Construction Input Needed

[eytonxav]

I just had a pergola project completed in my backyard patio. The company screwed up and installed the posts at the front of the pergola so they are overhanging the edge of the patio slab. I have two concerns with this screwup, one being cosmetic and the other unsure if a structural problem with the slab might have been created with the anchor hole drilled too close to the rounded edge. The possible solutions from my perspective appear to be: 1) move the posts so the bottom trim pieces are no longer overhanging (could move posts towards the house or just laterally to eliminate the overhang). Moving towards the house I suspect will cause too much movement with the supporting beam and rafters and end up weakening the entire structure. Moving laterally might create less stress on the overall structure, but would create a slight misalignment with the posts that are next to the house, although possibly not very noticeable). The holes left by the anchors would need to be filled in and probably covered by the bottom trim pieces. 2) build stone columns around the the posts per the attached picture. This would purely be a cosmetic fix for the overhang so it does not look so stupid, although I am unsure if there would remain any structural risk as the anchor holes for the posts are still very close to the rounded edge. It would also mean two sides of the column would extend down to the bottom of the slab and might also look a little strange, but be more aesthetically pleasing.

There is a fair amount of construction expertise on here, so what would you do in this situation and are there any options I have not thought of?

 

[DrRoy]

If the anchor hole is in the center of the beam, you are probably still OK in that regard, with perhaps more that 2 inches of concrete from the hole to the edge. If you are going to move the posts, closer to the house would be better than laterally. Another less drastic action would be to go from two layers of cladding wrap at the bottom of the posts to one.

 

[pb4uski]

+1. From the pictures it looks to me like the entire post is on the slab so your problem is cosmetic and not structural.

To fix the cosmetic you could replace the trim at the bottom of the post with something thinner that doesn't extend over the edge of the slab or remove the trim, add some concrete to square off the slab and then replace the trim pieces. I think I would just get different trim... perhaps quarter round around the bottom of the post.

 

[427Vette]

The concrete looks to be about 5” thick at the edge? Is there rerod or steel mesh in the slab? Regardless there is still plenty of strength there. I am guessing the anchor is probably only a 3/8” hole or two and it probably only penetrates the surface 2-3”. I wouldn’t be the least bit concerned about it’s structural capabilities. The framework is not really that heavy anyway. Your ideas are all good. That whole beam could be moved back toward the house allowing the post to be moved back and still keep everything plumb and level. They could also be moved laterally as you mentioned. How do you plan to finish off that edge of concrete where it meets the grass? I see along the fence you have some landscape rock. If you are going to landscape around it with rock, wood chips etc maybe do that first. Right now this little mishap is drawing all of your attention. Once the landscape around it is complete and all of your patio furniture is in place and your grill sitting next to it you may not pay any attention to it. I can see lots of headaches arising by making the builder move the post. Pick your battles…

 

[JoeWras]

The train is out of the station and is down the tracks. It is too late to start moving things.

First of all, the good news is that this is not a high load structure. You don't have people walking on a solid deck above. Any future failure won't jeopardize health and safety.

Depending on how green the concrete is, the anchor bolt may hold just fine. I'm going to assume it was either cast in place or drilled and epoxied. Both of those won't put much stress on the close corner. If some sort of expanding anchor was used, that would be a problem.

Let's assume you don't have a future fracture problem. I'd go with thinner trim as pb4uski suggests. Or perhaps some innovative custom cut curved trim. Then perhaps put a flower pot at the corner.

Before you do anything, though, you need to build up base at the grass level. I don't like how the slab is already hanging there, ready to be undercut-eroded.

Final thought: in the event it does fracture, the structure can be held up temporarily, and the corner cut out with a deeper square footing and everything rebuilt. It would be a little work, but it is not catastrophic.

 

[Ronstar]

I think your stone column fix would be the best solution. 2 ways to do it.

1. Pour more concrete at the corners maybe 4” from the existing slab. Level with the existing slab and doweled to it. Compacted stone underneath. This would serve as a foundation for the stone columns and shore up the corner for a little more base for the pergola post. And backfill with dirt.

2. Mortar decorative stone down the sides of the pergola post and down the sides of the existing slab without a foundation for the stonework. Maybe put down some compacted gravel for a base to help support the stone.

In either case I’d use hangers to secure the stone to the pergola posts. I’m pretty sure they make hangers for stone like brick hangers.

 

[freedomatlast]

I hope you didn't pay in full yet. Such lack of attention to detail is almost unbelievable. I wouldn't do anything except call the contractor and ask him what he suggests. If he refuses to do anything, ask him if he's proud of that work and ask how he will feel with his name being associated with that job on social media. Hard to believe a contractor would walk away from that and call it finished. No way would I attach fake stone to the wood. That calls even more attention to an obvious screw-up and will retain moisture next to the wood causing premature rotting. Thinner trim or no trim at all seems like the best solution and would look much better than what's existing.

 

[Jerry1]

A cheap solution would be to take some concrete and square off the corner of the cement. I’m not sure of the best product, but there are better choices than just typical concrete for that type of repair. That assumes this is just cosmetic.

 

[latexman]

What if you boxed in the concrete patio with something, like stained wood, stained or plain pressure treated 4x4’s, or brick that matches the house? I think the matching brick would look best and more maintenance-free.

 

[pb4uski]

I think your stone column fix would be the best solution. 2 ways to do it.

1. Pour more concrete at the corners maybe 4” from the existing slab. Level with the existing slab and doweled to it. Compacted stone underneath. This would serve as a foundation for the stone columns and shore up the corner for a little more base for the pergola post. And backfill with dirt.

2. Mortar decorative stone down the sides of the pergola post and down the sides of the existing slab without a foundation for the stonework. Maybe put down some compacted gravel for a base to help support the stone.

In either case I’d use hangers to secure the stone to the pergola posts. I’m pretty sure they make hangers for stone like brick hangers.

Sounds like you are suggesting that the OP expand the corner of the slab slightly and build a stone pillar similar to the stone pillars around the posts in the last picture. That would work.... might be overkill, but it would look nicer.

OP, are both outside corners like the second picture?

 

[freedomatlast]

A cheap solution would be to take some concrete and square off the corner of the cement. I’m not sure of the best product, but there are better choices than just typical concrete for that type of repair. That assumes this is just cosmetic.

OP could use Sakrete Top N Bond for that but the color and texture most likely won't match exactly and will look like the patchwork that it is.

 

[Car-Guy]

Have you paid them in full?

 

[finnski1]

I hope you didn't pay in full yet. Such lack of attention to detail is almost unbelievable. I wouldn't do anything except call the contractor and ask him what he suggests. If he refuses to do anything, ask him if he's proud of that work and ask how he will feel with his name being associated with that job on social media. Hard to believe a contractor would walk away from that and call it finished. No way would I attach fake stone to the wood. That calls even more attention to an obvious screw-up and will retain moisture next to the wood causing premature rotting. Thinner trim or no trim at all seems like the best solution and would look much better than what's existing.

This would be my approach as well.
I think the only real good solution is to have the post and carrying beam moved over closer to the house by several inches and make sure the original anchor hole is covered properly by trim.
I don't think even thinner trim will do it because it looks like the 1st level of trim even overhangs that round corner when looking at the photo of the top view of the post.

In the event the contractor won't budge I 'd be doing it myself but then again I am a hardcore DIY kind of guy.
No on the stone as well, I think it would look even worse with even more overhang.
Also wouldn't try to scab on a square corner of concrete. Cold joints like that almost always fail sometimes fairly quickly.

 

[street]

I think your stone column fix would be the best solution. 2 ways to do it.

1. Pour more concrete at the corners maybe 4” from the existing slab. Level with the existing slab and doweled to it. Compacted stone underneath. This would serve as a foundation for the stone columns and shore up the corner for a little more base for the pergola post. And backfill with dirt.

2. Mortar decorative stone down the sides of the pergola post and down the sides of the existing slab without a foundation for the stonework. Maybe put down some compacted gravel for a base to help support the stone.

In either case I’d use hangers to secure the stone to the pergola posts. I’m pretty sure they make hangers for stone like brick hangers.

This ^ is what I would have recommended with options also. As far as the post where it sits now, I wouldn't be concerned about its strength or falling off.
If mine I would do one of the options Ronstar mentioned for making it look complete. IMO

 

[eytonxav]

I think your stone column fix would be the best solution. 2 ways to do it.

1. Pour more concrete at the corners maybe 4” from the existing slab. Level with the existing slab and doweled to it. Compacted stone underneath. This would serve as a foundation for the stone columns and shore up the corner for a little more base for the pergola post. And backfill with dirt.

2. Mortar decorative stone down the sides of the pergola post and down the sides of the existing slab without a foundation for the stonework. Maybe put down some compacted gravel for a base to help support the stone.

In either case I’d use hangers to secure the stone to the pergola posts. I’m pretty sure they make hangers for stone like brick hangers.

I am leaning toward this type of solution.

I hope you didn't pay in full yet. Such lack of attention to detail is almost unbelievable. I wouldn't do anything except call the contractor and ask him what he suggests. If he refuses to do anything, ask him if he's proud of that work and ask how he will feel with his name being associated with that job on social media. Hard to believe a contractor would walk away from that and call it finished. No way would I attach fake stone to the wood. That calls even more attention to an obvious screw-up and will retain moisture next to the wood causing premature rotting. Thinner trim or no trim at all seems like the best solution and would look much better than what's existing.

Of course I did not pay yet, only paid a $1000 deposit. The contractor is not walking away from this, but wants to know what I want to do to resolve.

Sounds like you are suggesting that the OP expand the corner of the slab slightly and build a stone pillar similar to the stone pillars around the posts in the last picture. That would work.... might be overkill, but it would look nicer.

OP, are both outside corners like the second picture?

Yes, both outside corners are like this.

I previously thought about placing forms and squaring off the corner with more concrete, but then would be dealing with mismatched concrete that would also be susceptible to cracking.

This slab has footing beams and is probably 12 or more inches thick around the perimeter. I am not sure if they just screwed it to the slab or installed a moly of some sort which was then screwed tight to the base bracket.

 

[EarlyandLate]

What if you boxed in the concrete patio with something, like stained wood, stained or plain pressure treated 4x4’s, or brick that matches the house?

+1 to the above, or just take an Occam's Razor approach and remove all the trim at the base of the columns. That's probably better from a long term rot prevention perspective anyway. It will not hold water between the boards.

 

[FiveDriver]

That contractor fouled up some very basic measurements, and the layout is flawed. Placement of the spikes in concrete to hold the posts was fundamental to the finished look.

It is probably structurally sound. But it looks shoddy.

The contractor should be willing to come back and put a finished border around the entire patio at his expense......red brick or decorative stone to hide the poor craftsmanship.

After he's cleaned up his mess, be sure to hammer him with a bad Google review.

 

[finnski1]

+1 to the above, or just take an Occam's Razor approach and remove all the trim at the base of the columns. That's probably better from a long term rot prevention perspective anyway. It will not hold water between the boards.

Won't look good because of the metal post brackets plus even the post itself overhangs the round corner. See OP latest pic.

 

[finnski1]

That contractor fouled up some very basic measurements, and the layout is flawed. Placement of the spikes in concrete to hold the posts was fundamental to the finished look.

It is probably structurally sound. But it looks shoddy.

The contractor should be willing to come back and put a finished border around the entire patio at his expense......red brick or decorative stone to hide the poor craftsmanship.

After he's cleaned up his mess, be sure to hammer him with a bad Google review.

Don't think that would solve anything. You would still see the post extended over the concrete corner.

 

[Jerry1]

After looking at it, I think I’d move the posts back just enough to be fully on the concrete and cover the existing holes that are holding the bracket in place. The problem I’d have is that when the contractor moves the top beam, he’s probably going to tear up the wood and that’s not acceptable. Unfortunately, there’s never a good substitute for doing things right the first time. Basically, it would probably be cheaper to move the posts than to build stonework around them. I’d just get agreement that the wood that gets torn up in the process gets replaced.

 

[JoeWras]

This slab has footing beams and is probably 12 or more inches thick around the perimeter. I am not sure if they just screwed it to the slab or installed a moly of some sort which was then screwed tight to the base bracket.

Probably used a concrete wedge anchor since this is such a light load:

A wedge anchor near the edge of an unreinforced slab risks a future fracture.

They could have used epoxy instead. You drill a hole, inject epoxy, then place the bolt. It's a really good solution but more expensive and trickier than a wedge bolt. Seeing the rest of the workmanship, I'm going to assume they went with the easiest.

 

[finnski1]

After looking at it, I think I’d move the posts back just enough to be fully on the concrete and cover the existing holes that are holding the bracket in place. The problem I’d have is that when the contractor moves the top beam, he’s probably going to tear up the wood and that’s not acceptable. Unfortunately, there’s never a good substitute for doing things right the first time. Basically, it would probably be cheaper to move the posts than to build stonework around them. I’d just get agreement that the wood that gets torn up in the process gets replaced.

I agree with moving the posts as I mentioned earlier. IMHO it is the best solution. They can avoid "tearing" up the wood if they are careful. If the carrying beam is screwed to the posts with timberlock screws or similar then simply back them out. Similar for each top pergola piece which is attached to the carrying beam . If nails were used , I would simply use a reciprocating saw and carefully cut each nail off. Leave the nails in there and then move posts and renail or better yet use deck screws to reattach.

 

[zinger1457]

If moving the posts, the bases are usually held in by wedge anchors that won't easily come out, could cut them off using an angle grinder and then grind them down flat. Maybe not the cheapest fix but consider using a cobblestone edge around the entire patio, often used as edging on driveways, think it would blend in pretty good with the existing patio.

 

[pacergal]

Not a handy person and more of a let it be type, but it really does not look as bad to me.
Yes, they should have moved the post back so it was entirely on the concrete, but from what folks have written, it may risk structure to repair? The contractor messed up and should make it right by you, whatever your "right" consist of.
I think visually, smaller trim at the bottom of the post, placing a planter and perhaps nice flowering bush at each corner would conceal the small overhanging edge and ask for a BIG discount on the project would be my fix.

 

[JoeWras]

The more I come across this thread, the more I'm amazed that the contractor installed it like this. What an absolutely terrible mistake.

I feel bad for OP because everything else about the job looks pretty good.