Full name disclosure rule?

[retire to nature]

I have been troubling with my city. While I was talking a city officer, I felt his professionalism is not good, and the conversation ended without getting his name. In the conversation, I revealed what was wrong which is manipulation of the law. in the municipal law, says fowl, but animal permit application was no rooster. 4 pet including fowl/household, can be 4 roosters, but in the permit application only hens in written. Also, in the attachment, it was missing part which I can applied my self exclusion for the requirement.

After researches, I wanted to know his name, health dept because I couldnt find it in the city website. At that time, the website was not much updated, so I was just thinking lack of workers these days.

I called HR to ask his full name and official title, HR worker said she cant tell, and I need to call to the dept.

I called the health dept, the receptionist refused to tell and transferred to his phone. They sit together in a open office. no answer, no answering machine, just disconnected. I called again, and explained to the receptionist, she didnt tell he was out of office or anything and just transferred again and the same thing happened.

I thought just one slacker worker attitude, but after the court for the tickets, I felt this city is all like this.

Now I see public worker officer names is not revealed the letter sent me for another ticket which I didnt do anything wrong. I put woodchip as ground cover, and they think I need to get rid of it as mulch.

Now I cant see any health dept part, no click anywhere to reach health dept.
First letter for the woodchip showed his full name, but the final notice letter, it is just initial.

While I was working as nurse, I know some ER nurse didnt want to reveal the full name on their badge, so they taped to hide.

I dont keep up with news, is there anything I miss any regulation has been started?

 

[pacergal]

If his full name was on the first letter, refer back to it, unless you tossed it.
Even if you don't have his full name, you can still write a complaint letter including the date and your name/address. The city can investigate and will find out all involved.
Although I am not sure what you are complaining about?
It sounds like the city does not accept wood chips as mulch?

It looks like the animal permit says only hens, no roosters, allowed, even if "fowl" are allowed, they have refined the law to say no roosters.
You have asked this type of question before. Do you still have your rooster?

 

[PaunchyPirate]

I doubt there is any new regulations about employee name disclosure. But I, for one, would want my name protected/hidden as much as possible if I were working in a city compliance department. The world is now full of lots of people who would do harm to individuals if they do not like what is happening. Employers have a right to protect their employees. Write letters to the department itself with your issues. Let the city department figure out how to respond to it.

 

[retire to nature]

I doubt there is any new regulations about employee name disclosure. But I, for one, would want my name protected/hidden as much as possible if I were working in a city compliance department. The world is now full of lots of people who would do harm to individuals if they do not like what is happening. Employers have a right to protect their employees. Write letters to the department itself with your issues. Let the city department figure out how to respond to it.

I understand that feeling. I even have written here how to delete my name in internet search.

But, in my common sense, government officer name should be revealed. I was wondering if I was missing anything.

 

[Sunset]

I understand that feeling. I even have written here how to delete my name in internet search.

But, in my common sense, government officer name should be revealed. I was wondering if I was missing anything.

Why, so people can send them death threats ? That is what happens. Besides for many businesses, you get handed off to another person at some point.

I think they should give first name or Employee ID/badge number at most.

Seems like you and the city are having a disagreement, you can continue to fight, dig in your heels, just be aware it gets expensive and sucks up a lot of your time.

Frankly keeping Roosters is a Fowl Action

 

[retire to nature]

If his full name was on the first letter, refer back to it, unless you tossed it.
Even if you don't have his full name, you can still write a complaint letter including the date and your name/address. The city can investigate and will find out all involved.
Although I am not sure what you are complaining about?
It sounds like the city does not accept wood chips as mulch?

It looks like the animal permit says only hens, no roosters, allowed, even if "fowl" are allowed, they have refined the law to say no roosters.
You have asked this type of question before. Do you still have your rooster?

I am not sure how I can complain the city officer. When I called HR she thought I was complaining about police officer. So I said he is not a police officer.

So what I found was, the city offer a form to complain polices but no route to complain other officers like I even couldn't get the slacker officer name.

Everything is emails so I have the second officer's full name.

So I wrote about right to farm act law and was asking if the law can refine like that by their own. I was doubting if I am wrong, but I feel it was seriously wrong by how they are reacting to me.

[mod edit]

initial inspection was woodchip in hill shape, now it is spread to flat. I was tired of mowing and I am from CA so I knew option to change stone or chip etc.

 

[RetiredAndLovingIt]

I agree that they should not have to give their full name, too many crazy people out there these days and they may be very concerned about you since you keep arguing with them and trying to find a way around the rules.

 

[retire to nature]

Why, so people can send them death threats ? That is what happens. Besides for many businesses, you get handed off to another person at some point.

I think they should give first name or Employee ID/badge number at most.

Seems like you and the city are having a disagreement, you can continue to fight, dig in your heels, just be aware it gets expensive and sucks up a lot of your time.

Frankly keeping Roosters is a Fowl Action

So I understand people dont like rooster or any disagreement.

my point was since there was a form to complain about polices, and due to the existence, i think policemans behave better. In my tickets, one is from policeman, who behaved explain about ticket and introduced him etc.

But the woodchip letter officer wrote 1. wood chip and 2. tarp. no section number for the law or anything. The wood chip was hill shape in initial now flat. Since I have been reading the municipal law, there was no section anything about tarp, so I asked him which section number I have to refer. no response. he is talking about my greenhouse cover for hoop shape greenhouse.

after final notice letter, I emailed him back, with the section number and content about ground cover. and asked tarp part again. no response.

I called left a voice msg, no call back.

I am the one working more official way to provide to match the law here.

now the city is helping to hide their identity more and support this way since I cant reach thru online city website. And I know another house has hoop greenhouse too, but no issue. I see many house violation etc. also know rooster house in same district, but no issue.

I feel like they are gang up to threaten me but no route to complain. and the whole city act like that.

 

[retire to nature]

I agree that they should not have to give their full name, too many crazy people out there these days and they may be very concerned about you since you keep arguing with them and trying to find a way around the rules.

So I am appealing my cases, and the lawyer said there is a fight to win. they now deny my farmland registered to USDA. City doesnt allow farming in r-1 zone. But county and in general farming is allowed in R-1 zone. They missed to type the farming part because they allow hens.

also even the judge was showing unprofessionalism by defemination speak out how she think about me etc. She didnt believe my USDA farm paper because it said St. Louis City which means the branch of Urban farming office in St. Louis City covers my house. But since here city, county, municipal city etc, I can see she can confuse that way. But I explained why it was written that way but she didnt believed. And she spoke out in front of other people I think whatever I want to see. That was what she was doing because I talked a lawyer yesterday and could win because the city law is so vaguely written.

Yes there is crazy people, And I think I thought the wokers idiots, but I dont speak out in front of related cased of other people.

 

[RetiredAndLovingIt]

Nope, you absolutely can't move to another state and think California rules should apply.
Instead of giving them grief all the time, stop being hostile and try a change of attitude.
Remember the saying, you'll catch more files with honey than vinegar.

 

[retire to nature]

Nope, you absolutely can't move to another state and think California rules should apply.
Instead of giving them grief all the time, stop being hostile and try a change of attitude.
Remember the saying, you'll catch more files with honey than vinegar.

No I didnt apply CA rule. I meant i knew it can to converted to different way because CA discourage lawn due to drought.

I am investor thru out here, city, county, municipal city, even IL. So I read their law section and check.

This is what I emailed him back.

Thank you for your hard work.
However, the complaint of wood chip is not violating anything. according to section 405.204 #2 .
Any part of a lot not used for buildings or other structures, parking, loading or access ways shall be landscaped with grass, ground cover, trees, shrubs and pedestrian walks. For the purpose of this Section, "ground cover" shall mean any combination of low plants that cover the ground, grass, wood chips, bark mulch, crushed stone or similar landscaping material. Ground cover shall be in a minimum of two (2) inches in depth.

Also, I have requested you about the tarp part which is located in the section and you never provided it.
Like I mentioned before, I have been reading the municipal law, but I couldn't find anything wrong with the tarp part.

 

[RetiredAndLovingIt]

A lawyer will be happy to take your money but he certainly won't guarantee that you will win your case. Good luck.

 

[Gumby]

There are 91 municipalities in St. Louis County and, from what I recall, they jealously guard their own municipal prerogatives, so you need to make sure you are dealing with the proper people. If you live in Hazelwood or Ferguson, for example, then their rules apply, not the ones from St. Louis City proper. And while some Saint Louis County rules may apply to your property, St. Louis City is entirely independent of any county.

It's a confusing system.

 

[retire to nature]

A lawyer will be happy to take your money but he certainly won't guarantee that you will win your case. Good luck.

As a solo multimillionaire, I am willing to pay for whatever cost for my dignity. And the lawyer I talked yday said I can use motion to sanction, which they can pay me the cost.

 

[retire to nature]

There are 91 municipalities in St. Louis County and, from what I recall, they jealously guard their own municipal prerogatives, so you need to make sure you are dealing with the proper people. If you live in Hazelwood or Ferguson, for example, then their rules apply, not the ones from St. Louis City proper. And while some Saint Louis County rules may apply to your property, St. Louis City is entirely independent of any county.

It's a confusing system.

I live in Florissant. Florissant is two section by managed by city and county. Mine is city.

I have seen Florissant is best city to retire in many place. I didnt have a problem to recommend my city until now.

But well, I will recommend to stay out of city system.

 

[CPFMC]

Look it up under state law, city code, or city policy.

They are at the “tell it to the judge” stage with you it sounds like. Likely everyone there knows your name, and the issues going on, and they are unlikely to be to too helpful at this stage.

You most likely will blow a lot of money, make a lawyer’s car payments, and still lose in the end, unless you absolutely are correct. I seriously doubt the city will end up paying your legal fees, even if they lose the case. Your neighbors will probably call them when you continue to violate city codes, and it will just be miserable. So my advice is to quit digging in your heels, be a good neighbor, come to some kind of resolution that makes them happy and that you can live with, before you spend a lot of money fighting over a rooster.

If someone was unprofessional, feel free to complain, you have the info required for that, you don’t need their full name. Also- “I don’t like the answers I got” is not unprofessional, so if that was the issue save your breath…

 

[retire to nature]

Look it up under state law, city code, or city policy.

They are at the “tell it to the judge” stage with you it sounds like. Likely everyone there knows your name, and the issues going on, and they are unlikely to be to too helpful at this stage.

You most likely will blow a lot of money, make a lawyer’s car payments, and still lose in the end, unless you absolutely are correct. I seriously doubt the city will end up paying your legal fees, even if they lose the case. Your neighbors will probably call them when you continue to violate city codes, and it will just be miserable. So my advice is to quit digging in your heels, be a good neighbor, come to some kind of resolution that makes them happy and that you can live with, before you spend a lot of money fighting over a rooster.

If someone was unprofessional, feel free to complain, you have the info required for that, you don’t need their full name. Also- “I don’t like the answers I got” is not unprofessional, so if that was the issue save your breath…

thank you for advice.

One of my friend got freaked out first like the reactions in here. But he found out as soon as he stepped in my yard he said he felt like in rural area and so relaxed.

Currently, my neighbors are feeling same thing. I asked today again, if my rooster is bothering too much. But he said "no not at all, actually it is kind nice to hear."

It is not just for rooster.

Yes, it is myself problem I just can't let go off absurd. Also, I was thinking my previous experience is causing this more complicated.

My divorce was because my ex lent 350k to his parent without my agreement. his parent needed the money to buy a house. We sold our condo about 500k and moved into a backyard unit for temporary until find good place. it was a single family house with extra 1 bed room unit in backyard. We sold the condo because I wanted to garden. And the previous owner of the house was gardener too, so the soil was so wonderful.
the parent wanted to retire and move to LV or retirement place. So I suggested I want to buy the house. So they agreed at 650k verbally. And his step father brought realtor with customer and said they want 750k.
So I got upset and didnt want to buy and won't lend money for them to buy house either. So while with the heat, my ex lent the money because they had to pay their money on new house.
When his real father passed away under my hospice care, he left everything to him because he was only child and he was divorced. And later his mom jumped in said her name was on the title and she took it. So I knew what kind of people they were. in my 2nd month of marriage, they asked if they can get a loan on our names etc. endless.
I didnt like them at all, but I didnt say anything because the money was not mine anyway. But in the heat, I insisted that that was community asset need my permission. But he did without anyway. And since I lived with them parent in main unit, and we were in back unit and I didnt have any family either. So they treated me why cant accept it, you are bad girl. they didnt care my feeling at all. I walked away from the marriage took rest of cash and all of stock, and his retirement money. so he became broke literally.

Also, the bully at last work was same thing. reported to upper position, resolution was he was working there long time, I need to just accept it.

Now you guys think I just have to accept it.

Yes, I have accepted it a few things, but feeling was not good. those thing can cause depression or chronic pain etc.

My born to be personality is too. I was a whistle blower too.

So I will appeal definitely with or without lawyer. I dont mind spend money on this at all.

The policeman told me no rooster rule, and other officer. but it was wrong, but they got used to do without checking.

Farming in my city should be allowed because it havent been prohibited. And allowing or set it up farm is issued by usda.

With the free advice, she looked up municipal law and said chance to win. If they dont pay me back, it is fine.

After FIRE, money ethic has been changed too. Me is more important than money.

 

[Gumby]

I live in Florissant. Florissant is two section by managed by city and county. Mine is city....

Then this seems to be the municipal ordinance applicable to your situation. https://ecode360.com/28079898

I see the exception for four of the "usual domestic animal or fowl such as the usual children's pets..." in Section 205.360.A However, I am not sure that such exception applies to chickens, since the prior section, Section 205.350, lists "chickens" separately from "other domestic animals, fowls or bees". Which suggests to me that the city considers the "domestic animal or fowl" exception of Sec. 360 to apply only to cats, dog, hamsters, guinea pigs, parrots, parakeets and things like that, which typically live in the house (which is why they are referred to as "domestic), and that it is not intended to cover the keeping of chickens as pets.

It is not a particularly well written law, but I could envision a court finding that the city's interpretation is not unreasonable, arbitrary or capricious.

I don't see any prohibition on keeping roosters, but I do see that you need the written consent of the majority of your abutting neighbors, who may not want you to have roosters. I would not object to roosters, but I bet that many people would. You could challenge the City in court over its ordinance, but wouldn't it be easier just to keep only hens? You can always get new chicks at the Tractor Supply store, so you don't really need to have a rooster.

Anyway, I wish you success in getting your henhouse up and running. Nothing is better than fresh eggs from your own flock.

 

[gauss]

I understand that feeling. I even have written here how to delete my name in internet search.

But, in my common sense, government officer name should be revealed. I was wondering if I was missing anything.

Perhaps the elected officials are fully named and accountable to the voters.

The employees in theory would be accountable to the elected officials and perhaps protected form the general public.

Perhaps you could raise your concerns with one of your elected officials?

-gauss

 

[retire to nature]

Perhaps the elected officials are fully named and accountable to the voters.

The employees in theory would be accountable to the elected officials and perhaps protected form the general public.

Perhaps you could raise your concerns with one of your elected officials?

-gauss

I am planning to write to the Senator about all this stuff. it is discrimination too because I know more than 4 pets and same kind greenhouse etc.

 

[retire to nature]

Then this seems to be the municipal ordinance applicable to your situation. https://ecode360.com/28079898

I see the exception for four of the "usual domestic animal or fowl such as the usual children's pets..." in Section 205.360.A However, I am not sure that such exception applies to chickens, since the prior section, Section 205.350, lists "chickens" separately from "other domestic animals, fowls or bees". Which suggests to me that the city considers the "domestic animal or fowl" exception of Sec. 360 to apply only to cats, dog, hamsters, guinea pigs, parrots, parakeets and things like that, which typically live in the house (which is why they are referred to as "domestic), and that it is not intended to cover the keeping of chickens as pets.

It is not a particularly well written law, but I could envision a court finding that the city's interpretation is not unreasonable, arbitrary or capricious.

I don't see any prohibition on keeping roosters, but I do see that you need the written consent of the majority of your abutting neighbors, who may not want you to have roosters. I would not object to roosters, but I bet that many people would. You could challenge the City in court over its ordinance, but wouldn't it be easier just to keep only hens? You can always get new chicks at the Tractor Supply store, so you don't really need to have a rooster.

Anyway, I wish you success in getting your henhouse up and running. Nothing is better than fresh eggs from your own flock.

Thank you for taking time to check the law. they sent me the attachment with 350 and 360. but there is 370 part.

Provisions set out in Sections 205.350 and 205.360 shall not apply to any premises within the City which is used for and as a farm.

This sentence is to meet the law called the Right to Farm Act.

Right to farm laws in the United States deny nuisance lawsuits against farmers who use accepted and standard farming practices and have been in prior operation even if these practices harm or bother adjacent property owners or the general public. Agricultural nuisances may include noise, odors, visual clutter and dangerous structures. All 50 states have some form of Right to Farm law.

I see thruout in the city law, the farm act applied such as if farm tractor use or farming use etc.

It is not just a rooster or not. I am farming to practice to be self sufficiency in rural area. Then I wanted to learn rooster too.

And mainly my move here is more activist mind set to support farming more and reserve land.

I use bamboo post for tree post but I put it as hawk prevention so it is working. but for the law higher than 6' can be trouble too, etc. city doesnt allow compost etc.

So if I cant win, they can make more trouble. they are even trying to ticket me for greenhouse cover but cant provide the section number?

Florissant is high unemployment rate, ppl are just sitting and the city doesnt allow farming?

 

[Gumby]

Thank you for taking time to check the law. they sent me the attachment with 350 and 360. but there is 370 part.

Provisions set out in Sections 205.350 and 205.360 shall not apply to any premises within the City which is used for and as a farm.

This sentence is to meet the law called the Right to Farm Act.

Right to farm laws in the United States deny nuisance lawsuits against farmers who use accepted and standard farming practices and have been in prior operation even if these practices harm or bother adjacent property owners or the general public. Agricultural nuisances may include noise, odors, visual clutter and dangerous structures. All 50 states have some form of Right to Farm law.

I see thruout in the city law, the farm act applied such as if farm tractor use or farming use etc.

It is not just a rooster or not. I am farming to practice to be self sufficiency in rural area. Then I wanted to learn rooster too.
...

Was your land a farm before you bought it? That would seem to be a crucial factor to meeting the highlighted provision above.

 

[retire to nature]

Was your land a farm before you bought it? That would seem to be a crucial factor to meeting the highlighted provision above.

no i did after bought. but I see the sentence to include more forgiven. there is new law to pass. it is called Freedom to Farm Act. So farming is more encouraged to expand the forgiven more.

 

[Music Lover]

As a solo multimillionaire, I am willing to pay for whatever cost for my dignity. And the lawyer I talked yday said I can use motion to sanction, which they can pay me the cost.

You're a multi-millionaire, your name is "retire to nature" but you want to farm in the city and you're willing to sue anyone who gets in the way?

Move to the country if you want noisy roosters.

 

[retire to nature]

You're a multi-millionaire, your name is "retire to nature" but you want to farm in the city and you're willing to sue anyone who gets in the way?

Move to the country if you want noisy roosters.

My dog has brain tumor, and becoming blind, but still fine to pee and poo outside with a little help because he is familiar with this house. He never want to do inside. And we walk the park next my house. He knows the route without problem. I dont want to move right now.

Mainly I need to sell my airbnb first, and that is my goal for this year. cant sell more than one per year because it is stressful. after that, may be management company for the rest etc. but I cant it right now.