Dire situation in New York State

[gauss]

"Smoke 'em if you got 'em"

 

[Brat]

For any state, you can use this site
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/ The 8th column shows deaths per 1 million population. Just divided by 10,000 and it will give you the percentage. Thus, as of today, NY has 1004 per million or 0.1004%. CT, right next door, has 397 per million or 0.0397%. Hawaii has 7 per million or 0.0007%.

Hawaii is unique because of three factors:

Virtually every resident has health care coverage; for years employers were required to provide it, they have a lot of military retirees with health insurance and other retirees have Medicare. Their population is relatively healthy. Their hospitals are in good shape.

Hawaii required arrivals (virtually all by air) to quarantine for two weeks.

A lot of their residents are military, they have a younger demographic.

 

[Nords]

Hawaii is unique because of three factors:

Are your states arresting & deporting your visitors who violate quarantine, or is that another Hawaii unique factor?
https://www.staradvertiser.com/2020...ed-up-in-manhunt-after-violating-rules-again/

But seriously, it's a lot easier to lock down an island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. We've essentially smothered the visitor industry from over 30,000 arrivals per day to fewer than 100. The majority of the cases have been via residents returning from travel or from visitors.

It's a week or so early to make a declaration, but it looks like we've flattened the curve here. Today we're celebrating the re-opening of Oahu's parks... for those who have properly completed their quarantine and will continue to comply with the social distancing requirements.

 

[NameRedacted]

An interesting statistic from one of the calls over the weekend. Currently Ro state wide is 0.8. Downstate it is 0.75 and upstate it is 0.9. I suspect that the recent tests they did that show that 20%+ of NYC residents that were tested have tested positive for antibodies compared to only 3% upstate, could explain that discrepancy.

 

[Gumby]

An interesting statistic from one of the calls over the weekend. Currently Ro state wide is 0.8. Downstate it is 0.75 and upstate it is 0.9. I suspect that the recent tests they did that show that 20%+ of NYC residents that were tested have tested positive for antibodies compared to only 3% upstate, could explain that discrepancy.

If I may pick a nit. R sub 0 is the basic reproduction number of the virus with no interventions. It is a measure of the innate infectiousness if a virus. You are talking about about R sub e, which is the effective reproduction number after intervention. R sub e can vary over time, depending on how effective the interventions are. R sub 0 does not vary; it has been calculated to be between 2.2 and 5.7 (It will take a long time to be more accurate than that).

 

[jim584672]

The # of people showing no signs of illness, yet test positive has me concerned the test is not accurate.

That is what I am thinking. If so many have had it then wouldn't there have been a ton of people in the ER long before this was a major story? It doesn't add up.

 

[Music Lover]

That is what I am thinking. If so many have had it then wouldn't there have been a ton of people in the ER long before this was a major story? It doesn't add up.

That depends...no one knows when those people were infected. But the evidence grows daily that a high percentage of people are getting the virus and not getting sick. That's good news if you prefer a low fatality rate.

New York sent elderly people with the virus back to care homes rather than keep them in the hospital. That may not have been a good idea as the most vulnerable people were exposed.

 

[NameRedacted]

The re-opening in NY is beginning. Starting next week many upstate hospitals will be allowed to conduct elective surgeries. There are a bunch of conditions attached the biggest one being they have to have at least 30% beds unoccupied in case there is a sudden surge of covid-19 patients again.

 

[GravitySucks]

Open for presurgical tests now. I have a loved one that has cancer surgery delayed partially due to the shutdown. Glad she's not Downstate.

The re-opening in NY is beginning. Starting next week many upstate hospitals will be allowed to conduct elective surgeries. There are a bunch of conditions attached the biggest one being they have to have at least 30% beds unoccupied in case there is a sudden surge of covid-19 patients again.

 

[audreyh1]

New York sent elderly people with the virus back to care homes rather than keep them in the hospital. That may not have been a good idea as the most vulnerable people were exposed.

Yes, this is a huge problem as most care homes do not have the resources to isolated sick residents, and do not have the PPE for staff to care for them, and so staff get sick and spread it to other residents. It moves through an elderly care home very quickly.

 

[eytonxav]

This link contains a study that analyzed statistics from many Covid cases from NYC and might be interesting to those that like to look at data:
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/ja...KswGGFR-LHbaXbNeZnhC0ynOsn68TReEe8rPyNtQhE-xk

 

[NameRedacted]

Yes, this is a huge problem as most care homes do not have the resources to isolated sick residents, and do not have the PPE for staff to care for them, and so staff get sick and spread it to other residents. It moves through an elderly care home very quickly.

Governor Cuomo has been asked about this several times on his calls and he's been very clear. If a nursing home does not have the resources to take care of a resident they MUST find a home that can. If they are unable to do that they should contact the NY Department of Health immediately and they will find somewhere for them to go.


The reason that patients are sent back to the nursing home is because that is where they live. It's just the same as for any other patient released from hospital.


The only penalty for the nursing home if they can't accept the patient is loss of revenue.




This all makes sense when you think about it. And this rule doesn't apply just to Covid-19. It's for every medical condition. If a resident develops a condition that the home does not support they have to find somewhere else or get the Department of Health to do so.

 

[Chuckanut]

Apparently out of state medical workers who worked more than 14 days in New York State have to pay NY state income tax on their earnings while in the state.

https://www.theblaze.com/news/new-york-volunteer-medical-workers-income-tax

If a 2nd wave hits NYC, things might even be more dire.

You can’t make this stuff up.

 

[Just_Steve]

Apparently out of state medical workers who worked more than 14 days in New York State have to pay NY state income tax on their earnings while in the state.

https://www.theblaze.com/news/new-york-volunteer-medical-workers-income-tax

If a 2nd wave hits NYC, things might even be more dire.

You can’t make this stuff up.

Whats your states tax law regarding people that work in your state? I'm sure it's silent on this.
You and the media act as if the volunteers are being targeted.
In order to get tax law changed it has to be through the normal process.
Just more fake news.

 

[copyright1997reloaded]

Whats your states tax law regarding people that work in your state? I'm sure it's silent on this.
You and the media act as if the volunteers are being targeted.
In order to get tax law changed it has to be through the normal process.
Just more fake news.

In what way is it "fake"? I just read the article, and it discusses NY, no place else.

Facts:
1. If someone from another state works in NY state for > 14 days, they are are subject to NYS income tax.
2. The Governor was asked about this (and whether an exception could be made for health care workers). Answer: No.

From the Wall Street Journal:

When Gov. Andrew Cuomo appealed in March for health-care workers to come to New York and help fight the Covid-19 epidemic, some 21,000 people from around the country volunteered. Thousands came, toiling under difficult conditions and earning the admiration of New Yorkers.

Now these workers are learning they’ll make another contribution to the state. Mr. Cuomo said earlier this week they’ll have to pay state taxes on income earned while they were in New York. Heroes a few weeks ago, they are now pawns in a struggle between Mr. Cuomo and Washington. “If we don’t get more money from Washington, we can’t fund schools at the rate we want to fund them. We are in dire financial need,” Mr. Cuomo said in explaining why the state couldn’t afford to provide what he called “subsidies” to guest workers.

I quoted from the WSJ, perhaps you would consider that less "fake". source: https://www.wsj.com/articles/cuomo-to-covid-volunteers-pay-up-11588892159"]source: https://www.wsj.com/articles/cuomo-to-covid-volunteers-pay-up-11588892159[/URL]

Or, alternatively from Staten Island:
https://www.silive.com/coronavirus/2020/05/out-of-state-healthcare-workers-still-subject-to-ny-income-tax.html

New York state waived its state tax for three months when volunteers came from out-of-state to assist New York in recovery efforts following Hurricane Sandy.


Gov. Andrew Cuomo said he would like to do the same for the thousands of workers who flocked to the state to help with the COVID-19 pandemic, but the state can’t afford to.

So the deeper context on this is that there is an earlier example of waiving NYS income taxes for relief workers (e.g. Hurricane Sandy volunteers).

I know (as a NYS resident) one thing, having to file a NYS income tax PLUS another states income tax return is a PITA, one that I would do just about everything to avoid.

 

[EastWest Gal]

I file income tax returns in PA and CA and have since 2008 since I own property in CA. If your income is earned in a state, you file a nonresident’s return in that state. I pay twice on the income earned in California.

Governor Cuomo didn’t write the tax laws. I’m glad he’s reminding folks of the facts. Most of those helping out in NY are W-2 workers and wouldn’t have known that.

Don’t shoot the messenger.

 

[copyright1997reloaded]

I file income tax returns in PA and CA and have since 2008 since I own property in CA. If your income is earned in a state, you file a nonresident’s return in that state. I pay twice on the income earned in California.

Governor Cuomo didn’t write the tax laws. I’m glad he’s reminding folks of the facts. Most of those helping out in NY are W-2 workers and wouldn’t have known that.

Don’t shoot the messenger.

Again, the real issue seems to be that it was done differently during Hurricane Sandy and now. Cuomo was the governor then, and now. (I don't know how/what magic was done then to eliminate taxes.)

Now, it is being used as fodder in the we need $ from the federal government saga.

Not shooting the messenger (you), but perhaps the other messenger (Cuomo) is playing games too.

 

[lucky penny]

Again, the real issue seems to be that it was done differently during Hurricane Sandy and now. Cuomo was the governor then, and now. (I don't know how/what magic was done then to eliminate taxes.)

Now, it is being used as fodder in the we need $ from the federal government saga.

Not shooting the messenger (you), but perhaps the other messenger (Cuomo) is playing games too.

These are very different times.

Games? In NY it doesn't feel like a game. Cuomo can't wave a magic wand to produce money where there is none and in the present circumstances it's far from clear that NY will get a fair share of the $$ assistance being doled out.

 

[jim584672]

The story is just another dig at New York, it isn't a newsworthy story. The culture war must go on.

 

[eytonxav]

These are very different times.

Games? In NY it doesn't feel like a game. Cuomo can't wave a magic wand to produce money where there is none and in the present circumstances it's far from clear that NY will get a fair share of the $$ assistance being doled out.

NYS and City had significant financial issues prior to the pandemic. Getting assistance for all states due to Covid impacts seems like a reasonable request to consider, but expecting all US tax payers to bailout poor financial stewardship pre-pandemic by some states and cities is not. I am sure Cuomo is wanting a complete bailout

 

[jim584672]

New York was not in a bad financial position prior to COVID-19. Fiscal year ending 3/31 had a 8.9 billion dollar surplus. NY legally can't run a deficit.

 

[Chuckanut]

Whats your states tax law regarding people that work in your state? I'm sure it's silent on this.

Very silent. We have no state income tax.

What NY is doing may be perfectly OK from the legal point of view. And that is certainly important. I am not arguing it's legality. I am arguing the wisdom of taxing people who put their own health at risk to help you.

What happens if the 2nd wave of the virus hits them again and they put out a call for out of state medical help. They have created a disincentive for out of state medical personnel to come to NY. That may not be wise.

 

[jim584672]

They work in a state with an income tax, they get taxed. Wow, not news. If they don't like it they can stay at home.

 

[gwraigty]

I am arguing the wisdom of taxing people who put their own health at risk to help you.

What happens if the 2nd wave of the virus hits them again and they put out a call for out of state medical help. They have created a disincentive for out of state medical personnel to come to NY. That may not be wise.

They work in a state with an income tax, they get taxed. Wow, not news. If they don't like it they can stay at home.

They just may stay home and Chuck states the potential problem with that very well.

 

[GravitySucks]

NYS and City had significant financial issues prior to the pandemic. Getting assistance for all states due to Covid impacts seems like a reasonable request to consider, but expecting all US tax payers to bailout poor financial stewardship pre-pandemic by some states and cities is not. I am sure Cuomo is wanting a complete bailout

Any proof of what you're stating?
NY public pension was relatively well funded. NY bonds were highly rated. NY transfers more wealth to the Federal government / other states than any other state.

Plus I've never heard a NY Senator say we shouldn't bail out xx state when they have a national disaster like the hurricanes that hit ever couple years.

This is the sort of bull we hear from the rest of the country that has no basis in fact. The truth is NY sends the US $1.30 for ever buck back, then citizens of other states that get a $1 for every 80¢ they send Washington complain about NY. It dumbfounds me.