Acid Reflux and Baking Soda

[Amethyst]

No doubt, a chemist could tell you. But how do you know the GERD trigger is acidity? Maybe it is the caffeine or the alcohol. Or something else entirely.

But my hope with this thread was that a chemist would tell me how much sodium bicarbonate neutralizes a cup of coffee or a glass of beer.

 

[joeea]

Don't play around with persistent acid reflux. It's one of the causes of esophogeal cancer.

Talk with your medical professional.

 

[marko]

Current trick: Only drink a little bit with a meal. Even water will cause problems if I drink 12+ ounces.

I do this. My theory is that the water makes it harder for the acid to digest the food; somehow it slows the acid (dilutes it?) from doing its job.

I try to only drink a lot of water after the meal. I also take digestive aids when faced with a big meal and a daily dose of Inflamma GI to help keep my mucosa in tact.

 

[braumeister]

(t

my hope with this thread was that a chemist would tell me how much sodium bicarbonate neutralizes a cup of coffee or a glass of beer.

I think some of us lose sight of the fact that the stomach is meant to be an extremely acid environment for proper digestion. Stomach acid has a very low pH (ranging between 1.5 and 3.5, with 7 being neutral). I believe that interfering with that very acidic environment is not in my best interest.

 

[LuckyDog]

My doctor and I tried just about everything to control Acid Reflux and nothing worked. So, I have been taking Omeprozol for years to treat my Acid Reflux which is a certain trigger for asthma attacks. Omeprozol is the lesser of two evils for me...

 

[marko]

My doctor and I tried just about everything to control Acid Reflux and nothing worked. So, I have been taking Omeprozol for years to treat my Acid Reflux which is a certain trigger for asthma attacks. Omeprozol is the lesser of two evils for me...

I've been on Omeprazole for 20+ years now and have developed a low vitamin B12 condition. No biggie but I have to go for monthly B12 shots.

All I know is that if I miss/forget a dose in the morning, by 2PM I'm one hurting puppy.

 

[Focus]

I agree with much of what GoodWishes listed, with a couple of exceptions/additions:

I find it's better to have fewer meals with hours in between to let the stomach rest. When I eat more frequently (smaller meals), I think my stomach has a tendency to keep the acid activity going and never shut down. I also need to eat something light not long before going to bed. But everyone is different, and it's up to each of us to figure out what works for our own bodies.

One of the biggest reflux triggers is mint. The very worst thing you can do is eat or drink something that combines a couple of triggers or LES relaxers -- peppermint patties, Irish coffee, etc.

I've also found that I have to add a good amount of raw greens to my main meal. That helps keep things in check. Baked vegetables aren't enough.

Baking soda has its drawbacks, according to this Livestrong.com article: gas, excessive salt intake, calcium absorption interference, and kidney damage.

 

[Winemaker]

Al, as a winemaker I deal with adjustments in acidity all the time. However, wine is much more acidic; whites can be 2.9-3.3, and reds 3.3-3.8. The range of coffee 4.8-5.3 depends on freshness of the bean, bean type, brewing technique, and original ph of water. Beverage acidity also is responsible for thirst quench.

To reduce the acidity by offsetting with bicarbonate soda, were you doing this in the cup or in your stomach? If in the cup, you would need several teaspoons and the coffee would taste like crap. In your stomach you would get a lot of gas. Bicarbonate soda, or calcium carbonate when used in winemaking, a portion of the wine is removed, say a quart from 6 gallons. The bicarb, or chalk is then added because it would act on all acids in the quart, not just the weak acids in the 6 gallons. Then the solids would precipitate out and added back later. A lot of work for just a cup of coffee.

I'd tell you to drink more water as that is also a acid reducing technique, but your stomach would sense the unbalance of acidity in your stomach and just pump out more.

 

[Bamaman]

This is a subject near and ear to my heart. Just saw my physician on acid reflux at night. My lungs are at risk for sure. Have had a number of middle of the night aspirations. Already have had pneumonia three times but it is independent of this issue. Takes me a week to get over it and the damage to my system. Basically my physician said:

Stop drinking (probably not)
Do not make dinner your biggest meal
Stop eating at least two hours before bedtime
Be careful coffee intake as it is a major contributor to this issue

I agree with left side sleeping but it's difficult especially if you are a tosser and turner. Right side sleeping opens up the acid super highway. I have two wedge pillows now. One is a 4" and one is a 7". The taller they are I find myself sliding down after a period of time. I don't like taking things like Prilosec because they have an effect on absorption of key minerals and vitamins. My wife has done some research on split beds so she doesn't have to put her side up. I figured it would be a $5k all in investment to convert. A lot of dough for sure.

Sorry you've been having such problems. On top of the doctor's suggestions above, there are lists online of specific foods to avoid if you have GERD problems.

My wife is much better limiting her beloved coffee and sticking with high quality caffeine free coffee. She also doesn't do well with any milk products and avoids ice cream after mid-day. We had to buy her a memory foam mattress and an adjustable bed to raise her head and shoulders for sleep. She cannot live without Nexium right now, and has to drink massive amounts of Pepto Bismol the nights she has problems.

But after numerous frightening episodes of GERD and pneumonia, she is going ahead with the surgery to fix her hernia. That's the last resort when all else fails. I was looking at the surgery on YouTube.com, and it appears to be 90% to 95% effective.

 

[Bir48die]

One thing that pains me is I have given up hot sauce which I used to out on everything. If it will contribute to my healing in this instance I'll wave it goodbye. However I will continue to eat my beloved Buffalo Wings. Non negotiable

 

[24601NoMore]

One of the biggest reflux triggers is mint. The very worst thing you can do is eat or drink something that combines a couple of triggers or LES relaxers -- peppermint patties, Irish coffee, etc.

Very true! I used to drink a really strong peppermint tea (doh!) because I had heard it was good for stomach issues. The product (Heather's Tummy Tea) was technically for IBS, but I self-diagnosed and thought I might have a bit of this plus stomach issues. I did this for quite a while before one night having an extremely bad acid reflux attack where it felt like someone poured Draino down my esophagus. Yep - had a big mug of Tummy Tea before going to be that night..

Turns out Mint is a natural relaxer for the little valve that goes between your stomach and esophagus. So, ingest mint - and it opens things up to create even MORE GERD and acid reflux. Never knew that until recently..

This was the same time I was getting over serious bronchitis that we think was being caused by sinusitus. So, I was getting spasmodic coughing that even Abuterol couldn't control. Pulmonary specialist doc told me the cough was at least partly being caused by GERD. I knew I had GERD (diagnosed long time ago), but who the heck knew you could have spasmodic, almost uncontrollable coughing at least partly caused by GERD?

 

[John Galt III]

I've been dealing with this since 2016 (thread) and from all my experiments, I've discovered this:

There's so much variability, that I can't learn anything from experiments.
........snip......... But my hope with this thread was that a chemist would tell me how much sodium bicarbonate neutralizes a cup of coffee or a glass of beer.

I'm hoping I can somehow find out how low or high or medium my stomach acid really is throughout the day. I take a very low dose of a PPI (Lansoprazole) which works wonders for my acid stomach, but I worry about having stomach acid that is too low, resulting in lack of nutrient absorption. Good luck in your quest!

 

[John Galt III]

24601NoMore wrote : --- My horrible and persistent coughing which drove my wife crazy is what led me to go to an ENT who looked inside my nose with a scope, and immediately suggested I go on a treatment of Prevacid, which cured the coughing in a couple of days.

 

[MrsHaloFIRE]

We came off the coffee and DH and I are now living a different life. No more waking in the middle of the night feeling like youre dying. No more tightness across the chest. And we really liked coffee, but so not worth it

 

[TromboneAl]

To reduce the acidity by offsetting with bicarbonate soda, were you doing this in the cup or in your stomach? If in the cup, you would need several teaspoons and the coffee would taste like crap.

Thanks. I am going to get some pH strips and confirm that. I found a site that suggested adding a pinch of BS (Baking soda!) to a cup of coffee. I've done that, and the coffee tastes the same or maybe better.

I worried about the sodium in the BS, but a yearlong experiment with very low sodium intake showed me that I'm not sensitive to it. In any case, BS has only 25% of the sodium in table salt.

Most of the sites I've read recommend around .5 tsp (e.g. "1/2 tsp. dissolved in a 4-ounce glass of water, may be repeated in 2 hours").

I think some of us lose sight of the fact that the stomach is meant to be an extremely acid environment for proper digestion. Stomach acid has a very low pH (ranging between 1.5 and 3.5, with 7 being neutral). I believe that interfering with that very acidic environment is not in my best interest.

Yes, this is the point of my post. Instead of reducing the acidity of the stomach, I want to reduce the acidity of the acidic things I drink. Do the former, and your stomach be like, "Need more acid!" The latter, and the stomach be like, "That water tasted like coffee!"

 

[Murf2]

Thanks. I am going to get some pH strips and confirm that. I found a site that suggested adding a pinch of BS (Baking soda!) to a cup of coffee. I've done that, and the coffee tastes the same or maybe better.



I worried about the sodium in the BS, but a yearlong experiment with very low sodium intake showed me that I'm not sensitive to it. In any case, BS has only 25% of the sodium in table salt.



Most of the sites I've read recommend around .5 tsp (e.g. "1/2 tsp. dissolved in a 4-ounce glass of water, may be repeated in 2 hours").







Yes, this is the point of my post. Instead of reducing the acidity of the stomach, I want to reduce the acidity of the acidic things I drink. Do the former, and your stomach be like, "Need more acid!" The latter and the stomach be like, "That water tasted like coffee!"

We make our coffee with bottled alkaline water. It's 8.8 to 9.5 pH depending on where you buy it. I don't know if it will help you with the coughing, but it makes the coffee taste smoother (at least compared to our regular water).

 

[Mdlerth]

Bugs Bunny was on to something

So many wonderful things I enjoy correlate strongly with midnight heartburn:

- Breads and pastas
- any kind of spiciness (hot peppers, mustard, horseradish)
- any more than a few sips of alcoholic beverages
- sweets

But it disappears entirely if I eat a couple of baby carrots. I have no idea what chemistry is involved, but raw carrot suppresses the gerd like magic.

 

[Amethyst]

Relevant to the topic of GERD: At our gym, I occasionally chat with a neurologist (specializing in memory) with a Ph. D. in neuroscience. He is very interested in the brain's "outsourcing" functions to the gut. I asked him if he thought there was a connection between brain chemistry and acid reflux, and he said "definitely."*
*Now, I know some of you want studies and citations, but I'm not asking for such things, when we're both pounding on cardio machines....
He said, "Look around you, I bet half the people here are on PPI's." He meant us educated, driven types, all furiously exercising at 0530. Probably most of them are on this forum, too
I did not think to ask at the time, but have since wondered: if there's a link between brain chemistry and your gut, and if this link could be contributing to acid reflux, could there also be a way to use biofeedback to help reduce or control acid reflux?
I'd like to think so, since I have performed every single "lifestyle" activity that is supposed to help with GERD, with little relief. (Except losing weight - not something anyone would recommend in my case).

 

[48Fire]

My wife has a lot of success with Papaya Enzymes the last year or so. They are available at Whole Foods and similar places.

 

[joeea]

I'm stunned that so many people choose to self-diagnose and treat their conditions rather than get the advice of medical professionals.

- Is it because folks are afraid of the doctor or the diagnosis?
- Do folks simply want to save the cost of a visit?
- Do people think they are smarter than medical professionals?

From personal experience, I can tell you that this sort of condition is nothing to fool around with. My 87 year old father has inoperable stomach and esophogeal cancer. Although we don't know for sure, persistent acid reflux may well be the cause. I wish he had sought proper treatment. Sadly, it's too late now.

 

[24601NoMore]

I'm stunned that so many people choose to self-diagnose and treat their conditions rather than get the advice of medical professionals.

Well, in my case, it's because the vast majority of medical professionals I've gone to in the past several years have all pretty consistently failed to diagnose my issues or to provide much in the way of real help.

Take my current knee issue (going on since November) - have been to D.O. 4 separate times now. First time was "your muscles are very tight, so go to PT 3X/week". No, I don't just have tight muscles..I have a knee joint issue. Did he ever even LOOK at my knee to check for swelling, alignment, etc or compare it to my other knee? (Nope). Have done X-Rays, MRI and PT for almost 2 months now. STILL have an issue, and $1,500+ later in Med costs, no idea whatsoever what is causing the pain and lack of ability to exercise without it and increased swelling. I'm about ready to change D.O.s on this one..

Ditto Family Doctor. Call, and it's "sorry, we can't get you in - go to the Urgent Care". Last time I got downright tweaked about this..I'd been sick for over a week, had a recurring issue that was not going away, WANTED to go to the Doctor and they couldn't find it in their schedule to even have a Nurse Practitioner see me. Wound up being sick for 3 weeks total that time, and if they could have actually treated me, I'm convinced I would have saved at least a week and possibly two off all that - and hundreds of $$s in specialists (pulmonologist), tests (chest X-Ray) and various meds..

So, basically - at least in my case..it's been the lack of good, accessible medical care from practitioners that I trust and have confidence in. I would LOVE to be able to go the Doctor, be properly diagnosed and FIXED..but increasingly, that's just not been my experience. I spend the time and money..and they seem to not do anything much to figure out what is actually going on or more importantly figure out how to fix what's broken..

ETA - Doctors often don't believe in supplements, also. DW had to go to her cardiologist today and asked him about Magnesium to help with high BP (she's already on meds and is somewhat "resistant" to them). Instead of being open to it potentially helping despite lots of evidence out there that Magnesium can and does help high BP, he downplayed it and told her "don't expect much"..ditto my GI - I told him that the Prilosec (Omeprazole) that he prescribed appeared to have depleted my magnesium levels, causing severe bone pain. Lots of evidence out there this is a fairly common side effect. Instead of saying "yeah, that might be it..let me order some tests for you" basically told me "if that did happen, you'd be the first patient EVER to have that happen". Totally wrote off all the anecdotal evidence I found to the contrary with dozens and dozens of other people that had happened to.

Net, I do think we all need to be active participants in managing our own health, and that means "trust but verify" and sometimes go beyond what the professionals tell us, because no-one knows our bodies like we do..

 

[IBWino]

Great thread timing! I just got diagnosed with this last week. I had a pain in my left vocal cord for more than 3 months, and recently started clearing my throat frequently. I had no other symptoms (i.e. heartburn/indigestion, etc.).

The pain was caused by a lesion on my vocal cord apparently due to "silent reflux". He put me on a prilosec/pepcid regimen and will recheck for improvement in two months. He also highly recommended that I reduce consumption of carbonated beverages (I don't drink soda, but do drink a few beers a week) and coffee (I drink 3-4 cups each morning), and try to eat at least three hours before going to bed. He also suggested reducing alcohol consumption, a tough one because we enjoy having wine with dinner most nights.

It's very interesting to see the comments regarding carbohydrate consumption. My wife and I generally limit carb consumption, but the holidays upset our routine. It'll be interesting to see if going back to our normal eating habits (meat, veggies and a small salad) helps.

-Wino

 

[Amethyst]

It sounds like most posters have, indeed, seen Dr's, gotten tested, etc. Since nothing has been completely helpful, people are looking for other avenues (hopefully harmless ones) to try.

 

[MRG]

I'm stunned that so many people choose to self-diagnose and treat their conditions rather than get the advice of medical professionals.

- Is it because folks are afraid of the doctor or the diagnosis?
- Do folks simply want to save the cost of a visit?
- Do people think they are smarter than medical professionals?

From personal experience, I can tell you that this sort of condition is nothing to fool around with. My 87 year old father has inoperable stomach and esophogeal cancer. Although we don't know for sure, persistent acid reflux may well be the cause. I wish he had sought proper treatment. Sadly, it's too late now.

I'm sorry about your dad.

The medical community lets many fall through the cracks, digestion issues are very hit, miss. I was scoped several times to learn nothing.

Other things are dizzy, headaches, and feeling overheated.

I've been dizzy for a few years. Right now it feels like I'm spinning under 50' of water. Been dizzy all day, about the same intensity. Few weeks ago I stopped at a busy red light, but I sensed I was still moving forward into the intersection. Kinda scary.

DW has been overheated for a couple years. It's as if she was having hot flashes again. Her doctor keeps avoiding the issue, pointing fingers at her other doctor and any other medicines.

She also has migraines for the last 3+ weeks. Right now we're waiting to hear from a new neurologist who is going to repeat the same information the last neurologist gave her 3 years ago. "Sorry, the other doctors don't know how to read the CT. This means nothing". Some doctors are the kids in school who ate paste.

 

[marko]

I did not think to ask at the time, but have since wondered: if there's a link between brain chemistry and your gut, and if this link could be contributing to acid reflux, could there also be a way to use biofeedback to help reduce or control acid reflux?

Your intuition is spot on.

Over my 30+ years of digestive problems, I've spent a lot of time with Eastern medicine people (who've helped me a lot more than Western doctors).

Along the way, I've often heard them say that "the stomach is a second brain".

Just this moment, as I looked it up for reference I stumbled upon a book that is coming out in May of 2019 called "The second brain" by Dr Michael Gershon.

Description: Dr. Michael Gershon has devoted his career to understanding the human bowel (the stomach, esophagus, small intestine, and colon). His thirty years of research have led to an extraordinary rediscovery: nerve cells in the gut that act as a brain. This "second brain" can control our gut all by itself. Our two brains -- the one in our head and the one in our bowel -- must cooperate. If they do not, then there is chaos in the gut and misery in the head -- everything from "butterflies" to cramps, from diarrhea to constipation.

Dr. Gershon's work has led to radical new understandings about a wide range of gastrointestinal problems including gastroenteritis, nervous stomach, and irritable bowel syndrome. The Second Brain represents a quantum leap in medical knowledge and is already benefiting patients whose symptoms were previously dismissed as neurotic or "it's all in your head."