Romantic Relationships Post FIRE

[FLD3C]

After you retire, but before you purchase a condo in a MCOL area, take a 6 month trip to the Philippines.
You will find that the only single expats, want to be single

 

[teej1985]

After you retire, but before you purchase a condo in a MCOL area, take a 6 month trip to the Philippines.
You will find that the only single expats, want to be single

Eh? Its' easy to find Bachelorette Expats in the Phillipines?

 

[livingalmostlarge]

More like at your age and I'm close to it there are still a lot of women thinking of kids. I have more than a few who froze eggs in their 30s. Just be clear in expectations of what you want out of life rather than money. I mean one does influence the other greatly so being on same wavelength will be important or you could lose a lot of money in a divorce

 

[Koolau]

If I were you, but obviously not you, I would not retire anytime soon. My husband and I both had saved several millions on our own when we first met and we are equals in every way including financially. If your expenses are $40K a year, you are limited to finding partners who also live on about $40K a year on their own. If you have more savings, you can expand your potential pool of partners. My husband and I spend about $240K a year when working and in retirement. If I become single/widowed/divorced again, and if I were to have a romantic partner again, in which I won't, I would only be interested in someone who is in similar financial situation and lifestyle.

I'm a long time married guy but I agree that your financial situation (and spending) should match closely. DW and I are very much in tune when it comes to financial issues. We have never "fought" about money though we've been stressed a few times in our early years together.

I always made more money than she did, but she never over spent. She's pretty much uninterested in finances and leaves that to me. BUT she keeps the check book up, pays the bills on time and lets me know when she needs an infusion of cash to cover future expenditures/bills. It w*rks very well and I consider her an equal partner, financially (and otherwise.)

We have similar values, politics, religion, child rearing ideas, (now in the past), etc. In short, we are compatible - often because we have been willing to adapt to each other.

Good luck with your search. I think I'd suggest you keep w*rking for a while to increase your stash, but that's more me than you kind of thinking, so YMMV.

 

[badatmath]

I dated people with significantly different economic circumstances, and we never fit particularly well. Our approach to life just differed too much. One had maxed out credit cards, another was ready for a private jet. Neither were my scene. I suspect even if both of a couple are savers, if one has a very large multiple of the savings of the other, the odds of incompatibility go up. YMMV

+1

 

[youbet]

I'm a long time married guy.

Yeah, me too. DW and I have been together since we were 16 living back in "da hood" in Chicago. We married legally at 22 and are now 76. It's tough for me to vision OP's situation as ours is so different. But, having disqualified myself due to not understand a bit about his life style, I'd suggest keeping career and FIRE decisions separate from romantic desires.

 

[brett]

I would never venture suggesting any romantic advice.

But, believe that financial advice, FIRE advice, and romantic advice are mutually exclusive.

Tying them into a single decision is, IMHO, danger, danger.

 

[Amethyst]

Since being widowed, I have concluded that if I expect physical and intellectual compatibility in the same male human being as the ability to travel at the same level I can, I will be traveling alone for the rest of my life.

I'm certainly not sharing a cruise cabin with somebody I don't cotton to, merely because he has dough to spend. (Yes, an offer was made, and rejected).

No different, I suppose, from what men have dealt with since time immemorial.

 

[Lsbcal]

Since being widowed, I have concluded that if I expect physical and intellectual compatibility in the same male human being as the ability to travel at the same level I can, I will be traveling alone for the rest of my life.

I'm certainly not sharing a cruise cabin with somebody I don't cotton to, merely because he has dough to spend. (Yes, an offer was made, and rejected).

No different, I suppose, from what men have dealt with since time immemorial.

Interesting comment. But I really don't understand the 1st sentence.

Also maybe a cruise cabin is too close at first? Never did a cruise with DW because we both like to poke around on land and take our time. Also perhaps a bit too social for us.

 

[LateToFIRE]

If I were you, but obviously not you, I would not retire anytime soon. My husband and I both had saved several millions on our own when we first met and we are equals in every way including financially. If your expenses are $40K a year, you are limited to finding partners who also live on about $40K a year on their own. If you have more savings, you can expand your potential pool of partners. My husband and I spend about $240K a year when working and in retirement. If I become single/widowed/divorced again, and if I were to have a romantic partner again, in which I won't, I would only be interested in someone who is in similar financial situation and lifestyle.

Hey RetiredHappy, your $240K spend caught my eye. This is about what DW and I expect spend in retirement. Not often that I find someone on this board with comparable figures, so curious to know how your budget breaks down.

Here's what ours looks like:

Mortgage, rent		0
Property taxes		10,000
Utilities		15,000
Home insurance		5,000
Home maintenance		15,000
Wellness/Other Medical		10,000
Health insurance		15,000
Vehicles/Fuel		15,000
Misc/Discretionary		100,000
Other		0
Groceries		30,000
Restaurants		15,000
Clothing		0
Vacation/Travel		25,000
Other		0
Total		255,000

As you can see there is a lot of "fluff" like misc. and travel, so this is a very flexible budget, but it reflects the lifestyle we enjoy now - except that we'll sell our primary residence and switch to our 2nd home in retirement - and plus more spending on vacation travel in the early years.

Adding: This budget excludes taxes which could range $40-$60K per year over the life of retirement. I expect our budget could swell to $300K in high spend years (big vacations, renovation, toys) and shrink to $200K, or even as little as $150K in lean years if inflation, markets do not cooperate. Have run numbers thru i-ORP, RPM, FireCalc, etc. with green light results.

 

[Souschef]

After my wife passed away, I was involved with an on line grief recovery chatroom. The people there were very helpful in handling my loss. I noticed one widow in particular who was an extremely caring person.

I had mentioned I had done some traveling, and she asked ,"where in the world do you live?".

As fate would have it, we lived 40 miles apart, and agreed to meet for lunch half way. That was the start of many halfway lunches and just helping each other with our loses.
We were married in Santorini, Greece, and just celebrated our 16th anniversary.
Life is good!

 

[teej1985]

But, believe that financial advice, FIRE advice, and romantic advice are mutually exclusive.

Tying them into a single decision is, IMHO, danger, danger.

I don't understand this mindset. Isn't money one of the leading causes of failed marriages/relationships?

 

[RetiredHappy]

Hey RetiredHappy, your $240K spend caught my eye. This is about what DW and I expect spend in retirement. Not often that I find someone on this board with comparable figures, so curious to know how your budget breaks down.

Here's what ours looks like:

Mortgage, rent		0
Property taxes		10,000
Utilities		15,000
Home insurance		5,000
Home maintenance		15,000
Wellness/Other Medical		10,000
Health insurance		15,000
Vehicles/Fuel		15,000
Misc/Discretionary		100,000
Other		0
Groceries		30,000
Restaurants		15,000
Clothing		0
Vacation/Travel		25,000
Other		0
Total		255,000

As you can see there is a lot of "fluff" like misc. and travel, so this is a very flexible budget, but it reflects the lifestyle we enjoy now - except that we'll sell our primary residence and switch to our 2nd home in retirement - and plus more spending on vacation travel in the early years.

Adding: This budget excludes taxes which could range $40-$60K per year over the life of retirement. I expect our budget could swell to $300K in high spend years (big vacations, renovation, toys) and shrink to $200K, or even as little as $150K in lean years if inflation, markets do not cooperate. Have run numbers thru i-ORP, RPM, FireCalc, etc. with green light results.

We have alot of lumpy expenses which are not included in the numbers. For instance, we redid our backyard last year and it cost us $50K. We are currently adding a golf cart garage and we have written a check of $15K and still counting. We also just bought a second golf cart, hence the need to add a garage - that cart cost $18K.

Anyway, here is the 2024 budget, mirroring 2023 regular spendings. $200K not including taxes. $240K including taxes.

Home Expenses
- HOA	$6,100
- Pool, Yard, Pest Control	$3,500
- Water, Sewer Garbage	$3,000
- Property Tax	$4,500
- Home insurance	$1,500
- Internet, Streaming, Security Monitoring	$2,500
- Electricity and Gas	$6,500
- Housecleaning Service	$5,000
- Home maintenance/projects	$15,000
Home Subtotal	$47,600
- Personal cell/tablet/devices	$2,800
- Auto Insurance	$2,300
- Road tax / Vehicle Registration	$800
- Umbrella Insurance	$250
- Car maintenance	$1,500
- Car replacement funds	$4,000
Auto and Electronics Subtotal	$11,650
- Country club membership dues (golf)	$15,500
- Golf when travelling (3 months a year)	$7,000
- Golf lessons	$2,000
- Golf new equipment, balls, gloves	$3,000
Golf Expenses Subtotal	$27,500
- Medical (pre-Medicare)+Copay+Drugs+LTCI	$19,000
- Medicare + Plan F Sup. + Drugs (Trulicity)	$9,000
- Concierge doctor fees	$5,000
Medical Subtotal	$33,000
- Timeshare Maint. Fees	$15,000
- Airfare and rental car	$5,000
- Dining out during travel	$8,000
Vacation Subtotal (3 months)	$28,000
- Food (lunch out everyday) + Groceries	$25,000
- Personal grooming, gifts, hobbies	$8,000
Other credit card Subtotal	$33,000
Gifting for son	$18,000
Grand Total	$198,750

 

[FLSUnFIRE]

These threads take some weird left turns but didn't expect people to be comparing how much they spend on golf balls and vehicle registration within the first 100 posts. LOL

 

[Amethyst]

Cruising is obviously too intimate for a first date, but that doesn't stop some people from bringing it up; you'd be surprised.

Besides the intimacy, a sticking point would be the level of travel that each one expects, and can afford.

Interesting comment. But I really don't understand the 1st sentence.

Also maybe a cruise cabin is too close at first? Never did a cruise with DW because we both like to poke around on land and take our time. Also perhaps a bit too social for us.

 

[LateToFIRE]

These threads take some weird left turns but didn't expect people to be comparing how much they spend on golf balls and vehicle registration within the first 100 posts. LOL

Hey, you gotta ask when the oppty presents itself. Didn't mean to sidetrack the discussion. Just trying to sanity check some of my retirement budgetary assumptions vs someone with a similar profile - I suppose could have PM'd on the side.

 

[LateToFIRE]

We have alot of lumpy expenses which are not included in the numbers. For instance, we redid our backyard last year and it cost us $50K. We are currently adding a golf cart garage and we have written a check of $15K and still counting. We also just bought a second golf cart, hence the need to add a garage - that cart cost $18K.

Anyway, here is the 2024 budget, mirroring 2023 regular spendings. $200K not including taxes. $240K including taxes.

Home Expenses
- HOA	$6,100
- Pool, Yard, Pest Control	$3,500
- Water, Sewer Garbage	$3,000
- Property Tax	$4,500
- Home insurance	$1,500
- Internet, Streaming, Security Monitoring	$2,500
- Electricity and Gas	$6,500
- Housecleaning Service	$5,000
- Home maintenance/projects	$15,000
Home Subtotal	$47,600
- Personal cell/tablet/devices	$2,800
- Auto Insurance	$2,300
- Road tax / Vehicle Registration	$800
- Umbrella Insurance	$250
- Car maintenance	$1,500
- Car replacement funds	$4,000
Auto and Electronics Subtotal	$11,650
- Country club membership dues (golf)	$15,500
- Golf when travelling (3 months a year)	$7,000
- Golf lessons	$2,000
- Golf new equipment, balls, gloves	$3,000
Golf Expenses Subtotal	$27,500
- Medical (pre-Medicare)+Copay+Drugs+LTCI	$19,000
- Medicare + Plan F Sup. + Drugs (Trulicity)	$9,000
- Concierge doctor fees	$5,000
Medical Subtotal	$33,000
- Timeshare Maint. Fees	$15,000
- Airfare and rental car	$5,000
- Dining out during travel	$8,000
Vacation Subtotal (3 months)	$28,000
- Food (lunch out everyday) + Groceries	$25,000
- Personal grooming, gifts, hobbies	$8,000
Other credit card Subtotal	$33,000
Gifting for son	$18,000
Grand Total	$198,750

Thanks! Appreciate the level of detail and explanation. I suspect I'm over-estimating our budget by quite a bit - notice the big discretionary category. Once I'm no longer working each day and we've consolidated into one home, I think the dust will settle on expenditures as life will be about 10x simpler.

On the other hand, I suspect that I may be underestimating on health insurance at least in the short run as won't qualify for Medicare for a few more years, though expect to have access to employer's retiree plan.

I also noted that golf is a big expenditure for you - I'm not a golfer, but will probably come up with some equally expensive pursuits with all the newfound time I may have on my hands.

And, good points on all the lumpy expentitures - we seem to experience the same each year - landscaping, new shed, new pool coping, new car, and so on, there's always something. I figured that would settle down in retirement but maybe not.

Also, income taxes will probably not be quite the hit that I'm predicting because we'll have a significant amount of after-tax proceeds from various liquidity events, such as sale of r.e. But, do plan to do some Roth conversions in the first few years to try to minimize pain of significant RMD's later on.

Again, thanks for the thoughts.

Now, back to the regularly scheduled programming

 

[Koolau]

These threads take some weird left turns but didn't expect people to be comparing how much they spend on golf balls and vehicle registration within the first 100 posts. LOL

At least, there's no extra charge for the additional information and, if you're not satisfied, we give you your money back on your forum registration fee!

 

[FLSUnFIRE]

At least, there's no extra charge for the additional information and, if you're not satisfied, we give you your money back on your forum registration fee!

I've been here a while. I don't expect any active thread to stay OT...just a little further into left field than I expected!

 

[teej1985]

I've been here a while. I don't expect any active thread to stay OT...just a little further into left field than I expected!

Yeah I definitely wasn't expecting that either, but good for them to find each other and swap their budgets.

 

[Sunset]

......
Here's what ours looks like:

Mortgage, rent		0
Property taxes		10,000
Utilities		15,000
Home insurance		5,000
Home maintenance		15,000
Wellness/Other Medical		10,000
Health insurance		15,000
Vehicles/Fuel		15,000
Misc/Discretionary		100,000
Other		0
Groceries		30,000
Restaurants		15,000
Clothing		0
Vacation/Travel		25,000
Other		0
Total		255,000

.....

I have to ask, since you have Restaurants in there already.

How do you spend $30K on groceries

I spend $5K for the both of us each year on avg for past 5 years..

 

[kilkoyne]

When I was in my 30s I was in nursing school. I was with a bunch of low income earners so I figured I'd wait until I was working in a hospital to date someone who was making a decent income.

Well that didn't happen because everyone I was interested in was already in a relationship. I changed hospitals a few times and could never find someone single who I was interested in. I tried numerous online dating sites along the way also.

Now I'm pushing 60 and still haven't found anyone. The good thing is I'm very happy the way things are in my life.

What I learned from all of this is things don't always go the way you even if you try. You can try to find someone but that may not happen. Enjoy and live your life however you wish and the right person will come along.....or they may not.

 

[LateToFIRE]

I have to ask, since you have Restaurants in there already.

How do you spend $30K on groceries

I spend $5K for the both of us each year on avg for past 5 years..

Lol, good question. The simple answer is that it's just a SWAG (stupid wild a** guess). First all, we live in VHCOL areas and DW is fond of organic everything (please don't judge), so most of our shopping is at a hyper-expensive local grocer - quality on produce, meat, fish, etc., is top notch, but so are their prices. If there is meat/fish in the shopping cart, its not unusual to ring up $200. If we do that twice a week, that's $400/week times 52 = $21K. So, I guess I kinda added some fluff in there. Oops. I did say there was a lot of fluff.

Now in ret., which is coming up soon, when we'll have more time than money, we'll go further out of our way to save a buck, or a lotta bucks, and hit the big mega-super-markets, which could probably cut our bill in half. And consolidating into our weekend home, and spending more time preparing meals that can be frozen, etc., there will just be far less waste.

So, your point is a good one, though I don't think we'll ever come close to your $5K tab. Now, on restaurants, pre-pandemic, we used to eat out a lot, like practically every other day. Doesn't feel like we'll be returning to that pace - just not as enjoyable as it used to be - costs more, quality is lower, and we quite enjoy our own cooking when we have the time for it.

So, I figure 1-2 times a week, figure $250/week times 52 = $13K, so that's probably about right for the next couple years. I was trying to create a "change absolutely nothing from our pre-retirement lifestyle" budget but went a little too far.

I know my numbers seem a bit crazy to a lot of people, but conversely, numbers like your $5K for groceries seem impossible to me - perhaps a function of too many years living in NYC, which is where I've spent nearly all my adult life.

Anecdote: During the holidays, I recently filled up a shopping cart at one of the big grocery store chains (outside NYC), and at the check out counter the tab came to ~$120, to which I jumped for joy and exclaimed to the cashier "wow, that's so much less than I was expecting." She gave me a quizzical look (like who is this insane person) and remarked "well I don't hear that very often." Yes, I know I need to get out more.

Update: I just ran a credit card search and under the groceries category tab for 2023 was $12K. Now that includes just about any food that is not a sit-down restaurant - so, bagel for breakfast, sandwich for lunch, etc. in NYC you can easily spend $20-$30 a day on breakfast & lunch. Also, a lot of our groceries when in the city purchased at small mom & pop stores, bodegas, etc., where prices are easily double what a super-market would charge for similar goods. I don't have wife's credit card info, but would assume she spends a little less (not going to an office everyday, leaves a lot of shopping to me as she can't lift heavy stuff). But, this kinda verifies the current ~$20K figure, which may be somewhat lower in retirement.

 

[Time2]

I'll be hitting my FIRE number within the next few years and I'm scared that retiring early will make it that much harder for me to find a relationship because retiring in your 40s is obviously rather uncommon and possibly not relatable for most people in society. I'd like to hear from any single folk who have retired younger than normal and were able to find a long term relationship after they had started their retirement. It's tricky because if I had a partner now I might be willing to inflate my lifestyle a bit to achieve some common shared goal, but I don't see a reason to just keep working when I don't even know if I'm going to find someone else, but if I do meet someone after i retire, it might be harder to turn back the income. Or, I can target some lower withdrawal rate instead of 4%, but that just kicks the can down the road and there might continue to not be a partner in sight.

You have 20+ years ahead of you, if you want a partner and work towards that goal, I'm sure you could have a partner. So plan your finances accordingly. On the other hand if you want a partner and have no gumption to run the gauntlet of dating, then the chance of getting a partner are reduced.

 

[Sunset]

OP - In your shoes, I'd keep working especially as you want to find a partner.

While working I found many opportunities for partner's as there was lots of occasions to meet other workers in the office, at training, etc.. Now sometimes I didn't realize what was happening (kinda naive) until later on , and then was too shy to revisit the person with the intent of asking for a date.

The reality is office romances (IMHO) have a better chance of success than some dating app, because you have no pressure, can both over time interact a bunch, and get to know a person, then go on a date.

Beyond all that, as you allude, there is the societal view, a working person is more interesting and stable and productive than an unemployed non-working person that could be a burden, which is how young retiree's can be viewed. (you are not really going to show your investments on the date).