bosco said:Is there some reason they shouldn't be paid comparably?
ADJ said:This is an excellent question. I too want to know because I know many people making around $100K and it's tough to have a fairly decent standard of living (nice well-furnished house in a middle class neighborhood, nice cars and at least a nice vacation every year). Could $100K do this?
bosco said:I'm not a teacher, nor did I ever want to be. But the last time I checked, working as a teacher required the same level of education and (at least for the good ones) dedication as, say, an engineer, architect, accountant, or other professional. Is there some reason they shouldn't be paid comparably?
2B said:She says there are regular attempts to "encourage" high seniority teachers to leave.
OldMcDonald said:Because they only have to work about 1100 hours per year as compared to most people who have to work 2000...
2B said:The only "shortage" is in science and math because there people with the right skills have better paying options.
What is a Moderate Income?
youbet said:There are shortages other than science and math. Special Ed teachers with certifications in behavior disorders and various learning disorders are in demand. Also, various therapists such as speech therapy, occupational therapy, physical therapy, etc. are in short supply within the public school systems.
bosco said:clearly you've never spent much time with a teacher. Or at least a good one.
Yep, it's a tough gig.2B said:From my stint as a long term sub, I saw a turnover in Special Ed by either quitting for a non-teaching job or getting certified in some other subject and teaching that.
Not true ref the certification. Can't imagine how your sources came to that wrong conclusion. Ref burnout, yes it's a tough gig.I was told that special ed is the easiest certification to get but that most people burn out in 3 years or less.
Whether you consider therapists "teachers" or not is not the point. They are there in the schools, teaching the children, and are in very short supply. It's not just math and science teachers that are in short supply.As for the other things you listed, I don't consider them teachers but "other professions" that happen to work for a school district. My SIL is a speech therapist. You are correct that they get teacher benefits.
OldMcDonald said:Any possibility you think being married to a teacher makes you more than a little biased? I'd say my position on the school committee, who sits in contract negotiations and see what really goes on gives me a much better and objective view of how schools are run then someone married to a teacher.
OK, I understand the regional part. But, if your committee is the "school board" with the authority to hire and fire, set pay levels, work rules and policies, etc., and you are the chairperson, why are you running things this way? Don't take this personally, but gosh OldMcDonald, your school system is a reflection of YOU. YOU da man/woman. Were you just recently elected and haven't had time to grab the reigns and change things yet? Or perhaps no one else wants the job and you're just going through the motions? It seems like you're complaining up a storm about an organization you have authority to change. Am I misunderstanding?OldMcDonald said:A regional school committee is the school committee for a regional school...one that serves multiple towns - common in small towns where there are not enough students to make a school by themselves..
If those senior teachers got "bought out" of their sick days, then they *used* all of them...i.e. they got paid for them.
sgeeeee said:Less than a high income but more than a low income.
Does that help?
If that isn't specific enough, any poster on the board is invited to send me recent tax returns and I will evaluate them and let you know whether your income is moderate or not. This service will cost only $19.95 per person or family.
windsurf said:Old Mac:Schools are run for the benefit of the teachers first and foremost...most teachers will do right by the kids ONLY AFTER they get what they want...when push comes to shove if its a choice between doing whats right for the kids, or right for the teachers, the teachers and their unions will ALWAYS put their priorities first and screw the kids - I've got plenty of exampes.
This is overgeneralized BS. I watched my wife leave every morning at 8:30 am and return home at 5:30 pm (half hour commute). MUch evening and weekend work. Over 25 tears, thousands of our money spent on materials. You are an angry, misinformed person who seems to hate the profession for actual reasons you don't specify. Yes, there are some crappy teachers but, on the average, I saw more productivity from them than I see in much of the corporate sector.
OldMcDonald said:Actually I have...being the chairperson of the regional school committee in which I live gives me plenty of time with teachers and the school system...(and because I've seen the school system close up I homeschool all my children)...1100 hours per year would be the MAX most teachers would work...there is only 180 school days, about 6 hours work per school day, ALL the teachers take every single one of their sick/personal days they have coming, and if you want them to do 5 extra minutes work beyond what the contract requires...in comes the union. Don't tell me I haven't spent much time with teachers...I've spent plenty (and thus the homeschooling).
bosco said:Once again, I originally asked why teachers should make less than other comparably-educated professionals.