WiFi vs Hardwired/Ethernet Speed?

Create a 5GHz SSID with different name. Connect to that.
Could that be the root issue with my slow WiFi speeds? I’m paying a premium for 300/300 fiber, maybe naive but I expect AT&T to tell me why I’m only getting about 30-50 Mbps?
 
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Reviving a topic I raised about 6 months ago, still battling.

All else equal and no device restrictions, if you have a 300/300 Mbps fiber internet connection, how fast should your WiFi connection be? I’ve done several searches without seeing much specific, a few said WiFi should be 300/150 on our setup, most just said WiFi is slower (duh?).

TMI
  • If I run a speed test on my Ethernet connection via PC I always get more than 300/300 Mbps.
  • Our AT&T Pace 5268ac gateway is capable of 1 Gbps.
  • If I run a speed test on my WiFi connection via iPad or iPhone I am getting 30-50 Mbps down and 15-30 Mbps up. About 5-10% of wired? Latency ranges from 15-30 ms.
  • My iPad is supposed to be capable of 866 Mbps, my iPhone of 433 Mbps.
  • I’ve talked to [-]India[/-] tech service about a dozen times, they’re always excessively polite, upbeat and “going to fix the problem” - but nothing has changed. They’ve rebooted, run diagnostics and “changed my config” over and over. Had a tech in home visit once, no change. They just gave us a new gateway, no change.

A silly question, Midpack. How do you know you have fiber instead of DSL or cable? With us AT&T was deliberately dishonest, insisting they gave us fiber when in reality it was DSL. It took them a year to acknowledge the misrepresentation.
 
A silly question, Midpack. How do you know you have fiber instead of DSL or cable? With us AT&T was deliberately dishonest, insisting they gave us fiber when in reality it was DSL. It took them a year to acknowledge the misrepresentation.
  • I’ve taken AT&T’s word for it (for 6 months),
  • the gateway input is ONT (Optical Network Terminal) and not DSL or cable, and
  • when I run a hardwired/Ethernet speed test I always get almost 400/400 Mbps. I didn’t think DSL or cable could reach those speeds, or be that symmetrical up and down.
But it would not surprise me if it turns out to be something that simple, so fair question like all the others. If I’m off track above, please let me know.
 
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I have Frontier Fios 100/100. I am WiFi only. Anyway, I just tested the speed and it was very 98/101.

Midpack -- This just doesn't sound right. Not sure what is causing your problem but you should be doing much better than you are doing.
 
Are you able to connect the input of your Nighthawk to the wired output of the AT&T device? Then, connect a wireless device to the Nighthawk to measure throughput. It's a slight bit of extra lag but I'll bet it improves your throughput.
 
Are you able to connect the input of your Nighthawk to the wired output of the AT&T device? Then, connect a wireless device to the Nighthawk to measure throughput. It's a slight bit of extra lag but I'll bet it improves your throughput.
I was doing exactly that with my Arris 210-700 gateway, but it hasn’t worked with the Pace 5268ac.
 
While it does seem you should get higher WiFi rates on those devices with 300/300 available wired, does it really matter?

30-50 Mbps is plenty fast for just about everything you'd do on a portable device (except downloading a 1GB OS file or something). If you run the test on 2 devices at the same time, does the rate drop in half, or does the WiFi seem to manage to get 30-50 to multiple devices?

I'd follow up on the naming of the 2.4 vs 5 GB bands though, it would be helpful to know which you are using. Or an app on your device should be able to tell you.

“My iPad (Air 2) is supposed to be capable of 866 Mbps, my iPhone (6 Plus) of 433 Mbps.”

I just went into the AT&T device manager and it’s assigned all 8 of our devices to 2.4 GHz?

But are your devices rated at 866 Mbps and 433 Mbps on the 2.4G band (which is what you appear to be connected to)? Or is that a capability only on the 5 G band?

-ERD50
 
Create a 5GHz SSID with different name. Connect to that.

Its my understanding that you need to be pretty close to modem to get much benefit from using the 5GHz signal. Ideally, you should use the 2.4GHz band to connect devices for low bandwidth activities like browsing the Internet. On the other hand, 5GHz is the best suited for high-bandwidth devices or activities like gaming and streaming HDTV.

The primary differences between the 2.4 GHz and 5GHz wireless frequencies are range and bandwidth. 5GHz provides faster data rates at a shorter distance. 2.4GHz offers coverage for farther distances, but may perform at slower speeds. Range : how far your data can travel
 
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I was doing exactly that with my Arris 210-700 gateway, but it hasn’t worked with the Pace 5268ac.

Wow. Now there's a puzzle for me. I'm guessing that you correctly plugged the Nighthawk into one of the 4 yellow ethernet ports, labeled "local internet" on the Pace. (And, you probably already know that the red "Ethernet" port is for connecting the Pace to an alternate internet source and should not be used for anything in your setup.)

I'm really scratching my head trying to figure out how the device is stopping your Nighthawk from working. Perhaps you will have some luck if you change the base address (in LAN setup) of the Nighthawk to 192.168.2.1 to better isolate it from the address range of the Pace.
 
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Alternatively, go into Nighthawk "Advanced -> Advanced Setup -> Router/AP/Bridge/Repeating Mode" and change the setting to AP Mode. This will let the Pace do all of the routing.
 
I was doing exactly that with my Arris 210-700 gateway, but it hasn’t worked with the Pace 5268ac.

From the links I posted, I surmised the Pace has to be set to bridge mode. I could be wrong.
 
Its my understanding that you need to be pretty close to modem to get much benefit from using the 5GHz signal. Ideally, you should use the 2.4GHz band to connect devices for low bandwidth activities like browsing the Internet. On the other hand, 5GHz is the best suited for high-bandwidth devices or activities like gaming and streaming HDTV.

The primary differences between the 2.4 GHz and 5GHz wireless frequencies are range and bandwidth. 5GHz provides faster data rates at a shorter distance. 2.4GHz offers coverage for farther distances, but may perform at slower speeds. Range : how far your data can travel

All true. I think OP is looking to maximize the speed test. At 8 feet, the connection is 2.4 GHz. All connections are forced to 2.4GHz.
 
ERD50 said:
While it does seem you should get higher WiFi rates on those devices with 300/300 available wired, does it really matter?

30-50 Mbps is plenty fast for just about everything you'd do on a portable device (except downloading a 1GB OS file or something).
So you’re OK with paying a premium for 300 Mbps and getting 30-50 Mbps? I’d like to sell you a house and a car on that basis.
See below.
Wow. Now there's a puzzle for me. I'm guessing that you correctly plugged the Nighthawk into one of the 4 yellow ethernet ports, labeled "local internet" on the Pace. Yes (And, you probably already know that the red "Ethernet" port is for connecting the Pace to an alternate internet source and should not be used for anything in your setup.) Yes

I'm really scratching my head trying to figure out how the device is stopping your Nighthawk from working. Me too, I assumed it would work as it did with my previous gateway. Perhaps you will have some luck if you change the base address (in LAN setup) of the Nighthawk to 192.168.2.1 to better isolate it from the address range of the Pace. I’ll probably look into this and bridge mode if the tech this morning doesn’t find something substantial.
 
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Do you know how many radios/antennae are in your portable device for the band that you are using? Often for portable devices it is only one which would limit you to one spatial stream - not the three or four that modern routers and laptops support.

After you have your laptop connecting and performing at the desired
Speeds using wired ethernet, switch your laptop to wireless mode and continue the testing. Laptops will often have multiple radios per band where portable devices only have one.

Also pay attention to your hardware link speed before performing end to end tests. This can be seen in both Windows and Android on to he details/status page for the network device of interest. For wired Ethernet this should be something like 100 Mbps or 1Gbps Also for WiFi, you should know what the maximum link speed should be for a givenbumber if radios. In old 802.11G systems the max link rate was 54 Mbps. In N or AC systems, multiple radios are supported (aka multiple spatial streams). Leading to higher max link rates.

Only after you have the hardware link speed operating where you think it should be would you do an end to end peformance test (ie ookla speedtest).

Gauss

P.s. I am in the process of upgrading a 10 year old G WIFi network, so I have been learning this during the past week or so.

Adding to my previous post, now that I am not a passenger in a car returning home from vacation, is that you need to know what is the bandwidth (BW) of the channel you are using vs what you are expecting (ie marketing max speeds on the product literature).

Most routers set the BW to auto by default, which is probably not the best for troubleshooting. Original BW was 20 Mhz in the origianl 802.11g days if I am not mistaken. Subsequent version allowed channel bonding giving BW's of 40 Mhz, 80 Mhz, and 160 Mhz. A doubling of the bandwidth will typically double your link/hardware speed.

Now the bad part is that on the 2.4 Ghz band, it is very hard to get a link at more than 20 Mhz due to RF congestion in the city and the number of devices. In rural locations, higher BW (than 20 Mhz) on 2.4 Ghz may be possible. The good news is that if you operate in the 5Ghz band, getting larger than 20 Mhz working is more easily achieved due to relatively fewer 5 Ghz devices vs 2.4 Ghz.

So when you see that your 'AC' class router/AP should be able to do 433 Mbps on the hardware/link speed with a single spatial/radio stream, I believe this is assuming 80 Mhz BW - not realistic on 2.4 Ghz. 2.4 Ghz. 78 Mbps would be more likely link/hardware speed achievable in this environment. A factor of 4 difference -- just based on BW assumptions.

I have found if you google MCS index you will find charts that will help to decipher this such as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11ac half way down near "Modulation and coding schemes".

Note as I mentioned above, the link/hardware speed is what you will see when you look at your network devices status page. What type of throughput you will get via Ookla speedtest.net is a more complicated problem that brings your ISP into the picture.

Solve your local problems first!
 
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AT&T tech just left and I’m getting about 10X the WiFi speed we’ve had for 6 months :mad:. All 8 devices have connected successfully and some are on 5 GHz, others on 2.4 GHz, so steering is also working as it should. There’s a night and day difference in how fast everything runs on WiFi now. A relief after 6 months with slow WiFi and hours wasted with dozens of clueless techs 8000 miles away...
 

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AT&T tech just left and I’m getting about 10X the WiFi speed we’ve had for 6 months :mad:. All 8 devices have connected successfully and some are on 5 GHz, others on 2.4 GHz, so steering is also working as it should. There’s a night and day difference in how fast everything runs on WiFi now. A relief after 6 months with slow WiFi and hours wasted with dozens of clueless techs 8000 miles away...

That’s good. Do you know what the tech did?
 
That’s good. Do you know what the tech did?
He did a factory reset on the gateway. AT&T sent me a new gateway to install myself, but it mapped over the configuration from my old gateway. Evidently there was something wrong, mirrored in my new gateway. That’s all I know. I can not recommend AT&T internet customer service, horrible IME.
 
Glad to read a happy ending.

I was also curious about the comment that the Netgear wouldn't work downstream from the Pace. There's no way the Pace should know what's at the other end of that Ethernet cable. Sounds like you don't need it in the current network setup though.
 
AT&T tech just left and I’m getting about 10X the WiFi speed we’ve had for 6 months :mad:. All 8 devices have connected successfully and some are on 5 GHz, others on 2.4 GHz, so steering is also working as it should. There’s a night and day difference in how fast everything runs on WiFi now. A relief after 6 months with slow WiFi and hours wasted with dozens of clueless techs 8000 miles away...

YAY!!! :dance:
 
... I was also curious about the comment that the Netgear wouldn't work downstream from the Pace. There's no way the Pace should know what's at the other end of that Ethernet cable. ...

+1 This should work, and you may want to use it sometime in the future (for testing if nothing else). I'd want to see that working if it were me.


So you’re OK with paying a premium for 300 Mbps and getting 30-50 Mbps? I’d like to sell you a house and a car on that basis.
See below.

No need to get snarky or condescending, I was trying to help.

The point is, 30 - 50 Mbps per device is more than good enough for just about any purpose. Even a 4k stream 'only' requires 25 Mbps (and your iPad iPhone don't support 4k anyhow). So at some point, maybe it just isn't worth worrying about, and you can save yourself some grief and blood pressure points?

I'd bet that the main reason you are paying for 300 Mbps is so you can get multiple streams to multiple devices at the same time. So there really isn't any contradiction there.

BTW, your house/car analogy is condescending and silly. Both these products have many features that we will likely never use or try to verify. Did you verify that your car reaches it's rated top speed when you test drove it? Probably not, but you might have taken it on the highway to make sure it accelerated and reached normal driving speeds as expected. Have you tested your roof in whatever wind speed it is rated for? We have 3 bathrooms in a house with 2 people. And on and on. Relax.

-ERD50
 
He did a factory reset on the gateway. AT&T sent me a new gateway to install myself, but it mapped over the configuration from my old gateway. Evidently there was something wrong, mirrored in my new gateway. That’s all I know. I can not recommend AT&T internet customer service, horrible IME.

Totally agree with your movies on AT&T service. Glad this was resolved. A helpful thread for future problem solving ...
 
No need to get snarky or condescending, I was trying to help.

The point is, 30 - 50 Mbps per device is more than good enough for just about any purpose. Even a 4k stream 'only' requires 25 Mbps (and your iPad iPhone don't support 4k anyhow). So at some point, maybe it just isn't worth worrying about, and you can save yourself some grief and blood pressure points?

I'd bet that the main reason you are paying for 300 Mbps is so you can get multiple streams to multiple devices at the same time. So there really isn't any contradiction there.
I wasn't trying to be snarky, but your POV didn't make any sense to me. And we do have a long history of being snarky or worse with one another, we just don't think the same often. :cool:

I know how much bandwidth our devices use.

And I [-]may have been[/-] know now it was misguided, but I took 300 Mbps and the $ premium to have faster connections/less buffering, not to use more devices. We had 7 devices back when we had 25 Mbps Comcast service, and we very rarely had connection or buffering issues then. Though we now have 8 WiFi devices (3 Roku's, 2 iPads, 2 iPhones & SimpliSafe), it's very rare that more than 2-3 are connected at the same time. I will probably drop to 100 Mbps when the current promo rate we're on expires in July.
 
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Not to pile on, but I'm in Midpacks camp on this one. I pay for 200 and typically get something higher than 100 over WiFi. I can chalk that up to my equipment and some loss due to not being a wired connection. I can live with that. I would not be willing to accept what Midpack was getting (about 10 to 20 percent of max). Of course the good news is that it's fixed and all is good. Now if I can just figure out when to take SS . . .
 
Glad to read a happy ending.

I was also curious about the comment that the Netgear wouldn't work downstream from the Pace. There's no way the Pace should know what's at the other end of that Ethernet cable. Sounds like you don't need it in the current network setup though.
+1. I asked the tech about it, and he said it should work and he even confessed that my Netgear Nighthawk was faster and stronger signal (distance) router than the AT&T gateway. He did say I'd want to shut off the wireless connection on the gateway if I chose to plug in and use my router as they will compete with each other. I think I've read that it's best to use two different addresses if you have two routers, but I haven't explored all that.

But as you say, if everything works well with the AT&T router, I plan to leave my Netgear offline.
 
Getting only 30-50 Mbps on a 300 Mbps connection could very possibly indicate other problems. For example, if it's getting errors forcing data to be retransmitted, it could make web pages very slow to initially load. It could cause reliability problems too. Whether or not you make full use of the capacity, you want to fix whatever is causing it to run much slower than it should.
 
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