The Census Getting Too Personal?

[Nodak]

Nodak....what are we going to do with you? I think you just can't be persuaded at all to cooperate, can you? Singing: "He's a rebel..and he'll never, never..."
You're a pistol, kid! At least, you have the good sense to live in a fiscally healthy State...North Dakota is really in great shape (just so darn cold up there...brrrrr!).
Interesting that the cold States are the fiscally healthiest. Does this mean the warmest States where retirees are flocking are burning thru their State's supplies of money?

I'm sure the Census assumes a certain percentage of non-cooperators in their study always.

Yeah, you're right. Like I said in another thread, I'm an old hippy and definitely have a problem with authority. However, now that I'm retired, I no longer have to answer to anyone but myself.

As for the weather it is a balmy 28 degrees here today. And, if we're lucky, we might see above freezing by the middle of next week.

 

[haha]

What's the big deal about answering some simple questions?

Remember King Herod?

Ha

 

[Martha]

There isn't a big deal with answering the questions. The government is barred from using the information against you. And no one here has pointed to any evidence that it has.

Or we could skip getting the information and just pretend that we don't have issues our country needs to face.

 

[HawkeyeNFO]

The census is a requirement of the government. However, it is supposed to be just a headcount. I have no problem with that.

In 2000, a fat census lady came to my apartment and started asking questions. So of course, I asked why the government wanted all this information. Then she got mad, and said she couldfindout everything at the apartment complex leasing office (since they had all my income information anyways). I told her to go ahead and get it then, but I was done talking to her and wouldn't sign anything.

If the IRS has all my info anyways, then why does the census bureau need to ask again?

 

[Nodak]

The census is a requirement of the government. However, it is supposed to be just a headcount. I have no problem with that.

In 2000, a fat census lady came to my apartment and started asking questions. So of course, I asked why the government wanted all this information. Then she got mad, and said she couldfindout everything at the apartment complex leasing office (since they had all my income information anyways). I told her to go ahead and get it then, but I was done talking to her and wouldn't sign anything.

If the IRS has all my info anyways, then why does the census bureau need to ask again?

Agreed, a headcount is all they need for the apportionment of the House of Representatives; that is the constitutional purpose of the census.

Incidentally, North Dakota legislature also meets only once every two years and for about a 6 month period. It keeps their wages down and discourages them from making a living being a politician. I have thought for many years that the installation of air conditioning in the Houses of Congress in Washington was an avoidable tragedy. Without it they may have gone home part of the year.

 

[mickeyd]

Remember King Herod?

Ha

Wasn't he the one that said~ "It's good to be the king?"

 

[Orchidflower]

Remember King Herod?

Ha

Ha: You will have to enlighten me as to Herod said.

 

[eridanus]

The did not say count how many chickens you have, or slaves, or automobiles. All of that came later.

The first US census, soon after independence and the founding of the US, did in fact include how many slaves you owned.

 

[Fireup2020]

As a graduate student doing misc. research, I appreciate the results of previous censuses. Working for the Dept. of Labor has made me appreciate the effect of statistics on funding various programs (some I am not so fond of, but...) The IRS can't give your info to the census bureau - we all know gummint agencies DO NOT speak to each other - this way they have to duplicate each other's work! Please just answer the dang questions - it only happens once every ten years!

 

[travelover]

Most of what I know of my family history is from reading old census data. So to that extent, I appreciate that they asked more than are you alive?

 

[Nodak]

Filled out my census form today. I must admit it was a fair requirement. Name, age. race, number of people living in the house, and whether residence is owned or rented. All acceptable questions. very unlike the form I received 10 years ago that wanted income and a lot of other things not associated with a census.

 

[Westernskies]

They can have this information when they pry it from my cold, dead, hands...

 

[samclem]

I intend to answer all questions except #8 (re: Hispanic origin) and #9 (re race). I'll either leave these blank and wait for a visit from the [-]streetwalker [/-]census taker or I'll supply a non-answer (race: Human.). I'm fundamentally against feeding the existing racial spoils game.

The Constitution calls for the census to enumerate the people, nothing more.

 

[Westernskies]

I intend to answer all questions except #8 (re: Hispanic origin) and #9 (re race). I'll either leave these blank and wait for a visit from the [-]streetwalker [/-]census taker or I'll supply a non-answer (race: Human.). I'm fundamentally against feeding the existing racial spoils game.

The Constitution calls for the census to enumerate the people, nothing more.

Sam, might be more fun to tell the census-taker that you really don't know what race you are and then ask them "what do I look like to you?"

 

[haha]

What is acceptable about asking your race? Why does the government need to know? Aren't we supposed to be living in a race blind society?

My former wife was not white, but always refused to answer this question because she felt that at anytime the wind might change her answer might be used against her. In fact it likely would have gotten her extra credit, but she did not see it that way.

I haven't answered anything in years. Eventually they get tired of dealing with problem cases and quit coming around

Ha

 

[Nodak]

Alright, How about this? Personally, I didn't have a problem with this decade's form. In 1990 and 2000 I wrote MYOB on many questions. If you have a problem with this years questions don't answer them.

 

[SarahW]

They can have this information when they pry it from my cold, dead, hands...

You're such a rebel.

 

[ERD50]

I know we've got a few threads running on the census - but these comments seemed closest to what I was wondering about regarding the race questions.

I am hopeful that providing the requested information will allow the government to have accurate data regarding the characteristics of our population so they can make rational decisions on matters of public policy.

Or we could skip getting the information and just pretend that we don't have issues our country needs to face.

Yes, there are issues our country needs to face - But when I look at the questions, I'm having trouble understanding what rational decisions would be made from this. They have check boxes for such specific categories - Mexican, Chicano, Puerto Rican, Cuban, Filipino, Vietnamese, Samoan, and about a dozen others. What exactly do they do with that?

And, why no breakdown of 'white'? A Serb is the same as a Croatian as a German as a Ukrainian?

I'm all for helping people who need it. But are the needs of a disadvantaged kid somehow less important because his grandparents lived in Hamburg instead of Guatemala?

Conversely, in the workplace I've had to compete for raises and promotions with some people who could check some of those boxes, and sometimes they 'beat me', fair and square. They don't need help. But it doesn't ask if you are a successful minority, just a minority. That just strikes me as very condescending.

What is acceptable about asking your race? Why does the government need to know? Aren't we supposed to be living in a race blind society?

Exactly - so why aren't we identifying needs regardless of race?

Now, I can imagine that a school could need to tailor its language programs to the needs of the student population. But race doesn't tell you that, as there are plenty of people of race X in some parts of the country speaking English at (or beyond) their grade level. You need to identify the number of students who need help with a background in languages A, B , C, etc. A census doesn't tell you that.

So are there good uses for this info?


-ERD50

 

[samclem]

So are there good uses for this info?

I don't think so. If people keep voluntarily supplying this information, the few remaining hangers-on will keep our national dialogue stuck in 1965. So, I provided nothing useful on my census form regarding race. Because there's nothing useful to say.

I'm hoping a lot of folks write in "I don't know, but I look like this" and then draw in a stick figure so the bean-counters can make their own racial classification.

 

[kyounge1956]

What is acceptable about asking your race? Why does the government need to know? Aren't we supposed to be living in a race blind society?(snip)

Ha

So are there good uses for this info?


-ERD50

Maybe we are "supposed to be" living in a race-blind society, but I don't believe for a minute that we actually are. I prefer the term "race-neutral" to "race-blind"—race-neutral meaning a society which acknowledges that its members come from different racial/ethnic backgrounds but doesn't determine which opportunities are open to each individual based on their origin. When all the ethnic groups in the US have the same median income, the same rate of poverty, the same life expectancy and infant mortality and so on, I think that would show a society that was at least well on the way to being race-neutral.

In the meantime, a good use for race data in the census IMO, would be to determine how close we are to race-neutrality, and which direction we are going. Are we getting closer to it or further away? To me, refusing to provide racial data is a sort of denial. It's claiming "as a society, we've already arrived, racism has been completely eliminated, so we don't have to talk about it or do anything about it any more". I can take you to a bus stop not two blocks from my house and prove that ain't true.

 

[Glo]

We received the census form yesterday; I filled it out and mailed it back. No big deal.

 

[samclem]

It's claiming "as a society, we've already arrived, racism has been completely eliminated, so we don't have to talk about it or do anything about it any more". I can take you to a bus stop not two blocks from my house and prove that ain't true.

Yes, I think in many respects we have arrived. There are absolutely no more legal barriers or restrictions based on race. The only place current laws mention race is in the very unfortunate racial references in some programs that are only serving to perpetuate racism.

Now, that's not to say that there are no bigots and racists out there. It appears to me that white racists are, to a large degree, older people, so that problem may be on its way out. I don't know if the same situation (more racial tolerance and "color blindness" among the young than among the old) exists in black communities, I think perhaps it does not. If true, that's unfortunate, and will set us back decades.

Our big cultural "divide" now is along the wealth axis, not among racial groups. Poor black people have fewer opportunities almost exclusively because they are poor, not because they are black. If we can concentrate on the right problem and not get distracted by skin tone, we'll be on the right track.

 

[dlhanson]

Sent our census form in. Filled in number of people and age -- put lines through anything doing with race (we are a racially mixed family and we're not telling Obama) -- and didn't include birthdates or phone number.

 

[Bestwifeever]

There are some health issues that affect specific races (as we've unfortutely recently learned in our own extended family), so there is that difference among races beyond income and education. And I believe other entities use census data in planning, so knowing population statistical breakdowns would be useful for them. But that's me.

 

[mickeyd]

I completed it today (as the mysterious #1). DW opted for #2. It seemed that the few questions that they asked sure did concentrate on race quite a bit. Seems like a Q about Internet, or home computer, or # of TVs would have been more informative.

Can't wait for 72 years (when 2010 census info is released) to see my name in print.