Construction Input Needed

[finnski1]

I am leaning toward this type of solution.
You will still have stone columns that overhang the rest of the perimeter of the patio. You can tell this because of the photo you posted in post #15 above. The post without any trim is hanging over the corner a little before any trim is applied Even if you add concrete to the corners they will have to stick out beyond the rest of the patio. If you add concrete all around the patio so they don't "stick out' you then have a cold concrete joint all around your patio almost guaranteed to fail and fairly quickly.


Of course I did not pay yet, only paid a $1000 deposit. The contractor is not walking away from this, but wants to know what I want to do to resolve.



Yes, both outside corners are like this.

I previously thought about placing forms and squaring off the corner with more concrete, but then would be dealing with mismatched concrete that would also be susceptible to cracking. As I posted previously any "patch to the concrete will result in a "cold joint" (non monolithic pour) that is sure to fail rather quickly with seasonal changes.

This slab has footing beams and is probably 12 or more inches thick around the perimeter. I am not sure if they just screwed it to the slab or installed a moly of some sort which was then screwed tight to the base bracket. Most likely put in a threaded (3/8 or 1/2 inch)rod which is pretty typical, hopefully epoxied in or a wedge anchor as a previous poster showed. The post bracket then sits on the concrete and a metal post spacer keeps the wooden post off the concrete. Then just tightened down with a nut and washer

I responded in red.

 

[finnski1]

I think your stone column fix would be the best solution. 2 ways to do it.

1. Pour more concrete at the corners maybe 4” from the existing slab. Level with the existing slab and doweled to it. Compacted stone underneath. This would serve as a foundation for the stone columns and shore up the corner for a little more base for the pergola post. And backfill with dirt. You then have corners that "stick out" past the perimeter of the rest of the patio. I don't believe that is the best look but only in my humble opinion of course. Also "backfilling" would raise the ground in that area. It looks like the rest of his lawn around the patio is 3 or 4 inches below the cement patio?

2. Mortar decorative stone down the sides of the pergola post and down the sides of the existing slab without a foundation for the stonework. Maybe put down some compacted gravel for a base to help support the stone. The post without the trim is inboard of the corner by what looks like a good inch and a half or so. He would either have to chisel out the concrete in that area which would risk fracturing the concrete and weakening the anchor point. Or would have to use pretty wide stones until he got down to the concrete patio level and use thinner stones from there to the ground. Again the corner stone posts would now be proud of the rest of the patio perimeter. Both of these seem like a bit of work. I believe people are overestimating the amount of work to simply have the contractor move the 2 posts.

In either case I’d use hangers to secure the stone to the pergola posts. I’m pretty sure they make hangers for stone like brick hangers.

My opinions in blue.

 

[Music Lover]

A few people have already suggested the most effective and likely best solution. Just move the posts back enough so that they're completely on the concrete. It's impossible to add more concrete and not have it look like a patch. It's easier and faster to move the posts, and from the pics it looks like only a couple inches are needed.

 

[Music Lover]

And if screws were used at the top it would only take a few minutes to make the adjustment. This is a very easy fix, it's not rocket science.

 

[finnski1]

A few people have already suggested the most effective and likely best solution. Just move the posts back enough so that they're completely on the concrete. It's impossible to add more concrete and not have it look like a patch. It's easier and faster to move the posts, and from the pics it looks like only a couple inches are needed.

That's what I have been trying to say. I think people are overestimating the work to move the 2 posts. Should not be much for the contractor. In fact I think the pergola looks pretty good and they seemed to a good job with it. I'm sure they could move them pretty easily. All other solutions seem like band aids to me.

 

[latexman]

Moving the posts is probable the only option that will not increase the original scope and result in no additional cost, because it’s painfully obvious the contractor put the posts in the wrong place.

 

[finnski1]

And if screws were used at the top it would only take a few minutes to make the adjustment. This is a very easy fix, it's not rocket science.

Exactly and even if nailed a few minutes with a steady hand and reciprocating saw can remove the nails without damaging the wood.

 

[Music Lover]

Moving the posts is probable the only option that will not increase the original scope and result in no additional cost, because it’s painfully obvious the contractor put the posts in the wrong place.

The concrete was obviously there before the posts were set so I can't fathom why the contractor didn't set them back far enough in the first place. This isn't a load bearing structure where a couple inches of span would fail a live load inspection.

 

[finnski1]

A few people have already suggested the most effective and likely best solution. Just move the posts back enough so that they're completely on the concrete. It's impossible to add more concrete and not have it look like a patch. It's easier and faster to move the posts, and from the pics it looks like only a couple inches are needed.

Yes and me being real picky I would move them back 2 inches and in 2 inches as well. The reason being would be to have a symmetrical reveal at the edges of the trim to the edge of the concrete because they have that now. Otherwise you would have a 2+ inch reveal out front and only what looks like a half inch reveal on the sides.

Moving them about 2 inches should still cover the existing anchor hole.

 

[Jerry1]

One problem I see with moving the posts is possibly losing the anchor point. If the contractor sunk some threaded rod into the concrete during the pour, then moving the post is going to lose that. Be comfortable with the anchor before and after the post move if that’s the way you go.

 

[JoeWras]

One problem I see with moving the posts is possibly losing the anchor point. If the contractor sunk some threaded rod into the concrete during the pour, then moving the post is going to lose that. Be comfortable with the anchor before and after the post move if that’s the way you go.

It's really OK to set anchors a different way. The best way is to drop "L-bolts" in the concrete during the cure, but I gotta tell you that is difficult because you have to absolutely nail it while dealing with curing concrete. Very hard work to get right. I wonder if that's what they did and forgot about the round edge? That could be the cause of it all.

If they move the posts, I really recommend that they don't use wedge anchors because there's too many weak points around it. If OP pursues moving the posts, I recommend they use threaded rod with epoxy, especially for this simple structure. Super easy, just drill, pump the expoxy and set the rod. It is about 5x more expensive than a wedge bolt, but still won't break the bank. You also only have about 4 minutes of working time with the epoxy. That freaks some workers out. You just have to plan.

They are good enough for a light pole. A simple arbor won't load them at all.

 

[Cobra9777]

The front posts were obviously placed without considering the trim. Just have the contractor move the posts and beam toward the house where they should have been to begin with. It's a simple fix and will not weaken the structure. I would not go with a single level of trim as it would not match trim elsewhere. Plus I like the look.

If you want to expand the scope of the project, that's fine too. But it's not necessary to fix the mistake that resulted in a cosmetic issue. I like the look as-is, without stone. If it was me, I'd just have the contractor fix the mistake.

Some have suggested moving the posts toward the house and laterally. That would be OK too, but it would annoy me that they're not lined up with the rear posts, which are right at the edge of the patio.

 

[finnski1]

The front posts were obviously placed without considering the trim. Just have the contractor move the posts and beam toward the house where they should have been to begin with. It's a simple fix and will not weaken the structure. I would not go with a single level of trim as it would not match trim elsewhere. Plus I like the look.

If you want to expand the scope of the project, that's fine too. But it's not necessary to fix the mistake that resulted in a cosmetic issue. I like the look as-is, without stone. If it was me, I'd just have the contractor fix the mistake.

Some have suggested moving the posts toward the house and laterally. That would be OK too, but it would annoy me that they're not lined up with the rear posts, which are right at the edge of the patio.

Yeah. I suggested the lateral move as well as in. I believe the non symmetrical reveal of just moving them back will be much more noticeable and bugging me more than the ones up against the house which sort of blend in back there. YMMV as others say.

Also I agree about the double trim, looks better to me.

 

[Car-Guy]

2) build stone columns around the the posts per the attached picture. This would purely be a cosmetic fix for the overhang so it does not look so stupid, [-]although I am unsure if there would remain any structural risk as the anchor holes for the posts are still very close to the rounded edge.[/-] It would also mean two sides of the column would extend down to the bottom of the slab and might also look a little strange, but be more aesthetically pleasing.

^^^^^ This - Good solution, IMO

 

[ivinsfan]

The contractor has asked you for your solution to the issue first...


Ah no... they need to tell you what their proposed fix is first, let you think it over and decided if you prefer another solution...was there any kind of building permit involved in this project?

 

[CRLLS]

Assuming it is structurally sound now, I would have the contractor mortar the corner closed. If necessary, have an angle iron support bolted to the side of the existing concrete to support the patch. Then have the "fix" warranted for 10 years. Angle iron bolted to a concrete wall is a common method for lifting a sunken foundation.

 

[JoeWras]

Assuming it is structurally sound now, I would have the contractor mortar the corner closed. If necessary, have an angle iron support bolted to the side of the existing concrete to support the patch. Then have the "fix" warranted for 10 years. Angle iron bolted to a concrete wall is a common method for lifting a sunken foundation.

The contractor probably won't be in business for 10 years, let alone 1.

 

[Music Lover]

The contractor has asked you for your solution to the issue first...


Ah no... they need to tell you what their proposed fix is first, let you think it over and decided if you prefer another solution...was there any kind of building permit involved in this project?

I don't think a building permit is required for a non structural pergola.

 

[ivinsfan]

I don't think a building permit is required for a non structural pergola.

I'm sure they are required in some locals..I think the underlying reason is really property tax

 

[Music Lover]

I'm sure they are required in some locals..I think the underlying reason is really property tax

That wouldn't surprise me.

 

[ivinsfan]

That wouldn't surprise me.

But the reason I asked was that the builder would be subject to building codes which might impact the OP said problem

 

[Aerides]

Depends on the local rules, but in my area, structures attached to the actual home would require a permit.

Aside from that, are you saying he installed it like that without showing you what was going to happen first? Did he really fail to "measure twice, cut once" as literally everyone should know?

My general stance on this sort of thing is "This looks like trash, what are you going to do to fix it?"

- depending on the answer, they fix it...or I cut my losses and find and pay someone else to do it.

I would be asking him to come to your home and ask on what planet he thinks that's ok, and what his solution is to make it structurally sound to pass an inspection (and you can line one up independent of your city/county, or at least pretend you have one coming), and aesthetically correct to pass your desire to write him the check.

 

[OldShooter]

... My general stance on this sort of thing is "This looks like trash, what are you going to do to fix it?" ...

I agree. IMO this whole thread is premature. I would talk to the contractor, ideally on site, tell him this situation is unacceptable and tell him you'd like to hear his suggestion(s) to remedy it. Do not make threats, offer suggestions, discuss alternatives. or make an immediate decision from whatever he says. Slow and thoughtful is the recipe for getting what you want.

 

[eytonxav]

Thanks everyone for your thoughts. I meet with the contractor today. This is a very good and reputable contractor, but there was a miscommunication with the crew that did the work and the contractor accepts full responsibility and wants to make me happy. They indicated there is absolutely no structural risk with the location where the load contacts the slab. I believe them and they said they will stand behind it if anything ever happened. They offered to do whatever would make me happy: move the structure, surround posts with stone columns, etc. I do not like the idea of moving a wood structure that has already been assembled, so I opted to do stone columns which will look like the stone columns were installed first and then slab poured around it. This is not being done with faux stone or veneer, but will utilize stone blocks that will not be in direct contact with the post. This is a free standing pergola, not attached to the house, so it did not require a building permit.

 

[Ronstar]

^Good deal!