantly less expensive.

 

[BooBoo]

Where is CarGuy when you need him?

 

[aja8888]

Where is CarGuy when you need him?

LOL!

Car Guy specializes in buying horsepower.

 

[Andre1969]

Funny story about Honda reliability. Back in early 1994, I had some friends, a married couple, ask me for advice about a new car. At the time, he was driving a '78 Malibu Classic with a 305 that had well north of 200,000 miles on it. She was driving a '76 Hornet wagon with a 258, that her parents had given her. They wanted something small and economical.

Without even thinking, "Honda Civic" was the first thing that came out of my mouth. One of our mutual friends, a die-hard Mopar fan, was miffed that I hadn't recommended a Neon. They had just come out, to a lot of good press, and hadn't been out long enough for their reliability issues to be known.

Anyway, the reason I thought of the Civic is that, while a small car, it still seemed a bit larger, and more substantial, than competing small cars at the time. And, Honda did have a good reputation.

Well, that car ended up being the biggest turd they ever owned. I forget all of its issues, but do remember the a/c compressor went out, and it blew a head gasket, and by the fall of '98, they ran crying back to General Motors, and bought a Saturn S-series. I think they had gotten the Civic up to around 90,000 miles. Actually, I think the head gasket might have blown twice, and the second time was what prompted them to get rid of it.

Probably one of the few times in history that someone defected from Honda to GM!

And yes, I know that's just a sample of one, YMMV, "Past Performance Does Not Guarantee the Future," et al. Realistically, if every '94 Civic was built as bad, Honda would have gone extinct decades ago. And if every '78 Malibu had been as rugged and long-lived, GM would still be able to hold their head up proud and put the "GM Mark Of Excellence" stamp in every doorjamb.

In fact, I used to joke that the reason that Civic was such a turd was to prove me wrong, because I recommended it. Nothing more. Well, that, and my friends weren't exactly known for taking care of their cars. My guess is they treated the Civic the way they treated the Malibu, and the Hornet, and newer cars just can't take the type of abuse/neglect that your typical mid/late 70's low-tech domestic could.

 

[MBAVisionary]

I bought a new 23 Integra last year with a bunch of issues. Traded it in for a slightly used 23 certified pre owned TLX with none of those problems. Was going to swear off the brand completely but was impressed by the loaner I had for a week.

Thoroughly did my research this time around. Was worth the financial hit for the added peace of mind. Overall the quality is going down possibly due to cost cutting and rushing out products before they are thoroughly tested. I know how frustrating that can be especially with the cost of cars and repairs these days.

 

[Out of Steam]

Overall the quality is going down possibly due to cost cutting and rushing out products before they are thoroughly tested. I know how frustrating that can be especially with the cost of cars and repairs these days.

There definitely appears to have been a decline in reliability for cars designed in the past decade. I blame car companies not wanting to give up size and power to meet fuel economy requirements. I'm looking to replace my Subaru right now, and the reports on assembly quality and infotainment issues on 2020 and newer Outbacks are concerning. Because of integration of climate controls with the touchscreen, its functioning can't simply be ignored.

I've come up with a 2019-20 Honda Passport as an alternative (not driven yet), but reports on the 9 speed transmission aren't great.

I'm also having a hard time with the idea of paying 70-75% of the new list price for a four year old vehicle. Fermion mentioned the possibility of my leasing a new vehicle in another thread. Even knowing that I could run up a 10K mile overage in 3 years, it might still be an option.

 

[freedomatlast]

There definitely appears to have been a decline in reliability for cars designed in the past decade. I blame car companies not wanting to give up size and power to meet fuel economy requirements.

I agree. It's the overall complexity of vehicles that has increased. More parts and electronic systems means more opportunity for failure. Climate control systems that used to be adjusted with a cable are now stepper motors controlled by a couple of integrated computers. Many newly mandated safety systems are there to guard against inattentive drivers who can't put the cell phone down. New cars are rolling computers with thousands of components and solder joints that can go bad at any time. Combined with shop rates approaching $200/hr., and it's a whole different game than in the past.

 

[Another Reader]

I bought a new 23 Integra last year with a bunch of issues. Traded it in for a slightly used 23 certified pre owned TLX with none of those problems. Was going to swear off the brand completely but was impressed by the loaner I had for a week.

Thoroughly did my research this time around. Was worth the financial hit for the added peace of mind. Overall the quality is going down possibly due to cost cutting and rushing out products before they are thoroughly tested. I know how frustrating that can be especially with the cost of cars and repairs these days.

I don't think you should take a financial hit for the manufacturer's shortcomings. I would have used our lemon law to force them to take the car back and refund the money paid.

I have a 17 Accord and a 15 Lexus SUV. Seven and nine years old, respectively. The shortage of new cars is easing up, but I'm not likely to replace either anytime soon.

 

[Out of Steam]

I agree. It's the overall complexity of vehicles that has increased. More parts and electronic systems means more opportunity for failure. Climate control systems that used to be adjusted with a cable are now stepper motors controlled by a couple of integrated computers. Many newly mandated safety systems are there to guard against inattentive drivers who can't put the cell phone down.

I've never in my life heard of the cable-operated temperature and vent controls on a vehicle failing, only the electric blower motor.

As for safety, despite driving vehicles that approach the size of infantry troop carriers, we in the US still face a lifetime risk of traffic death exceeding 1%. While providing alternatives to driving would be a better solution than half-baked electronic systems, the chances of that happening are up there with my crossing the Atlantic by flapping my arms.

 

[JoeWras]

I agree. It's the overall complexity of vehicles that has increased. More parts and electronic systems means more opportunity for failure. Climate control systems that used to be adjusted with a cable are now stepper motors controlled by a couple of integrated computers. Many newly mandated safety systems are there to guard against inattentive drivers who can't put the cell phone down. New cars are rolling computers with thousands of components and solder joints that can go bad at any time. Combined with shop rates approaching $200/hr., and it's a whole different game than in the past.

I double agree. I miss the simplicity of my 2009 Subaru which just has a hot/cold dial blend door. It is still "by wire," but it works since it is simple, even if it is a bit slow to respond (a common problem because some grease dries out). Now if it were fully automatic, it might try to over adjust.

My automatic climate Honda does that. It can never find the temperature I set. I have to fiddle with it all the time. Probably a sensor, who knows? I looked at the circuit diagram and this 2011 was too smart for itself. It factors in the following:
- humidity
- vehicle speed
- available sun
- GPS coordinates to determine sun angle
- cabin temperature

It will even turn on the A/C when you have set it as "A/C OFF," because it knows better. Lots of complaints with it. I just turn the knob every few minutes.

Talking about complexity... The nagging issue with my Honda V6 infects the Odyssey, Pilot and Acura for a span of a few model years. It is called "VCM." VCM turns off fuel occasionally to some cylinders to increase EPA mileage by a fraction of a gallon. Over time, usually between 100k and 200k, it fouls the rings. Honda's solution is ring job. A very large percentage of cars get a misfire and that's the official solution. (Just google "honda ring job" if you doubt me.) Gone are the days of trouble free to 200k for models with this version of V6. People are mad, mad, mad.

Smart people on the internet discovered you can trick the computer by making engine management think the temperature of the coolant is about 7 degrees lower than reality with a simple resistor. This defeats the VCM from activating. Once fuel flows constantly, the firing burns off any debris on the cylinder walls and stuck rings will actually free themselves in most cases. It is really amazing.

I believe my vehicle had the misfire and that's why it was dumped on the market and me the sucker picked it up. However, I'm running with VCM defeat and have had no problems in almost 8k miles.

Here's the thing: the only official solution that Honda can acknowledge is a ring job. They can't do anything to defeat a measure that helps their CAFE numbers. But man, they are taking a hit with this in the reliability department. Their engineers have to find a different way to get better CAFE.

 

[bjorn2bwild]

Where is CarGuy when you need him?

The original poster has her answer - she is being duped.
The diagnosis of four bad fuel injectors is incompetence or outright fraud.

 

[Music Lover]

I bought a new 23 Integra last year with a bunch of issues. Traded it in for a slightly used 23 certified pre owned TLX with none of those problems. Was going to swear off the brand completely but was impressed by the loaner I had for a week.

Thoroughly did my research this time around. Was worth the financial hit for the added peace of mind. Overall the quality is going down possibly due to cost cutting and rushing out products before they are thoroughly tested. I know how frustrating that can be especially with the cost of cars and repairs these days.

I bought a used 2015 TLX in 2018. I love it and it's been completely problem free except that it eats batteries. I replaced the original battery a few months after I bought the car, then again in 2021, and then again last month.

Hopefully your '23 model doesn't have that problem.

 

[RetiredHappy]

There definitely appears to have been a decline in reliability for cars designed in the past decade. I blame car companies not wanting to give up size and power to meet fuel economy requirements. I'm looking to replace my Subaru right now, and the reports on assembly quality and infotainment issues on 2020 and newer Outbacks are concerning. Because of integration of climate controls with the touchscreen, its functioning can't simply be ignored.

I've come up with a 2019-20 Honda Passport as an alternative (not driven yet), but reports on the 9 speed transmission aren't great.

I'm also having a hard time with the idea of paying 70-75% of the new list price for a four year old vehicle. Fermion mentioned the possibility of my leasing a new vehicle in another thread. Even knowing that I could run up a 10K mile overage in 3 years, it might still be an option.

We had 3 BMWs - 328i, 330i and 540i and they were nothing but expensive trouble. They are great cars if you want to own them for only 3 years and dump them. After that, we went with 4 Subarus - 2011 Legacy, 2012 Outback, 2015 Outback, cheated on Subaru with a new 2018 Lexus 350i which was a dud and we dumped it after 10 months and lost more than $20K, and then to a 2020 Ascent. We love our Subarus. The Ascent had 2 recall items, one of which was a headache but it is now all taken care of and we are in love with Subaru all over again.

We passed our 2011 Legacy to my son when we bought the 2012 Outback, and it saved him from serious injuries when he got t-boned by a car which ran the light. The other car's front passenger had to be taken on a stretcher with a neck brace.

We had never put on more than about 30K miles on each of our Subarus but we are now on 35K miles after 4 years. I would like to wait for another 4 years and upgrade to the new Ascent, unless something else jumps out and make us cheat on Subaru again.

A long time ago, about I had owned a Honda Civic and then a Volvo, nothing special and probably won't go back to them.

 

[Onda]

We had 3 BMWs - 328i, 330i and 540i and they were nothing but expensive trouble. They are great cars if you want to own them for only 3 years and dump them.
.
.
.
A long time ago, about I had owned a Honda Civic and then a Volvo, nothing special and probably won't go back to them.

Simple low end trim Civic is the very reason why they are reliable and complex BMW is the reason why they are pieces of garbage after 100k miles.

Toyota takes it even further. They rather have few years old technology than loss of reliability. I think new Corolla may actually outlast older one.

 

[marko]

Here's an odd one: about 20 years ago I picked up a brand new Mercedes S 500. As I was driving home, the brakes failed! They were new electronic type brakes and I had to operate on emergency back up braking.

Turns out, the problem was a bad alternator. Odd how the alternator would impact braking, but it was so. But because the car was so new, they had no spare alternators anywhere...not even in Germany and said it might take six months.

But because I was a good, long time customer, buying a new car every three years, they just gave me a new car.

 

[youbet]

I had an Accord followed by a Civic and both were reliable/dependable cars that I ran up high miles on.

My son bought a new 2016 Odyssey and it's been a lemon. The electrical/computer systems fail with great regularity and all the dealer knows how to do is replace expensive modules. The latest failure caused his indicator and warning lights on the dash to flash on and off like a marquee in Vegas! One $700 module replacement later, all seems fine......... Until next time!

My 2018 Prius has had nothing but oil changes, filters and wiper blades in six years.

My 1999 F-150 is short on modern doo-dads. Mechanical gauges, five speed manual transmission, cassette player, hand-crank windows, no carpet, V8 with none of that "turbo" stuff, etc. 24 years and 154k miles of outstanding reliability. Yeah, I've changed the normal wear parts such as tires, batteries, belts, brake pads, clutch and shocks. But she's still running strong and pulls the camper like a Clydesdale. If Ford had another one sitting lost in a warehouse someplace for the past 24 years, I'd snap it up in preference to what's coming off their assembly line today.

 

[Calico]

I have a Honda Odyssey with 209k miles. It's a decent vehicle but I need to attend to things, so I read a lot of Honda forums.

The net of my reading reveals:
- Honda is still good, but surprising issues are popping up in the last 10 years
- Recent owners who do have problems are swearing off the brand which was unheard of years ago
- Things seemed to change around 2010. Pre 2010 owners should know the recent experience of reliability is a bit degraded
- Toyota seems to be winning the reliability race
- Honda dealers are almost uniformly vilified country-wide due to their arrogance and habit of upselling

Would I buy a Honda today? Yes, but I'd consider Toyota first.

I think I got in just "under the wire" for reliability when I bought my 2009 Honda Fit.

It is simple; very few electronics to deal with; only needs occasional maintenance and runs perfectly.

If I ever have to replace it (I'm 68, so it might outlast me!) I guess I'll go with a Toyota.